Power Kite Forum - LEI's are better after all

LEI's are better after all

Pages: 1 2 3

nwsurfwakeskate - 28-7-2009 at 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
powerzone one of the purpuses of creating this thread was to put some foil riders on LEI's and see the other side...

been there, done that, got the T-shirt and now I'm stuck with a thruster I can't sell....

domdino - 28-7-2009 at 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by nwsurfwakeskate

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
powerzone one of the purpuses of creating this thread was to put some foil riders on LEI's and see the other side...

been there, done that, got the T-shirt and now I'm stuck with a thruster I can't sell....

I like my LEIs but i hate HATE having to try and sell the things unless they are current this years model kites - no one wants them otherwise, that's why i have a graveyard of them in my closet...

bloah - 28-7-2009 at 06:12 PM

domdino if you have any 12's 2007 and up, I will buy some of them... let me know

snobdr - 28-7-2009 at 06:26 PM

Yea what do ya got dom, im always lookin to try other kites.

speleopower - 28-7-2009 at 07:10 PM

Foil are better :thumbup:

It is supposed to be fun discussing which kite is better. Heck I hate Fords and much prefer Honda. Heck my Yamaha Superjet kicks a Kawisaki SXR's butt.

Have fun and argue with a smile cause it don't matter what you like better....except foils rule :wee:

Foils are better:
1)more effiecient
2)no bladders
3)harder to fly well
4)hardly anyone surfs with them
5)easy to launch and land by yourself
6)hold their value better over the years
7)plain 'ol better

I do have an early 2002 North Rhino 6m collectors kite with original lines and bar for $300. Oh the bladders have all been replaced due to them all leaking and one of the new ones leaks as well but that's not a problem. LEI=Leaky Edge Inflatable

I won this kite in a kitesurf competition back in Feb 2002. I was on a 5 meter open cell foil and smoked all the other riders in freestyle, radared speed. I crashed while doing the course race and had to go back around a bouy so I lost that but I was way up in the lead till I wiped out.

Scott

ThePixelGuru - 28-7-2009 at 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by snobdr
Pixel we covered this in another thread but ill break it down. If i were on a bow kite and im ripping along and wipeout, i let go of the bar and the kite falls out of the sky, in essence all of the realitive power is gone. Thats why the say 100%. The kite is still out there still creating drag so some pull exisits.
The test was flawed. They tested at zenith(the least powerful position),no kite sizes were posted(in general a foil will have more power then an equal sized LEI, c kite being the least), the kites were not being flown, they were instead being pulled like a parafoil. no consideration for apparent wind or how fast the kite will fly in given wind. Or to say one kite may fly faster then another kite thus it may produce more power.

Did make me think how to do an accurate test though. Food for another thread.

Well, that's going to be true of any kite with kite killers, and relates a lot more to safety than actual flying characteristics. Saying that a particular kite has a particular power/depower ratio while still flying is a meaningful statistic; saying that any kite can fall out of the sky is not. That's like trying to compare the braking power of two cars by saying that they both sit equally still in the parking lot.

Also, if you're on the ground and 30mph of wind is blowing past you, you get 30mph of apparent wind. If you're in a truck with no local wind going 30mph, you're still getting 30mph of apparent wind. I'm pretty sure the kite doesn't care if the wind speed is generate by a truck or high/low pressure zones, just that air is flowing past it at 30mph. Or do you mean that it was because the kite was parked in 30mph wind rather than actually moving around the window in that same wind?

Do you have a link to that other thread? I'd be interested to read it.

domdino - 28-7-2009 at 10:50 PM

I have a full quiver of 2006 fuels, ocean rodeo 6 10 and 12 which i think i'm gonna keep, an 07 slingshot link and a couple of 2005 rhinos which i like flying every now and then so i'll probably keep them, i'll probably keep all of them to be honest because i like to have them around for friends and i doubt i'll sell them for anything worth my effort packing and shipping them

I love em all i just don't really use them much :D
Tell you what though, if you're ever in southern cali you are welcome to use them

apart from the ocean rodeos i use them all the time

Scudley - 29-7-2009 at 06:07 AM

My fighting kite with glass coated line beats all of them.

csa_deadon - 29-7-2009 at 11:46 AM

My Top of the Line Team kite with 300# Kevlar says "BRING IT! Scudley!!" :lol:

csa_deadon - 29-7-2009 at 11:48 AM

Hmmmm, Wondering if I can find some 1000# kevlar to replace, eehhhhh, I mean as emergency replacement lines for my Scorp.

snobdr - 30-7-2009 at 02:14 PM

WORD

bloah - 31-7-2009 at 08:47 AM

Had discussion with another guy who flies foils, and we compared P4 12 and P2 12 to inflatables and came to uniform conclusion that bowkites and some of the SLE's such as 12 rhino 07 have better low end then foils! Speed 2 12 was the only one better with low end.

So foils are not as efficient after all!

csa_deadon - 31-7-2009 at 08:54 AM

Revolution Blasts are more efficient.:evil:

Just stirring the pot!

snobdr - 31-7-2009 at 09:52 AM

and i though i could have the last word

DenisLaMenace - 31-7-2009 at 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
So foils are not as efficient after all!

I manage to ride upwind with the P4 15m in below 10 knots with the door.

But I admit it is not as easy as with the S2. You gotta get used to it, otherwise you can create too much backstall and this is when the LEI becomes more efficient than the P4.

The P4 takes longer to learn it fly. But once you dial in, it is powerful. Check for FredBGG on foilzone for his videos. This guy is 6'4'' and 225lbs, and the P4 15m is his light wind kite.

And I have also fly this kite in Cuba Varadero this spring in above 20 knots on a small board with ease (trap trim half way only) when other another guy just a bit heavier than me was overpowered on a F-One bandit DOS 14m.

I had the P4 10m, and I also fly a Cabrinha SB4 IDS 12m. As for me, the P4 10m gave me more range (both sides). But the Cab is still a sweet kite to fly too.

bloah - 31-7-2009 at 10:14 AM

Denice
Yeas absolutely you can get some descent low wind from P4's, you just have to be careful not to backstall the kite. Some people compare P4 15 to P2 12 in power wise, do you think it is true? Because real world example I was on P2 12 and spleene door going upwind a guy with monster door and P4 15 couldn't even ride upwind! He was 30 pounds more then I was thought! But still.

FloRider - 31-7-2009 at 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
Denice
Yeas absolutely you can get some descent low wind from P4's, you just have to be careful not to backstall the kite. Some people compare P4 15 to P2 12 in power wise, do you think it is true? Because real world example I was on P2 12 and spleene door going upwind a guy with monster door and P4 15 couldn't even ride upwind! He was 30 pounds more then I was thought! But still.

Perhaps you were just better than he was.

DenisLaMenace - 31-7-2009 at 10:35 AM

Quote:

It's either the guy has no skill, or he does not understand the way to fly the P4 yet.

Even me sometimes, after a long session, I dont get much low end from the P4. Probably more fatigue and less prompt to fly it properly in LW.

Much easier to ride a Pulse2 or Speed2 in light winds. But still doable with some practice for the P4.

The advantage of the P4 is really in medium and strong winds. Turn fast, gugh depower, and jump height. I find easier to jump with this kite.

ThePixelGuru - 31-7-2009 at 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by live2hover
Perhaps you were just better than he was.

Most likely. I see this a lot on paintball forums - someone will say "this person was shooting all day with Marker A and couldn't hit Target X, but I walked over with my Marker B and hit it first try." Of course, they're a different person with different gear shooting different paint - changing every variable and using a sample size of one provides absolutely zero evidence useful for drawing a meaningful conclusion. The only way evidence like that (i.e., empirical data not from an actual scientific test) would provide any useful data would be to get a large enough sample size that the variables like skill and other gear average out, like 100 riders with Kite A not being able to go upwind while 100 riders with Kite B cruise upwind effortlessly.

Anecdotes won't help - for every anecdote the LEI guys come up with to support their side, the foil guys can come up with one that supports their side (and vice versa). As long as we keep using a sample size of one, there are hundreds of compounding variables that could each determine the outcome, so we can't assume that the kite is the only variable that matters.

nwsurfwakeskate - 31-7-2009 at 01:36 PM

ahhh I love it when someone else chimes in and explains design of experiment analysis :D

Pixelguru you are an engineer aren't you.

bloah - 31-7-2009 at 03:57 PM

P4 does jump very nicely! but is not very floaty!

DenisLaMenace - 31-7-2009 at 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
P4 does jump very nicely! but is not very floaty!

may be the speed3 will do it

same height and turn speed as P4
same float as speed2

nwsurfwakeskate - 31-7-2009 at 04:26 PM

I just hope that doesn't translate to ultra high aspect wingtips tucking in gusts :shocked2:

ThePixelGuru - 31-7-2009 at 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by nwsurfwakeskate
ahhh I love it when someone else chimes in and explains design of experiment analysis :D

Pixelguru you are an engineer aren't you.

Nope. Philosophy major.

Okay, okay, I started as an engineer - good guess. I've heard the combination can be deadly. :smilegrin:

domdino - 31-7-2009 at 09:25 PM

It's funny the argument for foils usually stems around light wind, i think the most common kiting wind is probably 15-20mph, like we had today.Lots of people out on the water in socal, all cruising upwind, all having a great time, but i was the only one busting enormous jumps and stupid float on my 15sa... it does have a great low end no doubt, but i think this kite really shines in 15-20mph when everyone else is squeezing out small jumps i'm just going hugeeeee!!!! I did my first heart attack today i was quite happy

nwsurfwakeskate - 31-7-2009 at 10:46 PM

15-20 is my favorite wind range. so forgiving

I suppose if I didn't know about foils i'd hate that light of wind though. all you can really do when its that light is ride a skimboard or do wakestyle on a LEI

tridude - 1-8-2009 at 03:18 PM

cool Dom but remember youve got mad skillz.........................but props to the SAs for jumping...............Nate and I were the only ones out today for a few hours and Nate was jumping on the Arrow..........not huge but decent boosts............................ :lol:

:duh::duh:

bloah - 16-8-2009 at 06:57 PM

bump :wee:

I think 1.5 mod for silver arrow is bad compared to stock for light wind setup and here is why:

Spleene door and 16 meter LEI, I am riding today...
But not on Silver Arrow 17 1.5..... Flies perfect with B2 C1, but doesnt pull....

In retrospect, my original speed 17 pulled way more then 1.5...
Then the kite was just received from powerzone and it still pulled #@%$#!ty....

After playing with bridle all day,,, it seems that the mod itself is the problem..

1.5 starts to pull only in 10 knots,,, but why have it then?

nwsurfwakeskate - 16-8-2009 at 07:39 PM

So that you don't die when the wind picks up :rolleyes:

1.5 mod gives you more top end and faster turning at the expense of losing some low end. So I would say yes your results make sense.

I'm surprised you did the 1.5 mod at all if you weren't concerned with the limited wind range of the SA 17m. I suppose if that's the case and you want more low end you could always go the other direction and convert the 17m SA1.5 into a fixed bridle :roll:

Looks like this dead horse of a thread has been dug up to beat it some more :lol:

bloah - 16-8-2009 at 07:56 PM

that kite is my friends, when we bought originally, we had no idea that 1.5 sucks at low end as everybody on forums way overhyped the mod...

YES it turns faster, flies better and has more depower, but it just wouldn't pull....

And this is not just this kite,,, compared to my past stock version, two of my other friends have 1.5 and they just CANT get the same low end as the original stock version...

nwsurfwakeskate - 16-8-2009 at 08:29 PM

I used to have a SA1.5 I bought it after it had been modded.

i loved that kite and i only went out on it if it was blowing a minimum of 10knots

definitely a great kite for 10-18knots if you're around 190lbs

I sold it because i usually get enough wind to ride smaller kites like 12m and 10m and when you get used to that, puttin' around in light wind with a big slow kite gets kinda boring... At least for me anyway. I'd rather go do some mountain biking or hang out with friends/family.

for those who get long stretches of light wind I could see getting a big kite to keep the addiction going.

bigsteve - 16-8-2009 at 10:14 PM

Bloah, you are the FIRST and only guy I have ever heard that boasts the 1.5 mod was a bad thing. I just sold mine to tridude, and I haven't heard so much excitement out of a guy on a kite in a long time.

Good luck with yer tubes. May the pump be with you.

tridude - 17-8-2009 at 03:22 PM

all I can say there have been at least 4 dayz when the 17m SA was the only kite out..........................once you past the shore break, beach swell its smooth sailing, and jumping too.............................. :thumbup:

bloah - 22-8-2009 at 02:25 PM

bigsteve
My only complain about 1.5 is the reduced low end!

Oh, and btw, 4 or so silver arrow collapsed few days ago due to gusty conditions while tube riders were still riding....

Same yesterday, I was out on 12 meter and spleene door while my friend's new silver arrow collapsed about 5 times due to some gusts.... WHile I was riding and jumping,,,,barely felt them....

Bottom line, 10 knots wind, two people out on 12 meter kites on spleene doors. One new silver arrow 2.5,,, keeps collapsing....

So much for 3300$.....

P.S. I am not trying to bash silver arrow kite,, it is still great kite,,,, but it is not perfect and I am just pointing out the facts....

carltb - 22-8-2009 at 04:23 PM

i thought this thread had died. is this its ghost?

nwsurfwakeskate - 22-8-2009 at 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
bigsteve
My only complain about 1.5 is the reduced low end!

Oh, and btw, 4 or so silver arrow collapsed few days ago due to gusty conditions while tube riders were still riding....

Same yesterday, I was out on 12 meter and spleene door while my friend's new silver arrow collapsed about 5 times due to some gusts.... WHile I was riding and jumping,,,,barely felt them....

Bottom line, 10 knots wind, two people out on 12 meter kites on spleene doors. One new silver arrow 2.5,,, keeps collapsing....

So much for 3300$.....

P.S. I am not trying to bash silver arrow kite,, it is still great kite,,,, but it is not perfect and I am just pointing out the facts....

I see 4 pieces of missing information here.

1. SA2.5 riders weight as well as the weight of the guys cruising on 12m's
2. SA2.5 Tune
3. SA2.5 Size 17m or 19m?
4. pilots skill level and experience with speed 2 kites.

Flysurfer Speed kites are designed for advanced riders. meaning things like collapsing and more likely to happen when you screw up. The Psycho 4 is the same way. its an advanced kite. collapsing is a disadvantage of foils because they don't have the rigid air frame inflatos have. It bothers some people and some don't care or know how to minimize collapsing due to how they fly.

My speed 2 12m almost always collapses on me when I screw up a jump and let the kite get behind me. its fine with me because its expected and I'm almost always able to get it to reopen before it hits the water. I keep the bar in when it reopens and that way it doesn't yard me. if it hits the water I'm usually able to get it to reopen there as well.

I will say to be fair. that I have yet to find a foil that does well in gusty conditions. other then of course the ARC's but even ARC's do not have as much depower as you might need if you suddenly get a gust of 40mph when you're rigged for low-mid 20's

I prefer foils. specifically speed 2's for light smooth summer thermals and SLE's for the crazy storm fronts we get during the rest of the year

airsurfer - 23-8-2009 at 08:28 AM

new to this forum wow a lot of passion here. I think that's great.

LEI's are better? depends on the day and what you like but personally I want a kite with the power performance hangtime and depower of my Speed 2 19 and 12 with the simplicity turning speed and friendliness of my 08 Waroo 11 on AA setting. Untill then I guess I'll just have to bring them all to the beach. Could be worse problems there are a lot of great kites out there especially when I look at my first kite a 2 line Wipika 5.0 I just wish I was a better rider after 10 years of kiteboarding.

More wind is better - I really like my Cab SB8 but only get to break it out a few times each year. For the crappy winds we get here in Miami especially during the summer the SA19 keeps me satisfied.

bloah - 23-8-2009 at 08:31 AM

Speed'2 for thermal winds are amazing....
The person on Speed 2.5 19 meter with one year skill at 180 pounds, the person on 12 SLE was 185 pounds and spleene door!

tridude - 23-8-2009 at 05:30 PM

Ive never seen a 12m inflato fly in 10 knots.........Ive seen one try...............again today the 12m Pulse 2, 10m Pulse were first on the water..................10 to 12 knots..............winds came up and got a bit punchy...........the P2/Pulses rocked......I was getting futther upwind than lets see..........North, OR, JL, SS...............and I have witnesses....................this thread can go back and fotth so lets agree to fly what you like and fly it well...................... :lol:

:duh::duh:

clintopher - 23-8-2009 at 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by nwsurfwakeskate

Quote:

Just a tip if you don't know it already...with the speeds, when you blow it and the kite gets flukey and loses it's shape, grab one of the rear lines as far up as you can and pull it in. It really helps avoid the kite collapsing in half or worse, ending up in a bow tie.

snobdr - 23-8-2009 at 08:14 PM

Lol

csa_deadon - 24-8-2009 at 01:15 AM

Really if you think about it, both the foil and LEI are inefficient designs.

I find that the larger Cody kites are better at boarding and buggy. :crazy:

The lift is crazy when you reach for a cody wit a span of 40 feet.

nwsurfwakeskate - 24-8-2009 at 09:10 AM

I had to google cody kites to see what you were talking about. its seems crazy that the military used to use them to lift guys in the air off of battle ships to see the enemy.

bloah - 23-9-2009 at 11:37 AM

OK
I kinda miss foils, thinking of buying back my P4

ragden - 23-9-2009 at 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
OK
I kinda miss foils, thinking of buying back my P4

Yer kidding, right?
If you aren't, what made you want to go back to foils? Just curious...

nwsurfwakeskate - 23-9-2009 at 11:43 AM

this week on, days of our lives

yeah I'd like to know as well considering I've been kicking around the idea of a bigger inflato for practicing wakestyle on the lighter days.

BeamerBob - 23-9-2009 at 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
OK
I kinda miss foils, thinking of buying back my P4

This reminds me of the weekend update skits on Saturday Night Live back in the late 70's with Gilda Radner.

DenisLaMenace - 23-9-2009 at 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
OK
I kinda miss foils, thinking of buying back my P4

stay tuned :singing::singing::singing:

bloah - 23-9-2009 at 02:20 PM

well, really tired of pumping,,, and still to this date, my biggest jumps were on psycho 4,,, just cant achieve the same height on inflatos....

not selling my LEI's, just have extra 1000$ to spend, so thought maybe a kite, a foil....

stay tuned indeed

snobdr - 23-9-2009 at 02:25 PM

Foils jump so good yet no one has ever won a PKRA event on one?

Hmmmmm

nwsurfwakeskate - 23-9-2009 at 02:38 PM

snobdr. Do you ever think before you speak?

"jumping good" is only 1 tiny component of PKRA events. I do not know for sure but I would guess it isn't really ranked that highly either since going big and dangling for awhile doesn't take much skill.

mega kiteloops are more competitive but wakestyle is really where the competition is at. Notice how Aaron Hadlow rarely goes big but he throws in tons of fast off axis technical rotations, grabs, handle passes and inverts. there is no point in riding a foil for that style of riding.

FYI Big dangle loses style points in wakestyle riding

nwsurfwakeskate - 23-9-2009 at 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
well, really tired of pumping,,, and still to this date, my biggest jumps were on psycho 4,,, just cant achieve the same height on inflatos....

not selling my LEI's, just have extra 1000$ to spend, so thought maybe a kite, a foil....

stay tuned indeed

yeah I've been finding on the 9.5m Kahoona that the technique is totally different.

Ride as fast as possible. like you feel a little bit insane because you're going so fast.

Ride downwind for 1-2 seconds while keeping the kite at around 2 o'clock. then all at once send it hard and load and pop as hard as you can.

it helps if you can time it with a wave as your launch ramp.

oh yeah. don't look at the kite either that rotates your hips down wind and so you don't load and pop as well.

send the kite back to 11-10 ish and then bring it back to 12 for float and then back down infront of you. land pointing downwind with speed and ride away.

I have yet to try this but try doing a downloop from 12 on your landing too. looks cool and helps the landing out quite a bit.

DenisLaMenace - 23-9-2009 at 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
well, really tired of pumping,,, and still to this date, my biggest jumps were on psycho 4,,, just cant achieve the same height on inflatos....

some tube jumps higher than what you currently have in your quiver

even if I got high jumps with the P4 10m, my biggest so far have been on the Cabrinha SB4 12m or North Rebel 11m.

but not pumping is a big +

domdino - 23-9-2009 at 04:11 PM

Slingshot fuel jumps pretty bloody high like most C kites, but i agree that flysurfers go big much easier than tubes and definitely jump higher than all the bows i've tried - I love how my ocean rodeo jumps though. Still my biggest jump to date was on a waroo 07, but that was just a freak moment.
I'm just more comfortable going big on flysurfers for some reason, think i'm just comfortable with them after using them so long

ragden - 23-9-2009 at 05:11 PM

I totally understand the lack of desire to pump up LEI kites... Thats one of my major gripes about flying my 11m TD2. I hate pumping it up. That and my only successful jumps in the water so far have been when borrowing a friends P4 12m. Jump was accidental, but it was big, floaty, and landed perfectly. Still havent figured out how to get the same kind of jump with the TD2. I understand what to do, but you have to load up hard and send it really hard to get the same vertical out of it... Or so I've been told...

Maybe I'll get some practice in this weekend....

bloah - 29-9-2009 at 03:50 PM

alright, had my biggest 20 feet + jumps on my 12 this saturday.... 20 knots of wind... load and pop and up I went...

otherwise this week was crazy in Ontario,,,, 30-to 50 knots winds.... and by 50, i mean sustained! 5 meter kite was to much, so people were actually sitting on a beach waiting for wind to die down!!!

PBKiteboarding - 29-9-2009 at 09:47 PM

I was out Monday afternoon in Toronto Ontario lit on my 7m Ozone Instinct Sport SLE for about 3hrs having a blast.. till the wind died down and rain... Doing Megaloops and big boosts... waves... Worked well for that...

But many days here in summer many -10 or 8kts and lulls that drop inflatables -6kts even just on the beach, can stay upwing are just a pain in lights tuff... and pumping... after the years.

Inflatable have to be heavier on the LE and struts for strength (Weight) to hold pressure and more weight for the bladders.

Not only that they are front heavy, where foils weight is less especially the FS Deluxe and the weight is distributed more evenly from front to back way better for lulls...

So many days on the Speed 2and 3 19m Remembering one of the many cruising days only for 19's:

This wind, no one else can kite 6-8kts. That's why there is no one around except an SA2 19m an SP3.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwUFuEmrPVU

I used to drive all over the place to trying to get an extra 2 knots for my LEI's (before Flysurfer).. now I just mostly stick around and get the smoothest winds (warm fronts), best directions and sunniest days 5 minutes from home.

Sold my Speed 2 12m to get the 3 and missing it... now waiting for my SP3 12 Deluxe... I find something magical about riding a 12m Speed most powerful depower kite for it's size and now as Deluxe Edition coming, the Lightest... Gets you back when wind drops...

I fly LEI in small sizes and foils in Summer as it gets lighter... progress on both... and all Foils in winter.

Another Great thing about the 19m is to be powered in lighter winds when it's cooler out cuts down on wind chill and typically sunnier do to high pressure makes for some more sweeter days....

Great to have all these choices with all types off kites many never had back a ways... Having a mid size 13m LEI and a 12m Foil in the car, having the choice... some days I may pick one over the other... but never big inflatable anymore... Lulls and low end just don't work for it...

So far there are no inflatables here that beat the 19m Speed upwind, tricks or jumps in the light stuff.

Many days LEI can't even launch (with Doming winds) off the beach while I'm kiting upwind.

Here: I'm on the 19m Speed 2: Yellow kite is a 21m C Kite, White 16m SLE other yellow 15m SLE.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHDO-eezRak

I feel we are lucky to choose what we like when we want... and have all those manufacturers offering choices... Bet some others do too... Kite On...!

bloah - 3-10-2009 at 07:04 PM

Paul,
I totaly agree for low wind Flysurfers are the best,,, hopefully this summer will pick one up from you!

12 meter foils are good, especially pulse 2! P4 was a bit of dissappointment as it backstalls a lot, especially in waves!

Hopefuly speed 3 is not going to have thas issue!

Anything smaller then 12, imo, you definetely need an inflateble in Ontario!

the other thing, foils are not good in rain conditions, as they get so heavy and start stalling like crazy, inflatables are a bit better. Was out on friday for 3 hours with 10 LeI in rain and it was a blast!

PBKiteboarding - 3-10-2009 at 09:52 PM

I would go smaller than a 12m... Like 8m Pulse... I just don't have one and have so many kite... once they get bigger.... no pumping, no line set up is hard to pass up...

I could ride it fine in waves on an 8m... If I can ride the 19m in waves... I'll borrow Marcs one day... Just no one as ever seen me on a foil smaller than a 12m... in summer but have the 4m 7m in winter...

Also not just low wind... You'll see me whipping by LEI... on the SP2 12m, been doing that when guys are on 14m LEI's and SP3 12m DE soon. Higher jumps too...

Doesn't mean it does work here... But that's what did with the other size 19m 12m many used to think they were just back and forth kites...
But not any more... Because they can see it... Many times LEI guys aren't even kiting. They're on the beach waiting...
Same thing happened in winter here many though only LEI could do tricks here.. But that's changed too...

You'll be seeing more Flysurfers around for sure...

Quote:

Hopefuly speed 3 is not going to have thas issue!

Already been on the SP3 19m many days since Italy Aug 24.... First one in Canada and now sold several, more coming in presold. Sweet kite no Backstall same low end, faster turning, easier relaunch. I can ride it upwind unhooked... Riding waves at Woobine unhooked....

First days I pass on the kiting in the rain for the better sunnier days. Still doing tricks even backroll kiteloops in 6-8knts... Flatter water makes it easier to learn tricks I find...
But will still do a rainy day if it's really windy... more fun...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3D4YoIH0Hc

Also sweet cruising at Woodbine Beach, so many days even in a City of 2.5mil, no kiteboarding crowds when only the 19m work. It is nice to have such a good size beach too...
Summer was so much fun on the Flysurfers I look forward to it and used to hate lightwind summers with my 19.5 and 22.5 LEI's... so frustrating..

This is fun Cherry...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwUFuEmrPVU&feature=chann...

Double or triples kiting days. More kiting is more learning and advancing I find... That's one of the things Flysurfers do.
They also give more float to help complete tricks.

I learned Darkside Slide on my 12m... Floaty...
And practicing pop when I'd usually be underpower on my LEI...

Even for guys that want to just stay upwind and not have LEI's dropping like this... He's getting an SP3 19m... Would die if he couldn't have his 19m.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxzPNgS5rs4

Here's a good vid from Italy... So many good Flysurfer Riders...

http://vimeo.com/6906182

1:08 I'm doing the Darkside here. Learned it on the SP2 12m then on the 7m Sport later (Harder)

2:03 Front Roll Downloop SP15m SE

2:13 Some good Pop and getting some height since the 15 has some good power....

Much of advancing is riding powered and some sustained power for tricks like toeside backrolls and Riding blind to backrolls... So FLysurfers really help me.

So for me they help allot... But that's me... I just wouldn't want someone to miss out on what I know of the kites and am actually doing with them...
And see the others in the vids... Wild fun...
I know I ride what I want.. Priceless... Never been influenced much...

Just sold my SP2 12m and was missing it waiting for my SP3 12m DE... soon.. but just sold that before it even gets her to a customer...
So I have to wait for the next 12m DE...

So try out the SP3 one day... to see... and keep me updated...
Man it's just fun to have all those designers working on all these kites for us to have fun on!!

So freedom is good either way... They are all kites and we are all having fun! I remind myself to keep open minded... That's why I keep trying new kites... I want to keep hitting my personal Kite Jack Pot... along the way like you have found in LEI's... We have to play to win...

Again, thinking we don't want a foil lover to miss out on Foils or LEI's just from reading forums... only... or just to much influenced by what other riders are using...

PBKiteboarding - 4-10-2009 at 07:45 AM

[EDIT] comments removed by author

bloah - 23-1-2010 at 10:51 PM

now I am thinking to buy or not to buy silver arrow 2 19m,,,

DenisLaMenace - 24-1-2010 at 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bloah
now I am thinking to buy or not to buy silver arrow 2 19m,,,

bloah

with all respect for everyone about their preferences (LEI, depower foils, ARCS, fixed bridles, NASA wings, paraskiflex, etc...),

ALL types of kites have pros and cons, and they ALL good for someone where there is a fit with their type of riding

I ride both LEI and flysurfers, and one thing for sure, the SA2 19m has not found a competitor in my heart for LIGHT WINDS conditions and also for medium winds (up to 15 knots) with a small board for BIG air and HANGTIME

If you feel it, GO FOR ONE

Because your not too far from Toronto, I'd ask Paul for trying a S3 too

cheers

bloah - 24-1-2010 at 01:12 PM

denice you are absolutely right,
without a doubt in my mind, silver arrow class kites are the best in their category...
suppose going to get one

tridude - 24-1-2010 at 06:13 PM

welcome back Yuri................................... :smilegrin:

bloah - 24-1-2010 at 06:34 PM

After only foils, than both lei's and foils, only lei's and than again lei's and foils I discovered that the kites are just different....

If I were reach I would prefer to have both foils and LEI's, for different conditions...

power - 24-1-2010 at 09:15 PM

I love my LEI's, but I have to hand it to foils, ragden was buggying (and actually had some decent speed) in probably 3-4knots with his speed3 15m deluxe. I'll have to see how some of the bigger LEI's work in lower winds.

Kamikuza - 24-1-2010 at 09:48 PM

bloah - once you bought 'em, doesn't cost anything to keep 'em :smilegrin:

FloRider - 24-1-2010 at 09:59 PM

I saw this post re-emerge after months and got worried for a second. It seems to have calmed down a bit, and it's good to see you back Bloah. A very nice conclusion you've come to

Quote:

Originally posted by Kamikuza
bloah - once you bought 'em, doesn't cost anything to keep 'em :smilegrin:

nice Kami, that must be why you keep buying em?

Kamikuza - 24-1-2010 at 10:57 PM

Given the exchange rate etc I can't afford to miss out :lol:

it'll be good to have a stash for when the leaner times comes and I can't buy stuff ...
I'll be keeping my eye out for FlySurfers soon too ... be nice to have a couple of them to play with :D

Pages: 1 2 3