Power Kite Forum

Buggying with a LEI

apextech - 26-8-2011 at 05:44 PM

I'd like to know others experiences with using a LEI to buggy with.

I just a good session using a 12m Caution Zombie in @ 10-12 mph and was powered up pretty good (trim strap, full power, bar pretty much all the way out). Flew it kinda like it was a Foil, just sining it up and down through the window and initiating turns early, sheeting at the bottom turns for power, trying not to slack the lines of that big 'ol kite so it didn't spank me. When I first power stroked it to get going I gave it a bit much and it nearly yanked me right out of the bug.

I found it size wise to be similar to my 7.5 Apex III depower foil, but with more grunt off the bottom end. Actually both kites fly in a minimum of 8 mph, but you really have to work the Apex at that wind speed, not so much the Zombie.

Once I got to be a little proficient with self launching and landing the LEI, it make it a whole lot easier to deal with, the exception is if you get out of shape with the inflatable it can hurt you or the kite, whereas the foil can be pretty much quickly flagged out. Also the LEI when the wind drops or lulls alot will want to Hindenburg so again possibly hurting the kite.

I found as kite size goes up my percentage of successful self landings goes down, as I had one instance of a relaunch as was trying to land it at the edge of the window, can be kinda scary with a kite with that much pull.

All in all I look forward to more of this, I figure the 12m is good to @ 15 mph, so 8-15, the 9m from @ 13-20 and I have a 6m for more than that. I dont think I'll pull out the 15m for this as its gonna be too slow in the turns to be practical but I wonder if you could buggy in 5 mph wind with it?

Anyone else care to chime in on this?

markite - 26-8-2011 at 06:08 PM

A friend of mine that moved to Ireland buggies a lot with twinskins and race foils and he said one big guy uses his LEI and Mike has a hard time catching him once in a while. We talked about whether a small LEI in a buggy would be any good but for a number of reasons I prefer to either have my arcs or a foil I can drop and flag if needed. Then another friend recently posted a video of a guy kiteboarding with a 2.5 UNO LEI and the kite is fast....especially at the end when it hammers the water like a jet, imagine that on a dry lake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEkssXm2QFM&feature=playe...

RedSky - 26-8-2011 at 09:40 PM

If the kite Hindenburg's and if you're quick enough then run and catch it. :yes:

Those wind ranges look a little on the low side. You really need a heavy bug to tame LEI's.

apextech - 26-8-2011 at 10:07 PM

Markite, what was the wind blowin' in that vid? I loved the sound that zippy kite made on the way down, if it were a lakebed I could picture it disintegrating on impact.

RedSky, judging by your signature I take it you fly LEI's exclusively, can you enlighten me a bit of your experience, I see Fuels which means "C" kites, I didnt really think of them as buggy engines, but again I'm just trying this out, more so as a way to get to know my water kites as I progress that way.

What size bow kites do you like in a given wind range? I tried first my 6m, followed by the 9m in @ 10-12 both were a no go until I got the 12m out and it seemed to work really well as long as the wind didnt lull below 8 mph, but frankly I see where a solid 10 mph would work well and then start to trim from there till I run out of strap or cannot turn efficiently.

I like the idea of breaking the Hindenburg's fall, the only thing about running toward the kite to catch it is that if it gathered itself enough to take off again with the slacked lines. I dont know if it wouldn't be better to try to pull a half asked self landing to point it into the wind as it came down. I think next time I'll only put it up if the wind meter is lulling to 8 or 9 mph which means around here gusting 13-14. Still the kite is pulling real strong at 10 so I guess I would put some trim into it.

RedSky - 4-10-2011 at 08:21 PM

Apologies for the delayed reply.

The Fuels are absolutely awesome in the bug. If you like to loop for some aggressive downloop powerslides then there's no better kite. On the other-hand if you want to go fast then Fuels are speed limited in the bug due to their lack of depower.

That's where the bow kite come in. The Crossbows take an eternity to loop compared to Fuels. I can normally loop the Fuel twice before the Crossbow make a single revolution, but they have huge wind ranges and masses of depower and safety. They're also built for one purpose, speed!

My favourite kite was the 9m 2010 xbow until I lost it. It best suited my local beach conditions. 20-30mph wind range.

Wow! you have all the Zombies. I'd be tempted to use the 15m in 10-12mph.

What's the 7.5m Apex like ?

apextech - 4-10-2011 at 09:56 PM

Redsky, againb thanks for the reply. You have a KiteCat ! Wow that must be fun, I just bought a Windrider 16 trimaran which I will eventually outfit for use with the Zombies.

I would pull out the 15, but it definitely would be a slow turner compared to its smaller brethren and I dont know if its suited to being a bug engine. Someday I'd like to find a Zombie 4m if for nothing else to round out the mark, but they are rather rare though I do live @ 30 miles from the Caution home base and have gotten to know those guys a bit, they take care of the kites when needed which is mainly why I fly them.

Frankly the Apex III 7.5 has been my go to kite, I get more use out of it than anything else in the quiver, for buggying it has a good amount of depower and a good wind range as well, @ 8-15, between that and the Apex 5m, I'm pretty much covered to @ 20 kts. where my skill drops off from there.

As I mentioned I just started to fly the LEI's on the beach and am finding the 12 and 9 to be the best choices I have to choose from.

bigkahuna - 5-10-2011 at 12:26 AM

@apextech - This is a bit OT, but since you're in Monterey I'm assuming you kite in the ocean also, right? How are those Zombies in waves? I'm looking for a kite to replace my Bularoo 16m and I've been impressed with Caution kites in the past.

apextech - 5-10-2011 at 09:12 AM

Caution is all about wave riding, I am aspiring to get to that point myself but am hampered by lack of skill, all of the guys at that company are surfers and they designed their kites so they could surf as many waves in a session as possible, for a surf kite I could think of no more focused design, Take a look at the Mayhem X and the new Spitfires as well.

RedSky - 11-10-2011 at 02:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by apextech
Redsky, againb thanks for the reply. You have a KiteCat ! Wow that must be fun, I just bought a Windrider 16 trimaran which I will eventually outfit for use with the Zombies.

I would pull out the 15, but it definitely would be a slow turner compared to its smaller brethren and I dont know if its suited to being a bug engine. Someday I'd like to find a Zombie 4m if for nothing else to round out the mark, but they are rather rare though I do live @ 30 miles from the Caution home base and have gotten to know those guys a bit, they take care of the kites when needed which is mainly why I fly them.

Frankly the Apex III 7.5 has been my go to kite, I get more use out of it than anything else in the quiver, for buggying it has a good amount of depower and a good wind range as well, @ 8-15, between that and the Apex 5m, I'm pretty much covered to @ 20 kts. where my skill drops off from there.

As I mentioned I just started to fly the LEI's on the beach and am finding the 12 and 9 to be the best choices I have to choose from.


I had to Google the Windrider 16 Trimaran. I thought it was going to be a sit on board type of thing. WOW! Just seen the video of it! Obviously you can take the sail off easily enough and use the Zombies, but damn! That's a whole lot better than the KiteCat. Now I'm tempted.

TBH I haven't used mine at all this year. After a minor car accident I had to buy another means of transport and bought a cheap pickup without thinking how I'd get the KiteCat on it.

Need to weld in a roof rack of some sort. Can't wait to use it again though.

I was asking about the 7.5m Apex as my friend has the 5m which he bought for just £40 off eBay. I laughed as he was setting it up for the first time. No way will it be any good I said. Well he had the last laugh. So stable even in gusty inland winds. Very enjoyable kite to fly in the buggy.

AD72 - 11-10-2011 at 08:02 PM

So you use LEIs for the Kitecat? I would have thought the autozenith of the ARCs would be better. I still need to get mine repaired and out on the water. I have been kitesurfing with my LEIs every chance I get. Maybe I will try them out with the buggy.

RedSky - 12-10-2011 at 06:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AD72
So you use LEIs for the Kitecat? I would have thought the autozenith of the ARCs would be better. I still need to get mine repaired and out on the water. I have been kitesurfing with my LEIs every chance I get. Maybe I will try them out with the buggy.


I started with the Venom in the kitecat but found that I was fighting with the auto-zenith the whole time.

I had a scary moment last year and wished I was flying the Venom.

I sailed about a mile off-shore, way past all the other kitesurfers flying a HadlowPro which I borrowed from a landboarder friend.

Anyway, somehow the lines went slack and the chicken loop unhooked (no dick!) The kite back-stalled and landed on the water trailing edge down in the ready to hot launch position. Then it launched hard with me flying unhooked, arms out stretched, standing on the foot-pegs!

It back-stalls again onto it's trailing edge. The Kitecat has now stopped moving forward and I've lost all steering. Without steering the kitecat started to turn side on to the waves and the lines went under the floats. Then I realise in my haste to get onto the water I forgot my leash. If I pop the safety I loose the kite and if the kite launches now it will flip the kitecat.

I've got no life jacket or lid and if it goes over I'd have to make a choice, either say goodbye to the kitecat or my friends kite.

Thankfully it never launched. I held it down by giving it full power and held it there in terror for an hour as I very slowly drifted in to shore and a mile downwind. That was a hell of a walk back up the beach lifting a 50Kg kitecat.

Imagine if the wind was off-shore! Not that I would be on the water in off-shore, but I'd still be out there as a skeleton rounding the Horn. :lol: