Power Kite Forum

NASA Kite for super low wind?

Flyfish - 2-7-2012 at 09:42 AM

So... I've been trying to push the envelope on super low wind kiting in the waves. I'm able to ride in around 8-10 knots using a 19 meter Venom and a super wide fish surfboard. but it's work. I know guys are doing great with 21 m speeds, but I don't need that high of an aspect ratio kite. I really just need to have a kite barely pulling me on a plane so I can then start ridding waves.
Here's my question:
What about using a NASA kite? I'd love everyone's thoughts on weather one would work using just raw grunt. I've watched videos of the kites with buggies and skateboards, but I just wonder if they are too slow for a surfboard.
What do you guys think?

John Holgate - 2-7-2012 at 02:59 PM

Here's an extract from one of Peter Lynn's 2012 newsletters:


Quote:

Another reason is that a few years ago we showed conclusively that NASA style single skin kites are surprisingly better upwind than I expected theoretically. NASA's pull very strongly for their size, but don't fly at a very high angle. However, they are the best light wind traction kites there are; will fly in almost nothing, especially when made of now available lightweight (like 15gm/sq.m) fabrics. We found by repeated comparative testing using two identical kite cats, that a 20sq.m NASA would always beat a 20sq.m Arc around any upwind/downwind course up to at least 15km/hr true wind. Which can't be true but is. The technical term for this is cognitive dissonance- things that our rationalising brain structures cause us to ignore because they don't align with our general world view. But facts are facts whether we agree with them or not, and this is a fact that I've begun to like so much that in this case I'm going to change my mind and accept. Because it's a partial answer to the light wind problem for kite sailing. The rest of the answer is maybe to chooses windier places to sail.


And here's Steffen Born with a 7m Nasa Star 2 kite boarding in what looks like very little wind....




I don't kite board (yet) but I have been pondering the same questions for light wind buggying. The 7m Nasa Star will get me going in 5 knots pretty easily and there's a 10m in the mail. They are also a fraction of the cost of large foils and pack down to very little...

A little while ago I had the 4m Nasa Star 2 up against a 4m Ozone Flow and was surprised about how little difference between the two kites there was in performance. When the wind started to get up to around 16-20 knots, the Flow had a 1 or 2 mph advantage. In the lighter winds, the Nasa Star had the advantage. A little less upwind ability but was never a problem.

Definitely food for thought....

Flyfish - 3-7-2012 at 09:05 AM

Thank you again John! Thanks also for the emails! I've watched your videos a bunch of times also just trying to study the way the kite pulls. Your description of a two stroke versus a landcruser in 4x4 low makes sence.
Does the kite generate power by sineing it also? It seems like they turn on a dime so turn rate doesn't seem to be a problem at all.
I'm super close to just trying one out!

John Holgate - 3-7-2012 at 03:15 PM

It does make power by sineing the kite, but because it makes good power at slow speed, the difference is smaller. Whereas my Methods for instance make very little power at slow speed but a lot of power when moving fast - sort of 2-stroke like whereas the Nasa's only have low range 1st gear. Hmmm, a pretty crude analogy but that's what comes to mind.

I notice in the kiteboarding video, Steffen is sineing the kite when he's on the board. It would probably only take another knot or two and it would be park and ride.

Turn rate is definitely no problem - even on the bar. You can turn them faster on handles too. Landing is a bit more tricky - at least with the bar setup. Dumping to the center line will result in a few spins on the way down, then I find I have to sand the trailing edge before launch.....not quite as straight forward as parking a foil on it's brakes...

Not sure if I've put this video up, but here's the 4m on handles - which is the first and only time I've actually flown the Nasa's on handles. Works just fine....