Power Kite Forum

Loctite ?

garydog - 17-1-2011 at 10:08 AM

What color to hold the axle bolts on a Rockville? Blue is what I am thinking.

Thanks Dan

shehatesmyhobbies - 17-1-2011 at 10:32 AM

Well I suggest a different option than loctite! If you are talking about how the axle bolt will back out on you after several rides, go to the hardware store and get your self some lock washers that are the same outside diameter as your bearings. Put one on each of the inside and one on each of the outside of your wheels. Snug them till they lock the washers and you will be set to go. Good thing about this is you don't have to use loctite and it will only cost you about a buck to do it. I did this with my buggy, not a rockville, but I have never had an axle bolt come loose.

indigo_wolf - 17-1-2011 at 10:36 AM

+1 for lock washers.

For Loctite, Blue is the "lighter" blend that can be undone with hand tools. Red generally requires cursing, heat, and sometimes a blood sacrifice (color-coding? :rolleyes: ) to loosen up.

ATB,
Sam

awindofchange - 17-1-2011 at 01:26 PM

Yup, recommend blue. You can't really use lock washers because the rear axle is round.

WELDNGOD - 17-1-2011 at 01:33 PM

by "lock washer " do you mean split washers? They do make locking bolts that have a strip of nylon down the side and some others that have sprayed on nylon like stuff on the threads. I have also used teflon tape on the threads to lock em'.

EDIT( I don't use bolts for axles,mine are roundstock threaded at the end. And I just use locknuts. When the locknuts get worn from removal, I toss em' and put a new one on.)

shehatesmyhobbies - 17-1-2011 at 01:45 PM



Yeah a spring type split lock washer.

bigkid - 17-1-2011 at 05:39 PM

When you buy a new Rockville buggy they come with blue on the threads from the factory. I did the lock washer and gave it up for a lock nut, use it like the other buggy builders as a jam nut to the axle.

WELDNGOD - 17-1-2011 at 06:10 PM

Now that's a good solution ! Jam nut against the axle. Good one:thumbup:

BeamerBob - 17-1-2011 at 06:12 PM

All the high end production buggies use a jam nut between the wheel and axle. I don't think it would ever back out if its properly tightened to begin with.

van - 18-1-2011 at 06:45 AM

I second the jam nut. They are thinner so should still leave enough thread left on the bolt for you to thread into your axle. If you use the lock washers, becareful what size you use and how it rubs against your bearings.

This is what I use.
http://www.fastenal.com/web/products/detail.ex?sku=70837&...

WELDNGOD - 18-1-2011 at 08:10 AM

van ,I like your NAPKA #. DoubleOO . I chose 187, because it is slang for the police code for murder. And I am good at killin'....... kites, buggies, landboards.:lol::lol:

van - 18-1-2011 at 08:38 AM

Haha ... Double 00 =>> 'license to kill ' hehehe .. we think alike ..

BeamerBob - 18-1-2011 at 09:06 AM

On my Ivanpah, I replaced the narrow jam nuts with full size so I could get a wrench on it without gouging into the axle. I still have plenty of thread engagement.

cheezycheese - 18-1-2011 at 09:12 AM

so i'm guessing to use the jam nut, the threads must run the length of the bolt....? if so n/a to peter lynn buggys....:flaming:

van - 18-1-2011 at 09:39 AM

I am not familiar with the Peter Lynns but the jam nut just goes on the bolt after you put it through the wheels and then into the axle. The jam nut then can be tighten against the axle, not the wheel. So there is no need for the thread to run the length of the bolt.

BeamerBob - 18-1-2011 at 09:42 AM

No, the threads only have to start at the edge of the inside bearing. You want the jam nut tighter into the axle than the torque you put on the bearings. You just don't want the axle bolt to bottom out in the threads of the jam nut. The issue on a PL is that the bolt wasn't sized to account for the thickness of the jam nut and therefore might not be long enough for you to add one. I would want over an inch of thread in the axle. More is better.

awindofchange - 18-1-2011 at 12:25 PM

I believe the original poster was asking about the bolts that run through the rear axle into the frame rails. On the rockville buggy, the frame rails are bolted on through a hole in the rear axle into nuts that are welded inside of the rail tubing. For these, your only real option is to use locktite because there is no other way to keep them in because the rear axle is rounded on the end and a lock washer or jam nut will not seat properly against the rounded axle.

For the wheel bolts, jam nuts are preferred and the Rockville buggies do come with these already. What you need to do is to tighten the bolt down against the wheel bearings enough to hold everything tight, but not too much to put excessive wear against the bearings or wheels. Then feed the bolt assembly into the rear axle. Once tight, use two wrenches and tighten both the bolt and the nut against the rear axle so that it seats up tight. You need to use two wrenches and turn them as one or you will tighten the nut against the axle but loosen it against the bearings.

You can do the same for the Peter Lynn buggies, just purchase some 20mm jam nuts and assemble them the same as above. As Bobby mentioned, you may need to purchase a longer rear axle bolt depending on the thickness of your jam nut to make sure you still have enough thread inside the rear axle to prevent any stripping issues.

For conversation only....you really only need to have a jam nut on one side. What this is for is if the bearings start to wear, or if they start to have some drag (or seize), the rotation of the wheel assembly could un-screw the axle bolt from the rear axle and cause the wheel to fall off. This only happens on one side though cuz on the other side if the bearings cause any drag it will tighten the bolt instead of loosen it. The jam nut locks the bolt against the rear axle so it is much harder to come loose.

sand flea - 18-1-2011 at 12:48 PM

The lock nut set up works well on the front of my PL also

rocfighter - 18-1-2011 at 05:02 PM

Tech tip, You only need the leanth of the threads to be as long as the diameter of the bolt. 1/2" bolt uses a 1/2" thick nut. Any longer bolt penetration is fine but no stroger in any way.

BeamerBob - 18-1-2011 at 06:46 PM

That makes sense. The same principal holds for overhangs in building structures.

garydog - 19-1-2011 at 09:10 AM

The problem I am having is that on the left rear tire the bolt holding the wheel on backs out with normal riding. I will have to look closer at using a jam nut. I tighten it before every ride and its loose every time when I am done. The front wheel is spooky and I am thinking of adding bicycle washers with the hooks that will hold the wheel on if the bolt falls out.

Thanks Dan

krumly - 23-1-2011 at 04:30 PM

I'd like to use jam nuts as opposed to Loctite or lockwashers. I currently just use Lanocote to prevent threads from galling - stuff works great. Anyone know where to get true 15mm threaded jam nuts that would fit the oddball PL rear axle bolts (NOT 12 mm or 20mm)?

Thanks,

krumly

rocfighter - 23-1-2011 at 05:48 PM

Any large chain hardware store should have a metric stainless hardware section.
I can get them here at Ace hardware. I think Home Depot and Lowes would have them as well.

krumly - 25-1-2011 at 04:07 PM

It's a weird thread, believe me. It's not ISO 14mm x 2.0 or 16mm x 2.0, which would make the local hardware store or McMaster Carr an easy solution. Kent at A Wind of Change supplied me with the Peter Lynn bolts. Still looking for jam nuts...

krumly

BeamerBob - 25-1-2011 at 04:12 PM

to my knowledge there are only 2 threads in a 20mm bolt. Coarse and fine. The PL uses the coarse thread. My Ivanpah uses a fine thread which in my mind is less likely to back out. The jam nut almost guarantees it won't. I'm not sure what threads are available in 15mm size bolts.

bigkid - 25-1-2011 at 04:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by krumly
I'd like to use jam nuts as opposed to Loctite or lockwashers. I currently just use Lanocote to prevent threads from galling - stuff works great. Anyone know where to get true 15mm threaded jam nuts that would fit the oddball PL rear axle bolts (NOT 12 mm or 20mm)?

Thanks,

krumly

I found that the 15mm is more commonly used in bicycle parts mostly the BMX Bikes. You may want to check out the local bike shop, would be interesting to see if they could help.

krumly - 27-1-2011 at 07:59 PM

Bigkid -

Great idea. I bet they use 15 mm axle bolts for bolt-on BMX and mountain bike hubs. Will check and see. Thanks,

krumly