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Nasa Star 3

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soliver - 12-5-2015 at 07:14 PM

I understand what you mean, Thanks... Planning a good beach sesh Thursday, tandem and all... I'll try to have the Gopros rolling!!!

ssayre - 13-5-2015 at 05:32 AM

Spencer, did you and Jason have a chance to fly each other's nasa stars to compare?

soliver - 13-5-2015 at 07:36 AM

No, the only days where flying my Nasas was a possibility, we ended up on different ends of the beach.

soliver - 13-5-2015 at 08:33 PM

Another sunset light wind session this evening... Nearly perfect onshore wind at probably 7-9 mph. Really got a chance to do the 7m NS3 proud.... I was getting the hang of the turns as it was getting just a little too late... packed and walked home in the dark.

Placed my order for the 4m too!!!

ssayre - 14-5-2015 at 05:04 AM

Glad you had some wind. I can only imagine a sunset session on the beach. Turns are normal as long as you have some wind.

soliver - 14-5-2015 at 08:46 PM

HOLY KATZ!!!! An absolutely OUTSTANDING sunset session this evening!!! The wind was just a degree north of directly on shore and in the 13-16 mph range. I put up the 5m NS3 after battling a bad tangle in the lines and ripped around on the beach swinging the back end all over the place and running hard until it was almost too dark to see to pack up. I didn't have the GPS on but I had to be hitting at least 20mph ... then the wind gave me a really hard time packing up and I really had a walk back in the pitch black.

Absolutely THE most stable kite I've ever flown and REALLY delivered on power and speed... IN-FREEKIN-CREDIBLE!!!

soliver - 15-5-2015 at 08:32 PM

4m officially ordered :smilegrin:

3shot - 16-5-2015 at 06:27 AM

Spencer, did you OBE with the Star on St. Simons?

Friday and Saturday at JIBE would have been epic if I only had the 10m Nasa Star.

soliver - 16-5-2015 at 07:19 AM

Truly they would have... No, I OBE'd with my 4m Core... I got stuck in the soft sand then yanked right over the rail trying to break free with some downloops

soliver - 29-5-2015 at 03:52 PM

Holy Schniekies!!!! I've been so busy since I got home that I forgot that my 4m arrived today!!!!.... Once I'm done putting the kiddos to bed, I'll go check it out and post a pic!

3shot - 29-5-2015 at 04:35 PM

Sweet!!!

Windstruck - 30-5-2015 at 02:56 PM

Gentleman,

You guys are infectious! I've been vicariously living the vida nasa for a while now through your posts and great videos. Broke down today and ordered two NS3's: 2.5 and 8.5 with their three line set. I've got what I think will be a good bar set up for them already from my old Prism Tensor which I will rig with a harness strap. I'm super stoked to get these after all the gushing you all have been doing about them! I am happy with my PL Hornet 4 and 6 in my mid-range so these two NS3's will hopefully round out my buggy quiver at the low and high ends.

From your posts I know to expect some lag in customs, etc. but hopefully I'll be a proud papa in about a month. Can't wait!

ssayre - 30-5-2015 at 04:11 PM

Great! Another member of the nasa star club. They are great buggy engines.

soliver - 30-5-2015 at 05:06 PM

ok guy... we need to start a team... Nasa Star Team riders USA... awesome

Welcome to the Nasa Star fold!!!!

dangerdan - 31-5-2015 at 09:21 AM

As some may remember I sold my NASA 3 to a friend because of the way it flew on handles.

It turns out I was the problem. The NASA 3 has to be flown like a REV on handles and I lacked the skills to do that even though I can fly a REV.

Within the hour my friend managed to tweak the kite so that it flew the same as in the videos that John posted.
If I remember correctly we got rid of the Z bridle and shortened the brake line.
So if anyone has problems flying the NASA 3 on handles, DONT blame the kite. :D:D

soliver - 31-5-2015 at 02:32 PM

finally got around to unpacking the new 4m this morning... l like the color on this one!!!

Windstruck - 31-5-2015 at 02:47 PM

soliver - time to update that auto-signature... 4M en route no more! Very happy for you. Now get out and fly that thing!!

soliver - 31-5-2015 at 03:07 PM

AH... too true!!! thanx

3shot - 31-5-2015 at 04:05 PM

Looking bud. I really want a 10m.

soliver - 31-5-2015 at 08:15 PM

yea... me too.

ssayre - 1-6-2015 at 04:00 AM

That is a very nice looking kite. Still no 10 meter for me yet either

soliver - 5-6-2015 at 04:25 PM

Well, I'm probably not all that likely to do any kiting for a little while with the summer coming in (man I wish I had a 10m)... Any who... I've been thinking about it and am curious what the status is on the competition. I know there have been a number of technical issues getting in the way and all, but we haven't heard anything in a while.

No worries, just curious,... John?

bobalooie57 - 5-6-2015 at 04:33 PM

I know you guys like your NASA Stars and all, but you could probably get km4 to make you a 10M that would fly great, last a long time, and be made in the good ol' USA, so no customs to clear, get to you as fast as she could get er done. Probably for less $$$$ than the 10M NS3!

EDIT: You can get it in a custom color, and I paid less for my 12M than the 10M NS3's listed kite only price! I hope I'm not over-stepping my bounds here Susan, but these guys don't know what they are missing!

John Holgate - 5-6-2015 at 05:03 PM

Quote:

I know there have been a number of technical issues getting in the way and all, but we haven't heard anything in a while.

No worries, just curious,... John?

I feel I must apologize for this - it's been way, way, way longer than I was told it would be and I'm embarrassed by the whole episode. It 'should' be all up and running by the end of this weekend, so keep your fingers crossed but please, nobody hold their collective breath! Servers and software are all good to go but there's a heck of a lot of info to be transferred and converted to new software. If you see that the XK site is down, you'll know what's happening. :thumbup:

soliver - 5-6-2015 at 05:25 PM

Cool, thanks John... I've really been enjoying XK and appreciate the guys over there just as much as the guys here.

@ bobalooie, you know, I may have to give that some consideration... thanks for the word... but I still need the $$$ :smilegrin:

bobalooie57 - 5-6-2015 at 05:53 PM

Just a thought. I know I have not been disappointed, but I also know the value of getting used to a style of kite, and those NS3's are pretty sweet! Scrimp and save! But of course, you know that! Put up a swear jar, and make other folks pay for it!

kitemaker4 - 5-6-2015 at 07:19 PM

Well, I am still here flying and building my npw9 kites and very content flying them. Thanks for mentioning me. Since the nasa stars are the new kite on the block the npw9 is taking a back seat for now.

Susan (npw goddess)

Quote: Originally posted by bobalooie57

I know you guys like your NASA Stars and all, but you could probably get km4 to make you a 10M that would fly great, last a long time, and be made in the good ol' USA, so no customs to clear, get to you as fast as she could get er done. Probably for less $$$$ than the 10M NS3!

EDIT: You can get it in a custom color, and I paid less for my 12M than the 10M NS3's listed kite only price! I hope I'm not over-stepping my bounds here Susan, but these guys don't know what they are missing!

ssayre - 6-6-2015 at 09:23 AM

Susan, I've got one of your wings on the way from another member. Super pumped to thoroughly test it. I have no doubt that I will like it. I have talked to others and for me the main thing that pushed me to get stars is all of the videos you can find on the stars. John Holgate's and steffen's videos are excellent for explaining all of the various capabilities and different control gear. Monkey see monkey do. I saw John's videos and said "Hey, I want to do that". Anyways, been thinking about one for awhile and am looking forward to testing it on board buggy grass asphalt 2 line 4 line bar handles short line no line long line

Man, I'm going to be busy for awhile :D

kitemaker4 - 6-6-2015 at 12:16 PM

Let me know what you think after trying out.

Susan (npw goddess)

soliver - 7-6-2015 at 03:50 PM

I'm interested to hear what you think too Sean... this might be a good option for a 10m!

Susan, send me a U2U and tell me what you charge for a 10m, just as a frame of reference.

kitemaker4 - 7-6-2015 at 07:30 PM

Will do Soliver tomorrow.

Susan (npw goddess)

John Holgate - 8-6-2015 at 05:21 PM

Nasa Star 3 competition now up and running. Check the thread under Kites, Lines and Accessories for details. Best of luck to all :thumbup:

ssayre - 29-6-2015 at 09:57 AM

How is DHL so slow with the born kites? I'm getting a kite shipped from Redsky from UK and it shipped Wednesday and is already in the states and scheduled to be delivered by this Wednesday. 1 Week. Makes me wonder if I had a Born-Kite shipped to the UK then the states, if that would shave a couple weeks off??

John Holgate - 29-6-2015 at 03:24 PM

DHL completely lost my last package of NS3's. Should have arrived by end of March. Never seen 'em. Poo.

soliver - 3-7-2015 at 09:30 PM

Did a bit of buggying with the NS3's today... Shotty wind but workable. I started with the 4m and got moving, but had to trade up for the 5.5m and had some good runs. By the time I left, I should've had the 7m out but didn't have the time to switch it out... I'm anxious to get some better sessions in the fall hopefully, but classes start soon.

ssayre - 4-7-2015 at 04:31 AM

Glad you got a ride in. I've only had one buggy session this summer. Fields are either too wet or I'm working. wind was 8ish yesterday and forecast to be 2mph today and tomorrow unfortunately.

BigMikesKites - 4-7-2015 at 05:57 AM

The Nasa Star 3 kites will be available with me in a few weeks

3shot - 4-7-2015 at 06:10 AM

Great news Mike!!!

soliver - 4-7-2015 at 06:17 AM

COOL!!!

US vendor... whoop whoop!!!!

3shot - 4-7-2015 at 07:53 AM

I'm hoping to pick up an Ultra Star when they debut. Should be any day now I hope.

Devoted - 5-7-2015 at 05:52 AM

Cheers for Big Mike. Im am interested in a big one and the shipping hussle kinda got me off so far. Not everybody got the kite so far. So im kinda hesitating toborder one from born kites.

Way to go.

Randy - 5-7-2015 at 06:30 AM

That is a great development. No more waiting for mysterious postal delays. Somehow it seems easier to get stuff directly from China than from Germany.....

soliver - 5-7-2015 at 04:47 PM

When do you expect to have them on your site Mike?

BigMikesKites - 6-7-2015 at 03:33 AM

They are on my site. Pricing is a guestimate. They don't have US pricing yet since I am the first. I don't want this to be a fluxuation with the $ vs Euro thing but it might have to be. Once I get the final bill, I can finalize the pricing.
http://www.bigmikeskites.com/BornKites/nasastar3.html

Everything on the page is coming in. I know there are other sizes and styles, but I got to recoup some of this before I can expand the inventory. If there is something missing you want, email me about it and I will make sure its on the next order.

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 04:18 AM

I think it's great we have a US distributor, but the price of the "depower bar" is a buzz kill. Not saying Mike's price is unfair but I am saying that would cause some to shy away from trying these great kites. I will work on an actual DIY version using an hq bar which is exactly what they are. I would hate it if that kept people from trying these out.

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 04:52 AM

For anyone interested in these and if you have some spare parts laying around. The depower function is pretty much worthless used as variable depower IMO. All that is needed is to be able to use the third line as a safety. If you want to make your own, you need a 3 line trainer bar and you have to make sure to replace the center line so you have a 47" difference (center being longer) than the outside leaders. Then you have to position the stopper in a position to make sure it depowers the kite. If anyone has any questions, let me know. Love me or hate me, Everything I say if for the love of these kites

Windstruck - 6-7-2015 at 05:31 AM

Sean - I don't have my NS3's yet (should get them this week!) but when I ordered mine Stefan sent me an email with links to various videos. For the NS2's one of the videos said to make the center line adjustment different for each kite. The link below is the video I'm referring to (the important stuff occurring between the 2:00 - 3:00 minute marks or thereabout). Not sure if this holds true in V-3.0, but I thought I'd share.

https://youtu.be/OG5XnQqcV8Y

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 06:16 AM

Yes, I've seen that. I believe the purpose of the different measurements is (when the safety is fired) to depower the kite without turning it inside out. In my experience, I keep the adjuster at the same spot for all sizes but use 2 different knots on the center line for the adjustment instead of moving the adjuster itself. The only ill effects of turning the kite inside out is you can end up with bridle tangles that makes it harder to reset. I very rarely hit the safety anymore so I don't concern myself with fiddle farting around with the center line adjustments anymore than I have to.

Windstruck - 6-7-2015 at 06:26 AM

Sean - makes absolute sense; thanks for the clarification. As I said, I've yet to fly one of these beauties. I just checked my DHL - USPS tracker and I may get my kites today! Winds may kick up to a whopping 12-14 knots later this afternoon, so I'll hopefully give them a whirl, setting the bar up with the 47" differential as you noted.

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 07:49 AM

That's great Steve. A couple tips since your used to depower and when these are used hooked in you can't let the bar out to dump power. To speed check you an s turn to fishtail to scrub speed and power. Also, my bar came with 2 knots on the center line and were at the right distances so I didn't make any modifications. I had measured the distance so I could make other bars.

Windstruck - 6-7-2015 at 01:53 PM

Not that we needed another reason to do business with Big Mike, but here is a photo of the box I got today from Born-Kites sent from Germany! Stuff inside is fine, but I thought the Bulgarian Kickboxing Team might have used my package as a kick-sparring bag while it was on route! :o

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 02:22 PM

Dhl blows. At least it made it.

3shot - 6-7-2015 at 02:46 PM

Mine looked like that package Ace Ventura kicked down the hall in Pet Detective... :lol:

Nothing against Born. Just that's a lot miles for a piece of cardboard. Plus US customs half assed my box back together after the rummage...

Can't wait to give Mike my cash!!!

soliver - 6-7-2015 at 04:43 PM

I've not had as much trouble with DHL as you guys... My last kite made it here super fast. Its just a combination of lots of travel, lots of handling and of course our glorious imperial government's custom's dept. I've had plenty of kites delivered from in the country with boxes that look similar.... but having the stuff arrive faster from a US vendor will make a big difference IMHO...

However I notice that Mike is only carrying through the 7m size, so I'm guessing anything bigger will require a special order and more wait :no:

Steve, one thing I figured out at my last session that really worked well for me getting moving was to get the kite in the air and up in Zenith with the chicken loop hooked in, and if it starts to pull really hard just pull the little yellow ball to depower the kite a little to get yourself situated on the bug... once you let go of the yellow ball the kite will power back up and you can get moving. The 5.5m is really a dream in the 13-14mph range. Their window is a little smaller than other kites, but they have great power just about everywhere in that window.

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 04:49 PM

Quote: Originally posted by soliver

The 5.5m is really a dream in the 13-14mph range. Their window is a little smaller than other kites, but they have great power just about everywhere in that window.

Yes yes keep talking, I'm getting excited for the next buggy session just thinking about it. :D

soliver - 6-7-2015 at 05:14 PM

BAH!!!!! You don't have to brag!!! I have to go like a month or more between sessions :no:

ssayre - 6-7-2015 at 05:31 PM

Quote: Originally posted by soliver

BAH!!!!! You don't have to brag!!! I have to go like a month or more between sessions :no:

Actually, I've only had one decent buggy session since spring started. I was focused on longboard for awhile and I've been wanting to buggy for over a month and time off and wind and dry field haven't lined up.

John Holgate - 7-7-2015 at 03:46 AM

Quote:

Stuff inside is fine, but I thought the Bulgarian Kickboxing Team might have used my package as a kick-sparring bag while it was on route! :o

Might be worth sending that pic to Steffen if you haven't already. If enough people are having bad experiences with DHL, he may be able to find another alternative.

Windstruck - 7-7-2015 at 06:06 AM

@ John Holgate - I'm happy to do so if you think it is important. As noted by 3shot above, this is in no way a reflection on Born or Steffan personally. The box had all sorts of tape around it and the kites themselves each came in their own stout backpack so it would have been pretty challenging to hurt them and they were 100% fine. The box, not so much!

Hard to know where the problem lies, being as the package would have originated with DHL in Germany, gone through US customs in Jersey City, and then finished its journey across country via USPS out to Utah.

With a US distributor now with Big Mike this issue for us stateside folks may have gone away. The packaging I've gotten from Mike has been top rate and in good shape upon arrival.

ssayre - 7-7-2015 at 06:22 AM

"With a US distributor now with Big Mike this issue for us stateside folks may have gone away. The packaging I've gotten from Mike has been top rate and in good shape upon arrival."

Yes Mike's great to deal with. Hopefully they sell well and he will bring in the larger sizes and upcoming varieties.

3shot - 7-7-2015 at 11:39 AM

ULTRA STARS!!!!!!!

soliver - 7-7-2015 at 04:31 PM

What are you trying to say, Jason?... is there something you are excited about or interested in? :lol:

John Holgate - 8-7-2015 at 03:23 AM

Quote:

@ John Holgate - I'm happy to do so if you think it is important

If it was me sending stuff out, I'd be pretty disappointed to see it arriving in that condition and I think I would be talking to my postal service or looking at options. I don't know if Steffen has any postal options and it may be good for him to know that it's arrived undamaged despite the postal handling.

There was a report on our national news recently where someone had filmed one of our more well known courier services delivering parcels by throwing them out of the truck onto the road before stacking them on a trolley and wheeling them into the building. It was very embarrassing to the courier service who, hopefully, lifted their game.

Windstruck - 8-7-2015 at 05:53 AM

John - you pushed me over the edge (in a good way). I will email Steffan today. If there is some relevant back and forth between us I will share in this thread.

Windstruck - 9-7-2015 at 05:44 AM

I had emailed Steffan about the beat up package I received and he sent me some interesting instructions for quickly folding up STARS that I thought fellow enthusiasts would like to see.

Copied from his email:

A little trick, as you can quickly fold the NS3.
1. Remove the bar.
2. Fasten the bridle lines on the transport loops on the kite.
3. Grab the kite at the nose right and left.
4. Stand up to the wind with her back
5. With a quick bow movement hands inwards and the wingtips fold inward.
6. When folding the tips, squat. On the floor then fold.
The more wind, the better it works.

Here you can see the procedure.
See minute 2:28 to 2:35
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwIHBPLhFGc

See minute 2:43 to 2:47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvRc08IvJo0

Best greetings from Germany and continue fun with the NS3`s,

Steffen

3shot - 10-7-2015 at 10:29 AM

Yes Spencer. They "may" be a more economical option over the Peak (No disrespect to Flysurfer. The Peaks are a bad@$$ kite!!). All my Born kites are of excellent build quality. I'm sure the Ultra will please ..

Windstruck - 10-7-2015 at 11:48 AM

It's super early in my ownership of Born kites of any variety or size, but one small thing I noticed right away and really appreciated are the three little lines that come off the leading edge for attaching the three bridle sections to. What a simple and elegant solution! Nicer than the little Velcro strip found on PL kites for the same purpose IMHO.

ssayre - 10-7-2015 at 03:11 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Windstruck

It's super early in my ownership of Born kites of any variety or size, but one small thing I noticed right away and really appreciated are the three little lines that come off the leading edge for attaching the three bridle sections to. What a simple and elegant solution! Nicer than the little Velcro strip found on PL kites for the same purpose IMHO.

Also, one of my favorite features. It's always the little things in life

3shot - 10-7-2015 at 05:44 PM

Did I say I friggin love Born kites????

soliver - 10-7-2015 at 05:49 PM

ditto kiddo

ssayre - 10-7-2015 at 06:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 3shot

Did I say I friggin love Born kites????

Hell yeah! We've got quite born-kite posse going. It's interesting Steve won the competition. I was almost certain someone would win that had never flown one. Cool

Windstruck - 11-7-2015 at 01:39 AM

Better lucky than good Sean, better lucky than good. :P

Gots to gets me an Ultra Star to fill the "gaping" hole in my NASA quiver between my NS3 4 and 8.5 M beauties.

ssayre - 15-7-2015 at 03:33 AM

These are stills from one of Steffen's latest videos. I wonder when this new variety of streetkite bar will be for sale. It looks like it has nose depower and a one side flag out system.

soliver - 15-7-2015 at 05:27 PM

HMMMM... looks cool.

I've been having a few good static sessions lately... anyone else have trouble getting good scuds out of your Nasa Stars?... I can't seem to get a decent scud with them... Just on the beach in the absolute perfect conditions... THAT was awesome (HUGE ruts in the soft sand).

Really finding the usefulness of the little yellow ball too. Last buggy session I found that since like the PL Arcs, these kites will practically auto zenith, if you get the kite up over head while you make way toward your bug... give the little yellow ball a pull to depower a little to make it easier to sit down then let go and get moving... very nice feature when used this way.

3shot - 15-7-2015 at 06:47 PM

Agreed Spencer!

ssayre - 16-7-2015 at 04:33 AM

We have had so much rain, I've forgotten how to kite buggy, let alone use the yellow ball.

soliver - 16-7-2015 at 07:49 AM

LOL... how about scuds for you Sean,... do you get good scuds out of your NS2's?

ssayre - 16-7-2015 at 08:04 AM

I haven't tried scudding much with them. You really need that fast power surge that you get with a foil.

soliver - 16-7-2015 at 05:04 PM

Yeah, that makes sense... they scud great on the beach, but not so much on the grass.

Windstruck - 16-7-2015 at 05:10 PM

John does a great scud in the beginning of this video about the NS3:

http://youtu.be/w11uM4yxieo

I love living where I do, but man it looks fun to kite on a beach! Clean wind is something I only get to dream about.

John Holgate - 16-7-2015 at 11:46 PM

Quote:

You really need that fast power surge that you get with a foil.

Baloney!! You just need power and I happen to think that power delivered slowly is betterer. I've stopped trying to scud on grass because of the inconsistencies and fear of a fubar ankle. But on the sand, you can scud a lo o o o o o o o o o o o o n g way.

Please see exhibit A at 3.20 on this video...

ssayre - 17-7-2015 at 03:25 AM

Ok, ok, I must admit I haven't tried too hard to scud with them. I'm usually on dry thick grass that generally does need a good hard sudden yank to break my traction and slide. Normally I goto my butt anymore rather than try to remain standing to save knees / ankles. Also, if I have the nasa stars out, then normally I'm moving on either buggy or board and I'm not playing around before or after riding. I've been on asphalt most of the time lately and scudding probably wouldn't be advisable :P

Windstruck - 17-7-2015 at 04:15 AM

John - great video! Really captured the spirit of the sport we all love. Heck with the scud (though very nice of course), I like your "close encounter" with the bush starting at 2:10!!! :cool:

Self - Must keep this thread on the NASA subject! On the subject of NPWs, my XK-won custom 3.2M made it to Los Angeles Wednesday according to the Aus Post tracker. Almost in my hands!!! :wee:

soliver - 17-7-2015 at 03:15 PM

GREAT vid John!!!...

Ive been flying static a lot lately because I promised myself and Wifey no more lunch break buggy sessions after my accident... part of the fun of static flying foils was always scuds, but I think you're right, Sean that the sudden burst of power as a foil enters the power zone is what causes that breaking of traction... still fun to have static sessions with the NS3's though... LOVE the 1 handed flying action for sure. Really excited for the fall winds to pick up and kill the blasted summer lull.

Steve, I think the guy in the bush is Spartan, one of the other regulars over on XK.

Windstruck - 17-7-2015 at 05:14 PM

Spartan - aptly named! :Ange09:

Kitegonzo - 12-10-2015 at 11:50 AM

I'm thinking about buying an Nasa Star 3 in 12.5m for low wind snowkiting.
What will be the minimum wind speed for slow driving?

My biggest kite today is a Libre Zebra Slope 12.5m, I can start driving from 6 knots (7mph) windspeed.

Thanks/Peter

Windstruck - 12-10-2015 at 04:10 PM

@kitegonzo - I would say that the 12.5m NS3 has about the same low wind range, maybe 5 knots minimum. This really depends on how clean your wind is. I was just buggying today with my 12.5m NS3 and it was on the ground about as long as it was up in the air. It has a heck of lot of pull once the wind picks up, but it doesn't fly in sub-5 knot winds any better than any other kite. The rub for me up here in the Utah mountains is when the conditions are such that this is the right kite to pull out of the bag then the winds are often highly variable, going from nothing to 10+ and back again (again and again). I had a lot of stalls and some backwards flying. Not a big deal when seated in a low slung buggy but I suspect this would be more problematic when skiing.

Where would you be snowkiting?

ssayre - 12-10-2015 at 05:09 PM

Good advice from Steve. Probably one of only half a dozen people on the planet that has one. :D

Kitegonzo - 13-10-2015 at 11:11 AM

@windstruck- I live in northern Bavaria (near Nuermberg), east of my home are small hills where are some good spots for snowkiting. In addition I can go to the Alps (Austria/Italy) for a weekend.-
I tried water kiting, land kiting, but in my opinion snowkiting (with skis) is the best of all!

Here you can see me kiting on a frozen lake in the Alps: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cp92dAbzj8Y

I have the complete range of Zebra Slope (12.5, 9.0, 6.5, 4.0m) and a 8.5 PL C-Quad.
The C- Quad starts a little bit earlier than the 12.5. Slope but has not depower, therefore problematic in gusty conditions.-

Do you think that the FS Peak II 12.0 has the same low wind range as the NST3 12.5 ?

Thanks/Peter

P.S. I looked for Park City pic in the Internet. Should be a perfect place for snowkiting?

Windstruck - 13-10-2015 at 12:39 PM

@Kitegonzo - beautiful video. Nice song too. That certainly looked like an idyllic location for snowkiting. I just began going mobile with traction kites this year, having only flown static with some Prism kites before diving headlong into buggying this past summer. I look forward to starting snowkiting with a vengeance this winter, hopefully only a few short weeks away at this point! This will be my first season trying it and I suspect I may too choose it as my favorite means of getting around under a kite as you have done.

So... you've asked me to choose between the Peaks and the STARS for snowkiting and I've never actually done it. I am a former downhill ski racer and at least decent in the buggy at this point so I think I can project into the sport. With those (big) caveats I'd personally be steering you towards the 12m Peak-2 over the 12.5m NS3. In saying this I appreciate that there is a sizable price difference between these kites. Here's the thing: The 12.5 NS3 is a LARGE Fixed Bridle kite. As such it has a TON of grunt but a fairly limited wind range at the high end before things could get outright dangerous. Forget about being able to scrub power with the little yellow ball controlling the center line on the NS3. A wind gust with 12.5m of sail in the air has a LARGE effect on the pilot. It is one thing to be sitting down in a buggy with a very low center of gravity and three very wide spaced tires. It would be (I suspect) a whole other thing to be standing on two sticks of wood (OK, fiberglass, epoxy, wood, titanium, honeycomb, etc.).

Both kites will have comparable low end ranges. Both will launch in about the same (very light) wind. What I have found, however, is that the wind needs to have picked up a fair amount from the amount it takes to launch the kite before the 12.5m NS3 starts behaving the way you want it to, viz., not falling out of the sky bottom first, back flying, stalling, etc. Once the wind picks up the 12.5m NS3 actually behaves like her smaller sized NS3 siblings, just sort of in slow motion. It does have a tighter turning radius than the 12m P2. The rub, I've found, with the 12m NS3 is that it has a pretty tight optimal wind window. Too light and it won't fly optimally; too much and you are in for Toad's Wild Ride. Just right wind and you are just fine. My Utah wind doesn't come like that too often and I suspect your Euro wind doesn't much either.

The 12m P2, on the other hand, will launch in about the same amount of wind as the 12.5m NS3 but will become functional almost immediately, behaving as you hope and expect it too in all but the most lightest of winds. I've even played with 5m line extensions on the 12m P2 to good results, getting what feels like about 10% more power at the price of needing bigger space and sacrificing a little speed in turning.

Now here's the real thing: The 12m P2 is much SAFER to have in the air when a gust comes along or the wind you find yourself riding (or I suspect skiing) in becomes quite a bit stronger than when you launched. Secondly, and bet this is important, wind becomes much more powerful as you crest the ridge of a hill or mountain than on its upward slope that you just climbed. You can depower the 12m P2 so much that you have essentially sheeted out the kite, resulting in a great reduction in power. I suspect that will come in EXTREMELY handy when cresting a ridge. While the STARS are comparatively low on the scale of kites when it comes to Lift versus Grunt, these kites can (and do) lift you if the conditions are right. I could easily see being under the 12.5m NS3 getting pulled up a hill only to get plucked up in the air as I crest the ridge. I don't like the control scenarios at all in that situation, not one bit.

I plan to use my Peaks pretty much exclusively this winter when going into anything even the least technical or when the wind is at all squirrelly. I could see pulling out a STAR for fun if riding on a soccer field in very predictable wind conditions, but my go to's will likely be the Peaks.

A final thought brought up by SSAYER (Sean) in the past is that the price differences become quite a bit less when you factor in the wind ranges these kites cover. The peaks have a huge power range per kite so you don't need to buy as many of them to cover a wind range as you would the NS3. Below is a video I made a while back when I flew my 6m and 12m P2s on the same day for a fun buggy session. I know you have a nice quiver already and am just looking to fill in the low-wind range, so maybe this final point is mute for you. I brought it up just as much for others that might be reading this that are earlier in their journey of quiver building.

Good luck! You seem to have life nicely dialed in for your hobbies. Thanks too BTW for subscribing to my YouTube channel - greatly appeciated!

Kitegonzo - 14-10-2015 at 09:29 AM

@windstuck- thank you for the very good information.-
I also think, that depower kites are the best choice for snowkiting but I hoped to get a better low (wind) end with the NST3.
So I will keep my C- Quad for the lowest end.

I think you will not have big problems when starting snowkiting, as you have already experience with both kites and skis.
The big advantage with skis on snow is that you can drift (if you have enough space in lee direction).
Therefore it is much easier in gusty conditions.

Thanks/Peter

Windstruck - 14-10-2015 at 09:51 AM

Good luck Peter! It's all great stuff!!

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