Power Kite Forum

Advice Please

Jack1988 - 4-2-2010 at 06:36 PM

Hi Chaps, long time no see, i hope ya all well.

Well i need some advice, Ive been Landboarding for a lil while now on Fixed bridles and Handles but i want to progress to the next stage, although i dont want to sacrifice the Control of the handles, i know that Depower is the only way if i want to reach my Goal of Kitesurfing.

I have a Bar and Harness for my Fixed bridle kites but i dont like to use them simply because they are not Depower, yes it stops my arms aching a bit but i lost alot of control and its unsafe being hooked in with no depower and the rubbish wrist strap kite killer, it doesnt work well enough in considerable winds imo, so i opt for the handles always.

Basically now i have to make a decision, i want to be on the water by the end of the summer, im planning on Taking lessons Ofcourse but before then i want to Progress to Depower, my problem is that i have only enough money to buy one Depower kite for a while and it wont be brand new either, thats how lil cash i have, i want to go straight onto an LEI but then i realised that i have no experience on Depower, so i would have to learn alot very quickly, i would have to learn how to fly depower, set up and launch, pack up etc an LEI etc, therefore i thought about getting an Open foil Depower foil (eg Access) or something like that, but then again if i do that i might not be able to pick up an LEI for a while.

Im struggling to make a decision. :puzzled:

Help me please guys!

Thanks

jack ;-)

Hardrock - 4-2-2010 at 07:21 PM

I don't have a depower kite.

But I would say your about to see the word Arc a lot.

erratic winds - 4-2-2010 at 07:33 PM

Cheap LEI with bar and lines and go for it, man!

furbowski - 4-2-2010 at 07:37 PM

Hi jack, long time no see, although I've been following you on kitecrowd during my many lurks over there... You're progressing fast and haven't been hurt yet, good stuff.

let folks here know what your budget is, and remind us how much you weigh and what winds you fly most, that will help clarify the advice you'll get.

I get the idea you haven't flown with many other folks as well, still the best thing to do is meet up with some of the guys on KC who are local to you.

Can't really help you further... just to say don't get foils under 6m, LEIs under 8m, and arcs under 10m... the smaller size depowers are for insane winds.

Also it's possible to get really comfortable on handles, I am too. Get over it... You just need to refine your skills and think ahead a bit more...

Jack1988 - 5-2-2010 at 05:36 AM

Hi Furbowski

I think my budget is 300 GB Pounds,

Still only weigh in at 11.5 Stone, mostly flying in Onshore winds at the coast, the wind i mostly get are 5 to 20mph.

Finally met up and found some guys in my area furbowski :) He flys LEIs on Landboards. Hes quite Good actually, rides for Trampa Boards.

Yep your right about those Kite sizes, I think i will stay away from Arcs for now, If i go LEI i will look for something in the 10 to 12m size, If open cell Depower, 8m Access maybe.

Still cant decide though I could possibly save up 300 pounds for another kite once ive learn Depower on an access, just not sure whether its worth it :s

Drewculous - 5-2-2010 at 08:11 AM

Hate to be cliche about it.... but an arc would be nice, they fly everywhere and are pretty forgiving of mistakes... another option would be an HQ NEO... The drawback of an open cell is it is land only... and while thats not all bad, if you do want to go to the water, a closed cell or LEI lends you the option of surfing too... keep us posted on what you opt for!

furbowski - 5-2-2010 at 10:41 AM

One thing to keep in mind is that once you start getting arcs / ozone depowers you start having resale value, so once you've learned what that 8m access has to teach you, you can sell it for most of what you paid and put that money towards a manta or frenzy... if that's the direction you wanted to go. LEI's don't hold their value as much.

Also if you are buying used be patient and watch the boards like a hawk! It can take a month or two for the right kite to come along, sometimes much longer!

hope that helps....

awindofchange - 5-2-2010 at 12:24 PM

I would suggest looking for a used Venom 1 or Venom 2. You should be able to score one of these for around $500.00 or less complete with bar & lines. These are great kites to learn on and have great depower. The stability of the ARC's make them superior in learning to board because you can spend more time on working on your launches and board control and less time worrying about the kite and spending tons of time re-launching. The PL's work great for land and water which is another benefit.

If you do decide to go LEI, no problem. Just make sure to fully check the gear out before purchasing as used LEI's can be sketchy to purchase if you don't know the previous owner that well.

Either will work great for you as a first kite. Just be safe and try to get with others in your area that can help you progress.

Jack1988 - 5-2-2010 at 02:16 PM

Cheers Guys, How hard are Arcs to set up and launch, land etc? Thats the only thing i would really be worried about. also a guy once said to me that i shouldnt fly arcs on water just incase i bowtie or luff, and drown, but with a LEI, just relaunch and your away, im sure arcs can be safe on water but it scared me nonethe less, now ive really confused myself! Arcs, LEI or Open cell depower Arghh, dunno what to do

awindofchange - 5-2-2010 at 02:36 PM

Arc's are just fine on water. What you are hearing is the same old myths that have been floating around for years. Totally UNTRUE and usually spread by those that are not educated on the twinskin kites! If the Arc - Twinskin for the proper name - lands on water, it will relaunch just as easy as any LEI will and in some cases, faster and easier. The stability and luft absorption of the ARC's are awesome and in most cases, will never end up putting the kite in the water in the first place. Bow-tie was fairly common on the older ARC's (like the old discontinued F-Arc) and also possible on the "land based" kites like the Phantom and Scorpion because they are longer and more narrow in shape. Even still, they are quite rare that they ever happen and in most cases, you can get the bow-tie out by pulling in one side of the kite and letting it "un-screw" and then relaunch like normal. The newer stiffer models such as the Venom's, Synergy's and the new Charger are much stiffer in design and not as long and ribbon shaped as the land designed models so bow-ties on those kites are nearly non-existent and not a worry.

Twinskins do trap the air inside of the kite and will stay afloat on the water for up to 20-40 minutes before it becomes a problem with relaunch (depending on the kite and water conditions of course). Most of the time you can have the Twinskin relaunched within 1-2 minutes if not sooner. The Charger practically bounces off the water, relaunches are a snap.

As always, if possible, fly before you buy, that will give you the best knowledge and experience. Find one you like and then purchase that kite for yourself. :) If you don't have friends that will let you try their kites, take a lesson from a shop that happens to train on the kite you would like to try out. :)

Jack1988 - 5-2-2010 at 04:45 PM

Well ive been talking to various peeps about this dilemma and i must say that Arcs wont be the way for me tbh, yes they maybe good onland and for inland winds. and for the sea also, but LEI seems to be good enough to wait for, i fly on the coast usually and wait for the onshores. I will get an Access (used) and learn depower for a few months, what ya reckon?

Bladerunner - 5-2-2010 at 05:25 PM

Learning on and then selling the access will not be the biggest mistake. They hold their price pretty good and will forgive you those 1st few crashes.

Older LEI ( 05 or newer ) can be found at some amazing prices. I think it may be a good direction for you ?

Arcs may or may not be for you but that OLD line about drowning is just STUPID !!!!! 1st of all don't go out farther than you plan to swim in ! Next, I had PLENTY of line tangles etc that made me swim in with my original C kites. You should NEVER count on your kite to get you home! Bladders POP and ALL air goes out. A twin skin will hold PLENTY of air to assist in floating in on the off chance that you bow tie etc.. A popped bladder shuts you down you whole session. A torn arc can still be flown in + repaired with a peice of tape.

I'm not saying buy an arc but I am saying don't believe those tired old lines about them. :bigok:

Jack1988 - 6-2-2010 at 09:35 AM

Cool man, thanks for the info.

So I heard that Pansh do a Depower kite no? the Blaze? It doesnt come with a bar but i could get one cheaper than an Access and demolish it but get my depower bar skills down, what do you think of that? its all about the money with me ya see :( i havent got much, so if i can get something cheaper than an Access i will look into it.

furbowski - 6-2-2010 at 09:57 AM

If you want a blaze depower you'll need to rig it yourself. You might be able to buy one on here pre-rigged, there are a few floating around. try the unofficial pansh forum as well, it's on its second life now but still on the tubes somewhere...

lad - 6-2-2010 at 10:06 AM

I don't think you can compare a new Blaze to a used Access or Arc - price or quality wise.

I can confirm what others say about arcs - they're the easiest to learn on and give you more confidence for other kites later. Even the legendary stability of the Access range doesn't compare to the arcs.

What others like to call greater "pop" and "grunt" in foils and LEIs - I call spank and jerk! :smug: My Phantom 12 is like having incredibly smooth power drive.

You will be much more frustrated trying to learn using a Pansh, or a more challenging foil or LEI.

Jack1988 - 6-2-2010 at 11:06 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by furbowski
If you want a blaze depower you'll need to rig it yourself. You might be able to buy one on here pre-rigged, there are a few floating around. try the unofficial pansh forum as well, it's on its second life now but still on the tubes somewhere...


Yeah im looking at one Pre rigged atm, ive got a week before i get any money anyway, i can only spend 200 odd quid, so unless im very lucky, i might not get offered an access, i just missed out on a Frenzy due to money to buy kites, it was 10m rtf for 180 quid aswell, Doh!

Jack1988 - 14-2-2010 at 11:17 AM

Got a 9.5 ozone frenzy 2003 RTF for 50 quid, lots of repairs on it but flys well enough, for my first depower kite also this wont spoil me for when i get something better :)

arkay - 14-2-2010 at 11:33 AM

:thumbup: good deal, and you won't be afraid to beat it into the ground ;) Just triple check that all of the safety releases are working without a hitch. Anyone know what releases the 2003 has?

Jack1988 - 14-2-2010 at 11:43 AM

the safety release i havent even located yet, theres a lil red loop at the end of the depower rope attached to the middle lines, dunno what to look for really,