I'm a senior at OU going for my IT degree and in my database class we need to build a database along with an application for it. I had the idea to do
a quiver builder. I was just wondering if you guys had any extra ideas for it, or if you had a spot with a wealth of information on kites and what
properties did you guys think would be the best to put down.
I was going to have it so the user would create an account/login, with that you would enter your weight so it has that on record. Using that can tell
the wind range for certain kites/sizes. You can either use it to build a collection of the quiver you already own or create a wish list. It will then
show all the important information about the kites, including the wind ranges it would be good for you, activites good for, name, size, projected
area, etc. Was also thinking about having some sort of forum output to add to sigs of what kites people have (thatd be extra if I had time).flyguy0101 - 26-1-2012 at 10:52 AM
i think its a great idea- gonna require a lot of research if you want to try to get all brands and types of kites- might want to limit it to the more
"popular" ones. ie- peter lynn, HQ, flexifoil, flysurfer also would recommend for simplicity to avoid the thousands of LEI variants. Other idea would
be to contact the companies and see if they can provide you with a "spec" sheet of their kites to reduce the searching and looking for info. martinipro - 26-1-2012 at 11:20 AM
I think this is awesome. I was thinking about building something like this for myself.
I graduated in Computer Science (Software Engineering) and would love to help if you need it.OmniSmurfZ - 26-1-2012 at 11:37 AM
Yea I was planning on picking a few popular brands to use at first just because that is a ton of information to put in. Good idea with trying to get a
spec sheet from them! Ill be sending them all some emails soon.
martini- Awesome! I'll let you know how its progressing and if I need any help. I'm not that great with programming so there is a definite
possibility.martinipro - 26-1-2012 at 11:47 AM
Cool. Ive done my fair share of Web Application Programming as well as Database design.
It'd be awesome if you can distinguish the usable wind ranges for the different disciplines.
Usually the ranges are listed as Water/Land. But we know the usable wind range is not the same for buggy and mountainboard.OmniSmurfZ - 26-1-2012 at 11:56 AM
Well I'm not even sure about the differences there either. I've never used a buggy or a mountain board haha. I'm still quite a noobie. But if you guys
can start giving me estimates about it? Then I can match them up with other kites with similar proj sizes n such..BeamerBob - 26-1-2012 at 01:43 PM
Good idea! I've thought about making a spreadsheet showing the range for each of my kites on a single sheet. Then make notes on it from realtime
experience at certain windspeeds. That would let me fine tune which kite I choose based on where I fall in the kite's MFR posted range. I have the
issue of needing a kite for 3 of us for most wind ranges. My younger son usually is running a 2 or 3m fixed bridle, Wexler is usually on the 7 or 9.5
Montanas, and I'm usually on a 3-5.4m fixed bridle.barnes - 26-1-2012 at 02:02 PM
I love thinking about these sorts of projects. My thoughts:
Use thee power of the community. Allow people to submit their quivers and their wind ranges. Average the user submitted data with the manufactures
data.
Make it hierarchal. Ie. Step one: What sports? (Snowkiting, kitesurf, buggy, landboard) > Step two: What is your weight? > Step three: What are
you local wind speeds? (Etc, etc.)
I've done my share of web dev stuff too, so if between the group of nerds we have, I am sure we can help you build something awesome. (Comp.
Engineering Student)Feyd - 26-1-2012 at 02:56 PM
And we wonder why there are so few ladies into kiting.Drewculous - 27-1-2012 at 07:58 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Feyd
And we wonder why there are so few ladies into kiting.
PHREERIDER - 27-1-2012 at 08:29 AM
it would be nice indeed, to help newb get a grip on the scope of things.Feyd - 28-1-2012 at 05:13 AM
Where would you source your data?OmniSmurfZ - 2-2-2012 at 11:47 AM
From the various sites I'm pulling the information from I guess. I emailed most of the vendors and none of them could send me a file with all the
specs, they just linked me to their product pages and said heres all the info!lamrith - 2-2-2012 at 12:05 PM
I started a DB in excel with kite specs a while back. It is a daunting undertaking for sure.. If you PM me your email addy I can send you the
limited data I have together..Feyd - 2-2-2012 at 12:06 PM
Yup.
It seems to me that the information and ranges provided by the manufatcurers is at best subjective. Really how could it not be? Unless they specify
that the ratings are based on a given rider at a given skill level in a certain range of enviromental variables on a certain board, ski or buggy.
Who would have time for that?
The performance data IMO is there purely as reference. They have to supply something as a baseline, even if in reality in means very little over a
broad spectrum of users. It's a jmping off point but the reality is that you never really know what the kite will do, for YOU, until you have it in
your hot little hands.
Now you can source data from rider input. Say you got feedback from riders in this forum for example. That data would be about as useful as the data
the manufacturers supply you on the websites.
If you put a given rider on a given kite, even in the same enviromental conditions, your results of what that kite can or can't do may vary greatly
from rider to rider. Your performance data is only going to be as good as the rider that supplies it.
For example I'm going to tell you that an Arc will do a lot more than someone who has less expirience with them and less flying abiltity. I've
managed to race Arcs in winds that some will say Arcs aren't worth flying in and have come out on top so my data on wind ranges of a given Arc will
vary considerably from someone else's.
I can see perhaps if you did it simply based on PA, AR, and turn rate you could get a rough estimate of what kites would be appropriate for a given
rider in a given situation. But it would still be a pretty loose recommendation I think.stetson05 - 2-2-2012 at 12:38 PM
I think user data entry and averaging good data would be very helpful to making your site grow. The data must be accurate. I just signed up with www.trakdat.com and they use local windalert sites matched to your post to illustrate recorded conditions not just, I could ride in 3mph.
I think a variable of surfaces could be beneficial too. Water takes more power as does thick long soft grass. Hard grassy ground takes less energy
to initiate rolling as does snow for sliding. Hardpack beach and ice take very little power to to get rolling. I ride mostly on grass so when I ride
at the beach my low end of a kite is much broader than at my local fields. It takes some getting used to.
This is where good user data would be beneficial. The trouble is how do you decide if the data is accurate and not just boasting. For example, I
think the flexboardz rolls easier over rough surfaces than my other mountain boards. I am working on ways to prove that so the data is accurate and
not just boasting my opinions.
Back to the point. Wind range and quiver building varies by rider weight, vehicle ridden, and surface type. I recommend building database with
manufacture specs and augmenting it with accurate rider data.macboy - 2-2-2012 at 12:53 PM
And have a look at the Arc Wind Range Calculator. It'll give you a good idea on how they do it.
Great idea! Can't wait to sign up!Feyd - 2-2-2012 at 03:02 PM
I agree with stetson. Rider weight, vehicle and surface are the best starting point you have.
If and when you get his show going eventually for the sake of accuracy. If you REALLY want to geek it out. You'll have to take into consideration
things like air temp, humidity,gust factor and frequency etc.
For snowkiting you could really go over the top and specify snow temp, crystal structure concerning old/new snow, base structure of the board or ski
in mm (crosshatch or linear or mixed) snow moisture, wax temp and flouro on non flouro wax. Ski length and carve radius would have an effect as well.
I'm not making this up by the way.
RIder: Sirius Dog.
weight: 185lbs
Vehicle: Skis 210 Salomon DH >40m carve radius. 9mm crosshatch structure. Wax temp 10-30f. Flourinated.
Surface:Lake ice with layer of 4 day old sun exposed snow. 130mm deep. Old snow/round crystal/high moisture.
I could go on but I'm too lazy which would also be something to work around, those of us that are too lazy to fill out the required data to get a
useful database.
You'll have to be sure to publicize it well to get the most input you can. I say thins while I cringe at the data you would get from something like
Kiteforum. Steton's trakdat seems a real good idea there.
It's slick. But it looks like I need a celly to use it and I don't own a cell phone. On top of that most places I ride have no cell coverage so I
would not be able to contribute?stetson05 - 2-2-2012 at 03:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Feyd
...trakdat seems a real good idea there.
It's slick. But it looks like I need a celly to use it and I don't own a cell phone. On top of that most places I ride have no cell coverage so I
would not be able to contribute?
You actually don't need the cell phone to put it in. You can put it in from home after. If the station is close enough you can get great info on the
day. The trick seems to be putting in the spots.
Phreerider used to post some of the weather from wundermap on his daily grind posts but this is integrated. Nice not to have to do the extra work and
save time for kiting and editing video.OmniSmurfZ - 2-2-2012 at 06:22 PM
You guys are making me feel oh so over whelmed with this, haha.
Don't get me wrong I love to go all out on so many things (my buddies stick that as one of my main characteristics), but this is just one project for
one class during my last semester of school (I have a senior project class as well) and I have an internship. So I'm not exactly shooting for the moon
right off the bat... Bottom line for what Id want done by the end of the semester is a database filled with a collection of kite data. The application
will take in your experience, weight, desired surface/activites and display a list of suitable kites for each wind range. Of course its not static
information and some people can make some things work and others cant, this is just an in general thing. This would be a viable way for a newbie to
plan out how they would like to get into the sport and build up their quiver. Another aspect id like to have but itd be extra is a forum signature
output to show kites that a user already does own with a nice graphic about it.
WR = Wind Range then weight of the user. 100-119, 120-139, etc..
Not sure this is going to be the best way to do it.. Let me know what you think.Feyd - 3-2-2012 at 07:05 AM
Expirience is a tough one to guage. Do you do it by years, flight hours, our mileage?
A lot of people have a lot of years but limited hours in those years.
Some people have a lot of hours but limited years.
And unless you carry a GPS full time and keep a log very few people will have mileage recorded.
Some people ride year round some don't.
Then you have to take into account location. A rider that get's all his/her sessions in butter coastal winds won't have the same expirience level of
an inland rider who get's nothing but nasty dog poo winds.
I've only been riding for 10yrs. I ride inland on mountain lakes in pretty dirty wind. My average sessions are between 4-8 hrs and last month I had
16 sessions. Last year I pulled almost 3000 miles. But, I don't ride in the summer. So I have years, and hours but I only ride 6 months out of the
year.
I think a combination of years/flight hours would be the easiest way to measure expirience.Telestrat - 3-2-2012 at 09:55 AM
Not sure if this helps but it might be a start in the right direction. The attached spreadsheet is for windsurfing but maybe you can convert it into
quiver/kite spreadsheet? Diretions are on the spreadsheet but basically you plug in either your weight, wind or sail size and it figures out what you
need for sail, size windsurf board and/or windspeed that would work best.
Hope it helps (hope i did the attachment thingy right.....)Telestrat - 3-2-2012 at 09:58 AM
looks like the attachment didn't work. I clicked on "browse" under "attachement" at bottom of email and plugged in the file name.
I guess that is wrong way? If someone knows how to do it let me know and I'll try it again.
Thanks.OmniSmurfZ - 3-2-2012 at 11:16 AM
Do a rapidshare link or something? I'm not sure about how to do it on these forums.
Hours/years is good, but I was also thinking about just doing a radio box with a set amount as well.
Noob/Novice/Beginner/Intermediate/Expert/ProStatus or something like that. Estimated hours would work really well too. But yea I know what you mean
about where you go. I only started kiting last summer and the only times I've done it is on inland soccer fields, nothing but gusty crap. I'm sure
when I get my first good wind session it'll be amazing haha.Feyd - 6-2-2012 at 03:18 PM
If you learn in the gusty you'll feel like a damn rockstar in smooth winds. It's amazingwhat you can get used to when it's all you have.:tumble:
