Kitebuggies,kiteboards,ATBs,dirtsurfers and the like, are they "wind powered" vehicles? Or , are they "human powered" vehicles. I would like to
hear why also.
Personally, I vote Human powered. Cause there are NO attachments for a sail on any of them. A blo kart is a wind powered vehicle, so is a
windsurfer. But a kitebuggy is powered by a human flying a kite. When the human quits or is unable to fly, rides over.
So let's hear what you thinkDrewculous - 1-7-2010 at 10:36 AM
i would be inclined to say wind... but you provide a great argument for the human....
when i think human powered i think like a bike, or skate board... the human is expending engery to put the vehicle in motion... the kite buggy... not
so much, the wind is doing the work.
Very thought provokingWELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 10:40 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Drewculous
the kite buggy... not so much, the wind is doing the work.
Then why are my arms so sore from all that "working " the kite.
And it sure looks like I'm pedaling in the air.WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 10:42 AM
atb is the 4x4 of "skateboards" If you ride a bike or skateboard down a hill. Does that make it "gravity " powered ?Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by WELDNGOD
atb is the 4x4 of "skateboards" If you ride a bike or skateboard down a hill. Does that make it "gravity " powered ?
yes
Quote:
Originally posted by WELDNGOD
Then why are my arms so sore from all that "working " the kite.
And it sure looks like I'm pedaling in the air.
you sir need an arc... park and ride baby!coreykite - 1-7-2010 at 10:44 AM
Hey Sailors,
They are "wind-powered" because that's where the energy comes from.
On a kite-buggy, the kite/pilot replaces the mast/boom/sail, not the energy source.
Skills in operation are different from power sources.
That's all I have to say about that.
Safen Up! Buggy On!
"Often wrong... Never in doubt"
the coreylamaDrewculous - 1-7-2010 at 10:55 AM
there are "gravity powered vehicle" races... and its all downhill type stuff... like a soapbox derby car (or skateboard/atb)
and yes, you do have to work to get the vehicle moving... but thats the same for a car, and a car is not a human powered vehicle... it wont go if i
dont expel energy to push the pedal...
Its a very clever argument indeed... but i would still lean on the wind powered side of thingsbigben91682 - 1-7-2010 at 10:57 AM
Definitely wind powered. If it's human powered, like a bike, a human is required. Put a human in a buggy with a kite, if there's no wind you ain't
moving thus not human powered, even though you are sittin in that buggy with a sad face.
Wind powered, human controlled.dylanj423 - 1-7-2010 at 11:12 AM
wind powered... the human is only a conduit for the energy to be transfered from the kite to the buggy... no wind, no movement either...
no human to sail a boat.... no sailing... same goes for buggiesstetson05 - 1-7-2010 at 11:15 AM
I see where you are going against. On a bike the human uses the gears to provide mechanical advantage. If looked at from one point of view the human
uses the kite to provide mechanical advantage. That might get you back onto the beach lad - 1-7-2010 at 11:15 AM
Human Powered;
Wind Powered:
Gravity Powered: Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 11:19 AM
Hardrock - 1-7-2010 at 11:22 AM
Wind powered, for the reasons above.WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 11:30 AM
If I fly static and scud am I "wind powered" or am I a human just flying a kite?Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 11:32 AM
the scud is powered by the wind, yes...
you are also flying a kite... wish i waskteguru - 1-7-2010 at 11:42 AM
I've got a feeling the Weldingod is about ready to open a can of woopass on the local beach patrolDrewculous - 1-7-2010 at 11:44 AM
if this is about the beach ban, and human powered vehicles are allowed, and wind ones arent?
Then hell yes, HUMAN POWERED!!WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 12:01 PM
code of virginia states the definitions of:
"Vehicle" means every device in, on or by which any person or property is or may be transported or drawn on a highway, except devices moved by human
power or used exclusively on stationary rails or tracks. For the purposes of Chapter 8 (§ 46.2-800 et seq.) of this title, bicycles, electric personal
assistive mobility devices, electric power-assisted bicycles, and mopeds shall be vehicles while operated on a highway.
"Utility vehicle" means a motor vehicle that is (i) designed for off-road use, (ii) powered by an engine of no more than 25 horsepower, and (iii) used
for general maintenance, security, agricultural, or horticultural purposes. "Utility vehicle" does not include all-terrain vehicles as defined in this
section, riding lawn mowers, or any other vehicle whose definition is included in this section.
