Power Kite Forum

What to check for on a used PL?

frostbite - 7-12-2010 at 07:34 AM

I just got my first depower kite last night and I can hardly wait to take it out this weekend. It was an used PL charger 10m with the navigator bar, the seller said that he only flown it a few time and the kite fabric did look like they are in good shape (really crumbled since he just stuff it in the bag without folding), what else should I check for?
Also I noticed that the lines were attached and on all the PL packing video I have seem, they always show that the line should be removed from the kite when you pack, is there any reason why you'll need to do this? My HQ hydra came with the line attached and I have never remove them before, and I also read that FS kite are packed with their line attached. Why is the charger different?

Bladerunner - 7-12-2010 at 07:37 AM

Are the spars straight, undamaged? Are the spar pockets free of wear?

Crumpled kite and lines attached aren't a big problem but a red flag. Lazy packing ?

How beat up is the bar? My Navi bar is the newest but looks the oldest already. Soft foam on hand holds get messed up.

Kamikuza - 7-12-2010 at 07:56 AM

What BR said - pay attention to the L.E. part of the spar pockets ...
Rubber caps on the spars not punched through?
Do all the zips move freely? The pulleys roll smooth?

Keep the lines on - ease of unpacking and setup. Just make sure not to poke holes in kite with the bar hardware.

... how much did you pay for the kite?

frostbite - 7-12-2010 at 07:57 AM

Here's the pics :wow:



Kamikuza - 7-12-2010 at 07:58 AM

Looks like a good bloody score to me!!! :shocked2:

markite - 7-12-2010 at 08:33 AM

A little more on what the others already said.
- Pull the spars and look at the end caps - the rods usually cut through the cap fairly quickly if people jam the rods in really tight. Once the rods cut the cap, they'll then cut the threads and end of spar pockets - so check the end caps - best to catch it before it punches through the pocket
- the main thing would be any rib separation or tear from the upper or lower skin that may be internal and not showing on the outside. I can spot a rib separation on a flying kite right away with a slight bulge in an area where the kite should be pulled tight along a sewn rib seam. Before flying you can look up though all zippers to have a quick look up those sections. For the rest you can lay the kite flat and press down each section looking through the outer skin to see the layers of fabric for each rib to see if you see any tears. Easiest to see when inflated so you could inflate a kite indoors with a vac to look at all seams and kite profile to see any awkward bumps or loose threads along a seam.
- bar looks new, after a couple of uses there will be signs of wear around the underside where the swivel bumps the foam.

acampbell - 7-12-2010 at 08:34 AM

yeah there is no right or wrong about packing with the lines attached or not. If you develop consistent packing and un-packing habits such that you can un-pack and set up without twists, then more power to you. Unless assisted with landings, most ARC landings are something of a train-wreck when you dump it on to safety so I find it easy to detach lines and start with a fresh rig every time. Takes no more time than the pre-inflation.

carltb - 7-12-2010 at 09:40 AM

looks like everything has been covered. and yes that bar does look brand new!!

as you havent had a depower before you might have been better off buying a 12m or 15m as the 10m is extremely fast and is usually used as a high wind kite 30+mph. im not suggesting you try it in these winds but once you get used to flying it in lower winds you will want to get a 15m or 12m and they will become your go to kites and the 10m will only come out on special occasions!!

have fun learning on your 10m ch. and keep us posted on your progress.!!

markite - 7-12-2010 at 10:40 AM

ahh - last thing, the bridle - check that it's not too worn or jammed pulleys (as kami noted).
And then flying line that there aren't any knicked or frayed sections


(reminds me of the Spanish Inquisition... our chief weapon is fear, fear and surprise...etc etc)

frostbite - 7-12-2010 at 11:20 AM

No body expected the Spanish inquisition!!
The spars looks good but one of the endcap was squished. They look pretty flimsy, I remember reading suggestion on replacing them with something beefier?
Also, is the kite suppose to come with line extension? In the manual it says that you can slow the kite down a bit by adding the extension, should I try this?
I got her for 800 smackaroos off of eBay, i thought it was a good price and since no body bid on it I lost my mind and click on the bid button before the auction closed. I would have prefer a 12m but would have been too chicken to jump to a 15m kite right off the bat.
Also I am pretty use to flying my hydra 3.5 so I figure the 10m charger couldn't be faster than the 3.5? I hope not.. :o

erratic winds - 7-12-2010 at 11:31 AM

You'll be amazed at how fast the charger10 turns..... I've flown the charger12 and it was turning as fast as any C kite i've flown...

InvertedForce - 7-12-2010 at 11:43 AM

I say if you're looking to get new spars, head over to Angus at Coastal Wind Sports and get his collapsible spars for PL, they're cheaper than OEM spars and better (I think so, at least) :thumbup:

flyjump - 7-12-2010 at 12:26 PM

Before you fly check that the internal straps on the tips are at the same length. It'll fly awkwardly if they are set different. It looks very clean:)

pokitetrash - 7-12-2010 at 12:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by frostbite
(really crumbled since he just stuff it in the bag without folding


Crumpled = Still nice and crispy! :thumbup: If it makes nice krinkly sounds when you handle it, its in like new shape, swishy sounds means it old, well worn maybe. Sounds like you got a good one.:yes:

Bladerunner - 7-12-2010 at 06:56 PM

Carl makes a good point.

I find my 10m Charger is a kite I have to really stay on top of or pay for lack of attention / skill. Be aware that you will find it serves up very little power until the wind blows strong . Move into those higher winds slowly even though your kite is designed for those winds. In the lower winds the kite responds amazingly to aggressive flying. GREAT for learning. In higher winds the KITE starts acting aggressively and you are best advised to be on top of it !

It's kind of crazy but in ways I find the 15m Charger / Syn to be a more depower beginer friendly kite. It is well powered and better behaved in lower winds.

macboy - 8-12-2010 at 01:32 AM

One thing I didn't see here (although I was reading fast AND the kit you have there is certainly new enough to not need to worry BUT.......) I've had two PLs require the velcro pocket opening to be resewn. Seems things just get dry and flaky and the ripping action of the velcro pulls itself (the velcro) apart. Granted this was a Guerilla and a Venom 1 (older kites).

frostbite - 8-12-2010 at 01:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bladerunner
Carl makes a good point.

I find my 10m Charger is a kite I have to really stay on top of or pay for lack of attention / skill. Be aware that you will find it serves up very little power until the wind blows strong . Move into those higher winds slowly even though your kite is designed for those winds. In the lower winds the kite responds amazingly to aggressive flying. GREAT for learning. In higher winds the KITE starts acting aggressively and you are best advised to be on top of it !

It's kind of crazy but in ways I find the 15m Charger / Syn to be a more depower beginer friendly kite. It is well powered and better behaved in lower winds.


I am planning on flying static in low wind a few time and get familiar with it before I even think about getting on the land board.

I am putting an order in for ground stake and am thinking about getting the 3m line extension also, would having the line extension make any noticeable speed difference?

Bladerunner - 8-12-2010 at 07:17 PM

Great Idea to get familiar with the kite but don't completely judge it until you get riding with it. This kite and depower in general works as it should in motion.

-mj- - 13-12-2010 at 12:45 AM

Groundstake why?

3m extensions come with the package as standard. (and yes they'll slow down the kite somewhat)

To start out put all the straps on the loosest settings! (This is the slowest setting for the kite and then it's still fast!)

frostbite - 13-12-2010 at 10:42 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by -mj-
Groundstake why?

3m extensions come with the package as standard. (and yes they'll slow down the kite somewhat)

To start out put all the straps on the loosest settings! (This is the slowest setting for the kite and then it's still fast!)


I did not get the 3m extensions as part of the deal (its the only thing missing) so I was thinking of getting them, although from digging further back, ppl didn't feel like they made that much of a difference?

Also, I fly solo often so I thought that launching with 2 ground stake was the standard procedure? 1 on chicken loop and one on leash?

markite - 13-12-2010 at 11:12 AM

Quote:
Also, I fly solo often so I thought that launching with 2 ground stake was the standard procedure? 1 on chicken loop and one on leash?


No, do not use ground stakes on the chicken loop and leash for launching and even for landing please have a look at the thread about landing.

http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=16126

There are some video links that show both launch and landing. With experience you can attach to a fixed object but there are some risks (looping the kite, line cut on your hand, pulling out a ground stake etc) so don't go with a ground stake procedure to start and especially not one on your CL and one on the leash. I can see a burst kite in your future if you try that option - glad you are asking questions.

acampbell - 13-12-2010 at 12:54 PM

Quote:

Also, I fly solo often so I thought that launching with 2 ground stake was the standard procedure? 1 on chicken loop and one on leash?


Yeah lets make it clear that ground stakes have nothing to do with launching an arc. Go to the PL website and download the manuals and current video and it should be clear. Launching is easy and straightforward if those recommendations are followed.

I can think of only two discrepancies regarding published procedures:

1) Earlier PL videos indicate that you should launched un-hooked so that if you have mis-judged the situation you can let go. From my experience, launching an arc is such a gentle non-event (after the first go), that if you really have to let go of the bar, then a lot of other things have already gone wrong (like you are launching in a gale). When you successfully launch an arc, it's already just about at the edge of the window and heading towards the zenith. I don't know of anyone that launches un-hooked. If you launch hooked in then you have a free hand to have drink of water or take a slug from a PBR as the kite floats to the zenith.

2) Sand & Snow bag. I am on the beach with a hard-packed deck as smooth as a pool table and I find the no matter how I position the bag on the folded-over wing tip and keep it clear of the lines, I will get it snagged on the lines. the bag will flop off clear of the kite, but then the kite slides on the beach as it curls up to the arc shape and the line will slide under the bag as it slides on the beach and the kite will founder. Keeping the bag un-tied so that the sand falls out of the top and lets the bag falls off the line will help, but in the end I just use loose sand. But I sell a lot of these bags so I think it is not a problem in fields or in snow.

Those things aside, I tell newbies to arcs to keep watching the videos until you can't stand it any more and you start talking like the narrator and then you will be fine.

frostbite - 15-12-2010 at 07:03 AM

Thanks Angus, those are great suggestions!

I went out to a near by field to try my hands on the kite and fail completely!

I seem the launching video several time but in my excitement I forgot half of it. I forgot to stand 45 degree from the wind and the kite end up flying sideway, took a tumble and inverted, after that the lines were hopelessly tangled and I gave up after an hour of wrestling with the kite (I forgot to bring weights which was another problem) and sorting out the lines.

Back to watching the video and imitating the funny accent!

acampbell - 15-12-2010 at 10:34 AM

Don't feel bad; it's different and the 45-degree thing is the key. Just about every time I've seen a launch go south it's been because of that.

If you start the launch walking backwards at 45 deg. and you see the downwind tip curl UP, then you are good and the kite will slide into taco shape and take care of itself.

If the down wind tip curls down and under the kite, then you are screwed and might as well stop right there and re-set everything, making sure the downwind lines lead to you over the top of the laid out kite. That's why they put the launch assist tabs on the newer arcs - to keep those lines from slipping off and under the kite.

You'll get it soon enough and it will be routine.