rtz - 14-7-2011 at 07:10 PM
I think some people on this board have PL 8m and 10m Reactors. What is the lightest wind you can buggy in with these sizes?
That 10.8 has a really small wind range(5-10mph?)... What are some other "big" kites people are having good luck with on a buggy?
In my experience, near the end of the day when the wind starts dropping off(10mph going to 0), I can't buggy with either my 5m Flow or my 7m Frenzy.
I need something that I can. But I don't want to spend for a big Flysurfer right now.
Why are Yakuza's so expensive? How are they in light wind? Are they easy to make buckle, wad up, deflate, and collapse?
I think it's my Skydog that has the odd trait and characteristic where when it's at the extreme edge of the window at max pull and load, it can
suddenly go from that to either deflating hard and fast or wadding itself up. Very strange to see it make such a rapid transition like that. Often
though, it will do that, and drift back into the wind and power and wake up and come alive at full power, either with slack in the lines or not in a
great position in relation with the bug. Makes for some tense moments.
Kinda like that one when the kite crashes and it's kinda wadded/tangled on the ground and it recuperates on it's own and decides to hot launch. 
Been there before. Good times.
When I was first starting out, I'd wind up with the kite on the ground behind me and get removed from the bug when it would hot launch and I wouldn't
expect it to or didn't know it would. Now I jump out of the buggy to deal with the hot launch if I even think it has a chance of doing what it used
to do. 
I often think about all the stuff that used to happen to me when I was first starting out and how it doesn't now. Pretty satisfying.
One time, I got removed(OBE) from the buggy like 3 days in a row. I got worked a few other times. Not anymore. That stuff just doesn't happen now.
Either I don't let it, or I prevent it. I think more so; I take measures to ensure it won't or can't happen!
Would that 10.8 be a good choice when the wind is 10mph and failing? How about in conditions of 3 or 4 mph gusting to 8mph?
Is it a heavy kite?
stetson05 - 14-7-2011 at 07:53 PM
I saw some pretty impressive results with the 13m and 16m PL vapors last summer. With good flying skills others were riding in the 3-4mph range. I
saw other riding JoJo's but the vapor seemed to be doing better. Above 4mph I was able to ride my flysurfer which I saw you aren't ready to spring
for. My 11m Neo has worked, once inflated, pretty close to 5mph on the beach on hard pack. I think a reactor is a good choice too but I don't know
much about the wind range.
rtz - 14-7-2011 at 07:57 PM
I was just starting to get kinda use to the price of the big Reactors. Then I looked at the Vapor's... Kinda like Yak prices. Still looking at all
my options.
DAKITEZ - 14-7-2011 at 08:52 PM
I still have the 10m ul Cooper here that popeye brought over for nabx. It fits in the same category as the rII and is priced very well
BeamerBob - 14-7-2011 at 09:44 PM
On the RIIs, the 8.6 is good from about 7-8 up to about 12 mph if I remember correctly. That was on hardpacked sand. The 10.8 will get you in that
4-5 mph range and yes, you will need to land it if you get over 9-10. Kite skill plays a roll to get to the bottom of the kite's capability. The
largest of arcs 18-19m (and of course a 24 if you have it) can fly in the same territory as well if you can get them filled. They give you a little
more range on the top end as well. Angus and I flew his 18 phanny and 10.3 RI together one day in St. Augustine when I couldn't roll with my 8.3 RI.
Hope this helps.
John Holgate - 15-7-2011 at 01:24 AM
I think I got a couple of extra mph in the bottom end of my 6.5m Method when I swapped to 30m lines - allowed the kite to spend a lot more time in the
power zone doing loops and fig 8's to get me going in about 6mph or so. Try really long lines (if you have the room) on your 5m Flow - or put two
sets together. You might be surprised and it'll cost you nothing to try if you've got a couple of line sets.
Whenever I went from 30m lines back to 18m on my Beamer 4m, it always felt like someone had cut half the kite off!
My eyes were opened a year ago at Sandy Point in light winds - 8m Vapor, 11m Frenzy, big Flysurfers etc and here was Nigel on a 4m PL Core easily
keeping up with them (I was struggling on a 9.5m Montana). Nigel has been flying for many years and it proved to me that it's not always about the
size of the kite 
Krohn1999 - 15-7-2011 at 03:31 AM
VAPOR VAPOR VAPOR!!
there is nothing better.
Big GT's are too heavy and like to fold up if you don't keep the tension on
ripsessionkites - 15-7-2011 at 04:59 AM
If you refer to any of my vids on vimeo, most of them are the Vapor 16.
In 2010 we had black / red and custom red vapors
In 2011 we have blue / or and the orange / grey
Just for your info when watching.
You can ride in next to nothing with a full race buggy so imagine how much lighter with a small light buggy.
You want to ride in low winds there is a price for it. Fixed is still cheaper than depower. In the lightest of winds you need to have the extra
control for turning.
Dunno your skill level but if you have to pick between RII and Vapor, go Vapor.
I fly mine on 17m lines but if you should try it on 20m first.
BigMikesKites - 15-7-2011 at 05:25 AM
You are in the same boat as me. You are on grass, so you need more kite than you think. I got going 18 mph with a 5.5m Reactor on the beach in 5
mph wind. But a 5.5m won't cut it on grass.
I love both the Reactor and the Vapor. Completely different animals and in my opinion, the Vapor has alot more oomph/size so you could get a
smaller Vapor.
But I have figured out on grass, the vapor wants to drag you at a higher speed than you (or at least I) can overcome with the friction from the
grass, so it spends its time in front where the Reactor hangs a little farther back. On hard packed beach, both sit right where you want them at 9
or 3 oclock, just the speeds they produce are different.
Unless you are moving or have someplace hard packed, I think the Reactor is going to suit you better and save you some money to boot.
Bladerunner - 15-7-2011 at 06:44 AM
I am consistantly impressed with how well my soft old $200 9m Blade II performs ? It is my beater low wind kite but never disapoints.
Makes me wonder about the 8.5m newer Blades?
I agree, I like the 10.8 but would like a bit more range + depower. ( but that's just me )
Lately my 18m Phanny has continued to perform as the wind drops to 5 -7 . Below that we just don't have the room to run.
kitemaker4 - 15-7-2011 at 07:37 AM
Large nasa wings.
Susan (npw goddess)
ripsessionkites - 15-7-2011 at 08:00 AM
If you can try both before you purchase from a shop. I would suggest that.
If you can wait a few weeks you can borrow my vapor 11m / 16m. Sorry I dont use RIIs.
In the meantime it's going to Arkay to have something big enough to ride with CoolB.
cheezycheese - 15-7-2011 at 09:00 AM
Well, I would like to add (and please correct my newbie opinion if I'm off base) flying a kite in low winds definitely requires some skill. I found it
to be a lot more challenging than riding in 10-20 mph winds. It's not as simple as buy a big kite problem solved. You've really got to fly that kite
and build some apparent wind before the fun starts. I got a great lesson in sub 10mph winds from Kiteguru out at Nahant Ma. I had a real hard time
keeping the kite in the air at first, but Dean whipped me into shape. I had to use downloops (which I was afraid to do before) and basically keep the
kite moving until I got some real apparent wind going) but overall it was my most satisfying session. PB that day was 22.9mph with a 6.7 Core winds
were 8-11mph smooth onshore...
I definitely think it makes a better kiter out of you...
Just saying... 
dylanj423 - 15-7-2011 at 10:26 AM
currently there is a 9m century used on the forum for sale cheap... id recommend that (sorry guys tryin to sell)... i have buggied with that very kite
in next to no wind (on grass), and felt a wee bit overpowered at the beach in 5mph winds...
lots o power in that guy... contact heliboy if your interested
pyro22487 - 15-7-2011 at 09:11 PM
wow i just happened to stumble into this i may get myself a larger kite now just for light wind apparwent no wind days. my 14 frenzy needs wind to get
up in the air but ive never buggied with a depower. i am going to have to try it now darn the bad luck i work this weekend.
fletcht - 16-7-2011 at 09:25 PM
I really like my 10 M Century Soulfly with the 6.6 fabric for the conditions you speak of.
The 12.5 will get the job done as well I just don't have the hours with it yet.