"Toy vehicle" means any motorized or propellant-driven device that has no manufacturer-issued vehicle identification number, that is designed or used
to carry any person or persons, on any number of wheels, bearings, glides, blades, runners, or a cushion of air. The term does not include electric
personal assistive mobility devices, electric power-assisted bicycles, mopeds, or motorcycles, nor does it include any nonmotorized or
nonpropellant-driven devices such as bicycles, roller skates, or skateboards.
"All-terrain vehicle" means a three-wheeled or four-wheeled motor vehicle powered by a gasoline or diesel engine and generally characterized by large,
low-pressure tires, a seat designed to be straddled by the operator, and handlebars for steering that is intended for off-road use by an individual
rider on various types of unpaved terrain. The term does not include four-wheeled vehicles, commonly known as "go-carts," that have low centers of
gravity and are typically used in racing on relatively level surfaces, nor does the term include any "utility vehicle" as defined in this section or
any "farm utility vehicle" as defined in this section.WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 12:02 PM
I can find nothing about "wind powered" vehicles at all.bigben91682 - 1-7-2010 at 12:03 PM
When it comes to beach ban, I also vote human powered.WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 12:08 PM
are they even "vehicles"?
here are the park rules from their own website
All City, State and Federal Laws apply to Grandview Nature Preserve & Factory Point. There is NO alcohol, camping or tents allowed. There are also
NO open fires, grills or motorized vehicles allowed. Pets are banned April 1 - September 15th. Please stay off the dunes and out of posted bird
nesting areas. Entering into designated posted bird nesting areas is a violation of law. All laws are strictly enforced. This area is patrolled by
City, State and Federal Law Enforcement officers. Any violations observed will be enforced.Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 12:10 PM
A device or structure for transporting persons or things; a conveyance
...sadly yesWELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 12:14 PM
. For the purposes of Chapter 8 (§ 46.2-800 et seq.) of this title, bicycles, electric personal assistive mobility devices, electric power-assisted
bicycles, and mopeds shall be vehicles while operated on a highway
That is only while operation on a roadway, when not on a roadway, what is it?Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 12:30 PM
if i were you... id play ball like Angus... he supports the Jekyll turtles... you need to organize something for the nesting birds (cough cough...
Vriginia Nesting Birds Buggy Bash)
the VN triple B could make a donation to the local animal preserves... all while promoting environmentally safe, bird friendly, fun!
If they get some benefit out of you being there, they are more likely to like ya... kite buggy is still wind powered :frog:WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 12:32 PM
OK , a wind powered what?mougl - 1-7-2010 at 12:49 PM
@drew
I like the idea about playing ball like Angus, its great but unfortunately not all local or state governments are as cool or open minded as the folks
down on JI. I've been pleading my case to Collier County for months now and they are giving me the old "I don't want to hear it, this is how it is, if
you don't like it move" treatment.
I feel your pain WGdylanj423 - 1-7-2010 at 12:57 PM
looks like we are all toy vehicle addicts to me... the "any number of bearings and wheels" thing kinda defines the buggy...
sorry to say... maybe another way can be foundWELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 01:11 PM
"nor does it include any nonmotorized or nonpropellant-driven devices such as bicycles, roller skates, or skateboards. "
I don't think we fit the criteria. Isnt my land board just an oversize skateboard.
Oh, and here they call them" devices" not vehicles. Very interesting:ticking:Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 01:39 PM
well... two words then
GUERRILLA KITING
if you go out in a guy fawkes mask... i want pics, lolindigo_wolf - 1-7-2010 at 01:46 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Drewculous
if you go out in a guy fawkes mask... i want pics, lol
Does this mean that even now, there are buggies and landboards being shipped to fliers all over the United States? :o :o
Craney Island on Nov. 5th?
ATB,
Samlad - 1-7-2010 at 02:24 PM
Wildwood / Wildwood Crest has a big sign forbidding unregistered "vehicles of any kind" - but they don't seem to mind buggying after-hours there
during the tourist season.shehatesmyhobbies - 1-7-2010 at 02:38 PM
Donnie, sounds like you are in a real battle! I don't know that you could describe it as a vehicle or not! There is no motor, or pedals so it is not
motor powered or human powered it is more like wind powered with Human assistance. What a bunch of lame ducks down there! I know you were pretty much
the only one flying there, like they have nothing else better to do than bug you. Looks to me that they need to put it in black or white or leave you
alone. Maybe you should offer to let one of the nice officers try it and see that you are not out to tear up the beach or scare off any nice little
birds or anything else! Fun police suck!
Good Luck wish I could help in some way!shehatesmyhobbies - 1-7-2010 at 02:49 PM
You know I think I am leaning more toward the Human powered side, you could sit in it all day and it won't go anywhere till you the human fly a kite.WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 03:03 PM
I can even sit in it and fly and go absolutely nowhere. If I fly a kite while skateboarding, is it a kite powered skateboard?WELDNGOD - 1-7-2010 at 03:08 PM
I ought to go out in my neighborhood and get someone to push me around until a cop sees me, and see what he says it is.Drewculous - 1-7-2010 at 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by WELDNGOD
I ought to go out in my neighborhood and get someone to push me around until a cop sees me, and see what he says it is.
VIDEO!!!
i am sorry you have to go through all this... i really hope, all kidding aside, it all ends up the way we all hope it willKamikuza - 1-7-2010 at 05:24 PM
Human powered = bicycle, skateboard, pedal boat ...
Clearly the buggy is wind-powered.
A yacht won't go anywhere until you sheet in the mainsail - nor will a car move until you press the gas pedal. Trying to argue either of those as
being "human powered" is specious.
Good luck though ...coreykite - 2-7-2010 at 12:08 PM
Hey Sailors,
I believe the "wind-powered" aspect has the day.
The real issue is whether or not the buggy is a "vehicle" as defined by cited statutes of the State of Virginia.
I believe it is not a "vehicle" as defined.
I believe Mike Dooley had this very issue arise a couple years ago in California.
Went to court and won!
There is precedent for the buggy not being a "vehicle".
Courts love precedents.
Contact Mike for more specific info.
Safen Up! Buggy On!
"Often wrong... Never in doubt"
the coreylamakitemaker4 - 2-7-2010 at 01:03 PM
There are no court records for Mikes case since it was settled out of court. Some of us did a bunch of searching and talking with Mike to get this
information.
Susan (npw goddess)WELDNGOD - 2-7-2010 at 01:49 PM
It's time to take a stand and push the issue. The park rules clearly state "no MOTORIZED vehicles"shehatesmyhobbies - 2-7-2010 at 02:27 PM
Right on Donnie! Take a pic of the sign and show them what it says then take them a pic of the buggy and show it has no means of propulsion!WIllardTheGrey - 2-7-2010 at 09:53 PM
From the sound of it he'll get....
Hmmm no motor eh you must be hiding it in those big tires, what else would you be using em for. Anyway the bird gods say you have displeased them.
:flaming:Kamikuza - 3-7-2010 at 02:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by shehatesmyhobbies
Right on Donnie! Take a pic of the sign and show them what it says then take them a pic of the buggy and show it has no means of propulsion!
And just remember, comments like "It's just as well they don't leave making laws up to idiots like you then isn't it?" can be counterproductive ...WELDNGOD - 3-7-2010 at 06:25 AM
so I guess it would also be bad to call him the "bird police" or maybe.. officer "Turkey Bacon":frog:Hardrock - 3-7-2010 at 08:24 AM
WG I wouldn't give a rats arse, I would go do my thing with the buggy and have my day in court. Thats the only way you'll get an appointment anyway,
to discuss it and get a final clear understanding of the law. Then if you win, LOL,,, you'll have the proof for every jonny cop that comes around.
The ticket will have to be for using a motorized vehicle, as thats the rule you'll be breaking, then go prove its not.
How many folks in here will chip in three dollars for WG's fine if he has to pay one?
I would, I'd like to see how this ends up.
PS: leave stash and other undesirable's at home.WELDNGOD - 3-7-2010 at 01:49 PM
HR, I went and did my thing, nobody showed up. And I was squeeky clean while I was there.:saint:Hardrock - 4-7-2010 at 08:07 AM
Great, maybe they will used to you being there and leave you alone.
The cops will be thinking it must ok, he's here all the time.
Hmmm no motor eh you must be hiding it in those big tires, what else would you be using em for. Anyway the bird gods say you have displeased them.
:flaming: