Power Kite Forum

Coming very soon, the most advanced production buggy on the planet

popeyethewelder - 28-10-2012 at 07:50 AM

Exciting times ahead PREVIEW HERE

WELDNGOD - 28-10-2012 at 08:25 AM

WOW!

silvereaglekiter - 28-10-2012 at 11:38 AM

$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$
:eekdrull::eekdrull::eekdrull:

BeamerBob - 28-10-2012 at 11:48 AM

That suspension fork is interesting. I guess since they are a boat mfr. they made all the hardware corrosion resistant. I'd like to see what the rest of it looks like too.

pyro22487 - 28-10-2012 at 06:07 PM

It looks like carbon fiber very pricey and light as hell. I am all for light but this might verge on too light.

popeyethewelder - 29-10-2012 at 10:47 AM

More info and photos added......thoughts?

Kober - 29-10-2012 at 10:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by popeyethewelder
More info and photos added......thoughts?




oh...yes..... I want win one on next WBB raffle .....

That buggy looks like out of this world .... I am sure they need awesome team rider like my self ..... lol .... who do I contact ??

thanson2001ok - 29-10-2012 at 10:54 AM

Wow, that looks like a million bucks. Hopefully it costs less.

The suspension makes it look like a smooth ride. A solid seat, not so sure. I wonder if you can adjust the seat at all for fit and tuning.

BeamerBob - 29-10-2012 at 11:28 AM

That looks like a fairly high seat position. It might actually be worse than it looks if the seat has thickness. If that seat is structural, I'd be interested in how sturdy the attachments points are. This might be the wave of the future of buggying but I want to see all the details and discover if the expensive materials actually offer advantages over current techniques. Also wondering about what the suspension does under high load and high traction like I ride in.

g00fba11 - 29-10-2012 at 11:48 AM

Now get rid if the tires and slap some skis or snowboards on that and I'm game....

Looks like serious dinero though.... They must think Kiters are rich....

That front suspension looks an aweful lot like on I saw on a PTW bug....

How Much$$$!!

skimtwashington - 29-10-2012 at 12:11 PM

McConaghy Boats (China)??

indigo_wolf - 29-10-2012 at 12:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by popeyethewelder
More info and photos added......thoughts?


The inverted suspension tubes make it looks like it would be prone to grit and dings on the smaller tube.




The lower curve of the downtube.... for some reason I find it worrisome. On almost every other buggy that area sweeps back. On this buggy, it sweeps forward very much like the lower cowl on a motorcyle. On a motorcycle, it makes sense as it generally directs cooler air to the oil cooler and/or radiator. On a buggy it seems like a catch point for beach debris or an unintended brake in soft sand conditions, where a swept back downtube would glance off.

Not sure about the one piece moncoque (?) seat. It might do away with the need for a belly pan on smaller impacts, but larger impacts might result in the need for an expensive replacement. Also not sure how well it would shed heat in warm weather condition as opposed to being a sweat box. Not to mention the caveats for initially touching dark bodywork that's been baking in the sun for a bit. Hopefully riders have asbestos and Nomex body parts.

Kudos and huzzahs, but in some ways it reminds me of Nemo Arms Titanium AR .308 Rifle... an exercise in design and fabrication capabilities, rather than something bound by day to day practicality and fiscal constraints. Not a bad thing, as long as you take it for what it is.

ATB,
Sam

indigo_wolf - 29-10-2012 at 12:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by g00fba11
That front suspension looks an aweful lot like on I saw on a PTW bug....


Yes it does look a lot like the leading link suspension on the PTWs inspired by Wayne Careek. The geometry is a bit different and elastomers are replaced by what looks like a pair of shocks and adjustments at the top of the shock.

I vaguely remember reading that elastomers were used for the low maintenance on long haul/distance runs. Not sure how much travel the shock adds. Would have been interesting if they had found a way to do it similar to the mono-shock layouts on current motorcycles.

ATB,
Sam

popeyethewelder - 29-10-2012 at 12:28 PM

Personally my first thought about this buggy, bearing in mind it is only a visual of the photos.

I would like to know where they think this buggy will sit in the market, certainly not the racing market, and that is where most of the money is spent....so if not the racing scene...who?....with the words "production buggy" I would assume we are talking hundreds not tens of buggies, so the pricing HAS to be right from the beginning.

My critique

I love the look of the front end, although the pegs look like they are on the leading link and so will move up and down, but the info says otherwise.

The swan neck is a work of art, I worry the bottom of the swan neck is too close to the ground, maybe the angle of the photo.

The monocoque, well it certainly looks state of the art, but is it practical....I hope it will not be a one shape fits all or even a small Medium or large, I have spent years getting the perfect fit for my body within my buggies, a small medium and large just doesn't cut it especially if the price is at the upper limits.

The rear axle is split in two and separated by two shocks, this is quite an old format, in fact I had a similar set up on the 06 Fandango buggy, although this looks far more sleek, but the action of this type of rear suspension is the same, the buggy will tilt or lean kite side and absorb energy from the kite, this is a bad thing we have learned over the years, if you do go down this route you need an anti roll bar to stop the tilting like in a car, suspension on the rear end unless you use the desert like Sand Yeti is really not needed. The stiffer the buggy the more energy is transferred to the wheels. A composite rear axle would have been much better and lighter.

I am not sure of the weight yet, but I would imagine any weight lost from using composite materials will be lost by adding 4 shocks and all the hardware needed to house these.

When I firs saw the front end I was excited, I guessed the body would be a monocoque type design, but I did not expect the rear end to be as it is....I was to be honest disappointed with the rear end, and I doubt the racing fraternity will have any interest in this buggy.

So again I ask who will this buggy be aimed at?....the cruising running up and down the beach type of pilot, I guess that would be most of us then....I don’t know myself, I look at this new production buggy and think yes it does look modern and ground breaking, but is it any better in performance than the buggy I already have....and purely just from looking at the photos I have to say NO.

I hope the The Hobbs McConaghy Buggy team go onto make a huge impact in the kite buggy scene, and I hope they sell 1000s of buggies, THIS IS GREAT FOR THE BUGGY COMMUNITY THAT A MAN AND A COMPANY HAVE THE MONEY AND BALLS TO PUSH THE BAR HIGHER THA IT HAS BEEN BEFORE, I believe they are onto something in some areas....and kind of forgot about a buggy of the future in other areas and concentrated of buggies of the past.....I believe this buggy is a prototype, so hopefully after extensive testing in the next few weeks, they will have the options of tweaking a few areas.

The very best of luck to Dave Hobbs & McConaghy

Clive - 29-10-2012 at 07:43 PM

Certainly a high tech looking unit, and if as is reported it will be at speed week ( sandy point Australia ) there will be a queue to have a look and who knows maybe a ride.

Including me. :singing:

erratic winds - 29-10-2012 at 07:53 PM

I like it very much, it's absolutely a product from a bleeding-edge-advanced racing company. I am with PTW, fun times ahead as people throw new ideas or new executions of ideas not deemed feasible into the ring.

MDK - 29-10-2012 at 08:23 PM

I agree with pops on the rear axle being split is not a good idea, but I have to point out that it appears the rear axle drops down just before the wheels making the roll center pretty high at the split, is it high enough to minimize the pull from the kite? I Still like the solid composite axle idea better.

Kamikuza - 29-10-2012 at 10:03 PM

Oh wow :o

silvereaglekiter - 30-10-2012 at 05:09 AM

Im seeing a CF "keel" maybe the seat pod can slide for the adjustment :puzzled:

snowspider - 30-10-2012 at 05:16 AM

I can't imagine that the fellas would have missed the tilt /lean issue. I hope that the rear axle configuration is a design feature that will compensate for it.
A beautiful light weight beach cruiser I can understand but for rocketing the lake beds they will need hard points to mount weights.

pbc - 30-10-2012 at 05:51 AM

They have those quick release wheels. Maybe it would be easy to pop them off, slide on some free weights, and reattach the wheels. Get yourself some kite buggy accessories.

Philip

acampbell - 30-10-2012 at 06:33 AM

yeah about the only thing practical here is the use of quick release fittings.
I normally welcome change and new ideas but I think that a phone call or e-mail to Popeye would have saved the designer an awful lot of time and money.

Why use exotic composites to save weight when a lot of riders would want to add weight? That's what Philip was getting at, I think. This does not look like a freestyle rig, after all.

FWIW Popeye, I think the foot pegs are cantilevered forward off of the fork downtubes and are not on the suspension links.

But I will say that it is kind of cool looking and it sounds like the designer had fun with the project.

At the end of the day, if the geometry is right, it will likely be a good ride and that is a good thing.

Bladerunner - 30-10-2012 at 06:33 AM

A major factor for me and many entering the market is portabilaty and storage ?

I am finding my simple 1 bolt , throw it in the back seat , tiny Frankin'buggy has still got a place in the shed and out on the beach.

I was thinking what Poppeye is right away. Who will actually want this? Beach / dune riders ? Shocks on a race buggy ? Not folks just entering and without a method of transport + storage.


I think this is fantastic and hope they make a ton of buggies ! They look the bomb but I can't see one fitting in my shed or car ? I see this as a drawback to selling to the masses?

bigkid - 30-10-2012 at 06:56 AM

It will be interesting to see how this works out with the "Let me try it" guys with the soul desire to break it.
I have been working with a Carbon Fiber Company for the decks of the Flexboardz. What a nightmare. A simple flat design is not strong, you need to add angles and dimensions to the design, that is where the carbon fiber shines. If the down tube was just a round or rectangle shape it would not be as strong as the shape of this new bug. A simple round tube is not as strong as a baseball bat shape, unless you add more material and now the cost goes up and so does the weight.
I see the seat is with out side rails back to the rear axle, wonder what they used to give the mounting point of the axles its strength?
Time will tell how it pans out.

I would like to know if it floats? Does it come with any oars? Maybe a trolling motor for the windless days? A place for a cold drink and a holder for my fishing pole? A spot between the rider and the rear axle would be good for holding your catch of the day or as a cooler.

Bobby, this opens the door for a new name for the buggy, beach boat, amphi bug, the possibilities are endless.:lol:

All kidding aside, I think the idea of using CF is a good thing but a boat company?
I hope this Engineer didn't over think the idea, would hate to see a new mouse trap that doesn't catch mice. Might end up like the Ford Edsel.

indigo_wolf - 30-10-2012 at 09:06 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bigkid
All kidding aside, I think the idea of using CF is a good thing but a boat company?


A boat company makes a lot of sense and mirrors millions of years of evolution.

Natural progression from amphibian to land based....




;)

ATB,
Sam

bigkid - 30-10-2012 at 09:32 AM

OK Sam, but just to make it clear, NONE of my ancestors have long hairy arms, and I do not like bananas.:lol:

pbc - 30-10-2012 at 09:39 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by acampbell
...
Why use exotic composites to save weight when a lot of riders would want to add weight? That's what Philip was getting at, I think. This does not look like a freestyle rig, after all.
...


Who me? I was just enjoying the comic possibilities of turning the rear axle into a bar bell.

Philip

popeyethewelder - 30-10-2012 at 10:48 AM

Many more details of the Buggy have now been added plus a photo of the designer Dave Hobbs using the buggy

Latest details HERE

popeyethewelder - 30-10-2012 at 12:41 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by snowspider
I can't imagine that the fellas would have missed the tilt /lean issue. I hope that the rear axle configuration is a design feature that will compensate for it.
A beautiful light weight beach cruiser I can understand but for rocketing the lake beds they will need hard points to mount weights.


I dont think tilting was taken into consideration, and its not too light either at 58kgs

MDK - 30-10-2012 at 01:04 PM

There seems to be some design features to combat the roll or tilting from the load of the kite, but why when you can just use a solid axel, simple, and I don’t think it is too difficult to store a 60 in. axel in your car is it? The quick disassembly is nice but I will still break out a wrench for a solid axel. Is it a race buggy? If not where do you put cargo? Extra kites and so on. A big A+ for style though, the thing looks awesome! Most definitely racecar inspired, may be a little too much racecar, they can’t be any more different as far as where the power comes from and how the chassis reacts to that power. They have to be annoyed with our critique, but hopefully they will take it in a positive way. I respect all the work that has gone into it.

popeyethewelder - 30-10-2012 at 01:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by MDK
They have to be annoyed with our critique, but hopefully they will take it in a positive way. I respect all the work that has gone into it.


I have had contact with Dave Hobbs who is watching forums around the world and he is more than happy with the reaction his buggy is receiving, if Dave is anything like me, one honest critique is better than a thousand "thats lovely" comments any day.....thats how to evolve, learn and move forward. We have all given critique from just a few photos so far which is a little unfair really. The new website will launch on the 1st Nov, so I am sure we will find out much more about the concept

John Holgate - 30-10-2012 at 01:28 PM

It looks like Cris Italy is going to have this down at Sandy Point from Friday till Tue/Wed. Hopefully, quite a few of us will get to give it run on the beach. I'll get some footage and photos and post them up when I get back next week. I quite like the idea of having a large cruising buggy that disassembles and packs up quickly.

Bladerunner - 30-10-2012 at 04:44 PM

Looks like they actually have considered break down for transport and storage ! :thumbup::thumbup:

If they are hoping to sell to the masses I think that this was as important as anything.

Next important point will be the price point. Any idea what these will sell for ?

Folks that think we have a motor someplace are going to be extra confused looking at this machine.

I think it's an huge step forward and I hope they make a firm mark on the buggy market !

van - 30-10-2012 at 07:59 PM

Looks cool but I don't want to think about the shipping cost to get one here. I've had a lot of interest for my product in Australia until I quoted them shipping. The main section doesn't pack up as tidy as a pair of side rails and fabric seat. It's a great prototype but far from production for the rest of the world. Might just be a local flavor.

andy666 - 30-10-2012 at 08:21 PM

I can't believe that this thing still weighs 58kg!!! Even with the use of carbon fibre.
Also the high seat back might act as a big air brake.

It will be interesting to hear the reports from the boys at the speed week meet. Shattered that I can't make it to the meet this year.

popeyethewelder - 30-10-2012 at 11:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by andy666
I can't believe that this thing still weighs 58kg!!! Even with the use of carbon fibre.
Also the high seat back might act as a big air brake.

It will be interesting to hear the reports from the boys at the speed week meet. Shattered that I can't make it to the meet this year.


When you start adding shocks, the weight rises considerably added to that the shock housings and before you know it you are back to a weighty buggy again.

I do not see the high back of the buggy as an issue as that is where the pilot sits anyway,.....but I do see a "possible" issue with not being able to lean back slightly or even tilting you head back during upwind turns

bigkid - 31-10-2012 at 06:48 AM

This buggy has been getting to much of my brain time. I've been looking at shocks and trying to work through the idea of them on a buggy. The fact that they are pumped up to 250lbs is beyond any of my hand pumps by 200lbs. I will not take my shop compressor out to the beach so all that is left are those cheep plug into the car compressors that are not accurate at high pressures. Besides the fact that the shocks are basically topped out with air pressure, and the cost to replace them is not cheep, especially if they are sold in pairs, makes me wonder if they are overkill and or could be eliminated completely.

The other aspect of the bug is the "keel". It looks a bit low in the picture, wonder if you would do any damage if it were to run over some of the crap here on our beaches. A bruised bum is not uncommon here. On most bugs you can adjust the height/angle at the point where the siderails meet the downtube.

It says that you add padding to the seat for fit. I think of the skateboard helmets that you stick a few pieces of foam inside to make it smaller. As soon as I drop into the seat with my harness on will the padding stay put or role off and stick to my pants?

I so want to look at this bug and try it out. I hope the website does it justice and shows some great shots of the "stuff". I can only hope.

I have come to the conclusion after looking at the pictures, this bug will float.:bigok:

DAKITEZ - 31-10-2012 at 07:27 AM

The buggy looks great! I am sure its probably not perfect ... but hey its their first prototype. This buggy designer is pushing the envelope and I love to see that to help the sport grow. I firmly believe there is a better design for buggies in the future than the buggies we are currently riding. The amount of time, thought, and money put into this buggy has me excited about what they might come up with in the near future. :thumbup::thumbup:

awindofchange - 31-10-2012 at 10:59 AM

The buggy is awesome, love the look of the carbon fiber, the downtube is just sexy, love the front fork design. The only thing that is an issue will be the price. I can only assume that with gas loaded shocks and all the carbon, the cost will need to be be well over 2K. That alone will kill the sales to everyone but a very few elite.

pyro22487 - 31-10-2012 at 02:17 PM

I was looking at it thinking the price would be around 4-5k.

popeyethewelder - 1-11-2012 at 11:03 AM

Did you guys have a look at their web site now its live...I wondered if anyones view of it had changed either way?

http://www.carbonkitebuggy.com/

I still think it looks out of this world, I wondered why go the shock route when they even admit it is extremely stiff...if its that stiff whats the point of shock....the front end is lovely, and the leading link type suspension, in my opinion would have been better with elastomers....nothing to worry about then and does the same job....but agree it does not look as appealing as this front end....but will these four shocks stand up to sand and sea water.....,
The mononcoque, well it looks amazing but you lose the hanging effect you get with a standard seat and the varied widths of rails, that is a biggish compromise, if that monocoque fits you perfect you are laughing, although I do wonder about leaning back or looking up at the kite near zenith, vertically challenged people such as myself will be banging our helmets on the back of the monocoque.....
People will always find something wrong with something, its the easiest thing to do....but I have to keep looking at this buggy and looking and looking....whether is fantastic or not, you cant take away the fact they have produced an amzing looking product.

MDK - 1-11-2012 at 11:14 AM

I looked at it. Nice website! and I am a little more impressed with the bug...but I am still hung up on a one piece axle and the need for cargo space. something else too I am still in a love affair with the PTW Playa and I am not ready for the plastic look and/or feel. but I am still very impressed with the bug and the website!

BeamerBob - 1-11-2012 at 11:32 AM

If this isn't the end all be all buggy of the future, I do really like the slickness of the push pins. My big concerns at this point are the security of the seat and the ride height. I set up my buggy with just 2 fingers clearance under my seat. I use that low COG to my advantage since I don't worry about the buggy rolling over. Pics look like the pilot's rear end might be 8-10" off the ground with the seat thickness and the way it rides above the downtube. A set of barrows might be just what the doctor ordered for ride height if the "keel" can maintain clearance.

Seeing this design has me wondering about some vibration isolation by using elastomers front and rear. I wouldn't want much travel, just isolation like in a motor mount in a car.

This buggy might help start a new wave of innovation in our sport. I'm glad it is making us all think about what the future might hold.

Clive - 3-11-2012 at 02:22 AM

Had a chance to look at the buggy last night, Dave brought it as promised.
A number of buggiers had a good look, a sit in it, grilled dave on various aspects of it's engineering and design.

First impressions are the pictures on the website don't do justice for it's looks, it looks fantastic, probably won't get a lot of arguments there....

Possibly two considerations much debated, ....the seat, a completely diffent style of seat from the usual fabric version, a number ranging from 5 ft 6 to 6 ft 3 sat in it and were comfortable, it has various rubber linings with abrasion resistant around the harness area, a cutaway section allows kite lines clearance to the sides, questions have been raised about would you pop out under load, well it does have a seatbelt and further testing will clarify this point, it would appear that it's a one size seat fits all, and although a bunch sat in it, no really WIDE person did so if you are XXXXXS will you fit... Who knows. The current seat will be replaced with a lighter weight material in the same shape, and current axles are way over size in wall thickness, so possibly a further 8 kg could be removed ( so david suggested anyway)
The suspension, although on a very low setting ( davids not real heavy) it didn't bottom out with a 90 + kg person sitting and jumping on it, it actually felt like a suspension, so some give was noticeable, it will be interesting to see how it works out over the next few days once people take it for a ride. Apparently too the suspension components are available from other sources so if you needed replacements you could source them elsewhere, a pump comes with it to go to the 300psi they can go to.
Well that's first impressions, did I like it...... Oh yeah, based on looks alone even just as a cruiser even if it didn't have the handling etc, it would still sell. Cost, well various things were discussed, David indicated more information would be forthcoming.
Although it's only a limited number playing with it at the moment here in Australia, it has been brought down so that it can be assessed and commented on in real world tests, can't ask for more than that, personally I hope it handles better than some predictions but time will tell.

popeyethewelder - 3-11-2012 at 03:10 AM

Great to hear real feedback Clive, thank you for sharing that

bigkid - 3-11-2012 at 03:45 AM

Just spent some time on the website and I am more frustrated with it now than before. All the time and money spent on the bug, I think I would have paid a real company to take pictures and videos. Sorry, but a black back ground for a black buggy works real well in showing the black:thumbdown:
The thought of some light to see the rear tire going on and off would be kind of nice, that way I could see if the idea came from Blokart or not.

And I guess you would want to keep a cover on it and keep it in the deep freeze for storage, sun light, salt water and heat are not the bugs friend.
And the warranty is basically saying, don't have a good time cause it isn't covered. "reasonable use" is the term used, that rules me and a few other buggyers out.

I like the idea of new thinking and doing things outside of the box, but this is not getting better for me, but just the opposite. The more I see and read the more I am turned off by it. I keep trying to see the positive aspects of the design and all I see are the disadvantages. I do like the push pin idea, I like that alot.:thumbup:

I keep thinking of the kid who buys a new Acura and chops and lowers the suspension, puts on all the body extras to make it aerodynamic, and adds the biggest base thumper that the trunk can hold and cant drive it because it will bottom out on the road and cut the tires into the wheel wells and the trunk fell off because of the vibrations from the speakers, with duct tape holding the front spoiler up after it kissed the curb the first time it was parked. But it looks bad a$$.

If it comes to the USA for a pass around, I WANT TO BE FIRST ON THE LIST.:lol::evil: Then I can post a review from fact instead of opinion.

ChrisH - 4-11-2012 at 04:44 PM

It looks sweet as hell that's for sure! I think I would rather have roto-molded plastic for the seat than carbon fiber, at least then you can fix the damn thing yourself if it has to be done. Yeah, that probably wouldn't work well but if I can't fix it myself I'm not gonna buy it. I like that I can fix 99% of my buggy if anything breaks.

Clive - 5-11-2012 at 10:25 PM

Well speed week is over, or should I say slow week. The wind was very unproductive, we did manage an hour of good wind this morning only to have it die off completely.
The carbon buggy got a run, cris Italy had a few passes, so some video footage will be coming at some stage.
David brought the buggy down for us to have a run in and get some feedback, given he didn't put a price on it and was reluctant to do so could indicate he expected further development was needed, and the consensus was yes it does. Obvious to some was the suspension setup, further revision and even removal would be needed. Padding to the edges of the seat required some revision.
Dave took onboard our kind, and possibly unkind comments, you have to give him credit for trying and being open with everyone down here, he is going to do further work on it, he's not going to give up and I look forward to seeing an improved version.
My wife had a look and said where do you put your spare kite and stuff...... Can't fault her thinking as we often do long runs and getting left out or stranded due to a wind velocity change can be frustrating, plus a break for a snack and a chat is always good.
The carbon buggy will no doubt reappear soon enough and I wish Dave all the best with his project....... And feel free to let us have another look next time too
.

bigkid - 6-11-2012 at 05:02 AM

Clive, nice report. I like your wifes thinking, its the simple things that are often over looked. I to, hope the best for the out come of the bug.
I think it was the setup, and all the hype of a new bug that will revolutionize buggies for evermore, that turned me off.
I will wait for the revisions of the revisions before I will think about the bug again.
Carry on Dave, this is a great buggy to start with, can't wait for the finished product.:bigok:

popeyethewelder - 6-11-2012 at 11:17 AM

Thanks for the feedback Clive, thats what we have been waiting for and just tidies all the loose ends up, Sounds like Dave is listening to construtive criticism which can be nothing but good

John Holgate - 6-11-2012 at 07:23 PM

Well, the wind didn't exactly cooperate down at Sandy Point over the weekend. Cris managed a few runs in the Carbon Buggy, but none of us did the km's we were hoping to. In the end, we gave David a fair bit to think about (and probably a few grey hairs!). A few minor modifications needed here and there and the suspension showed it's shortcomings under load - it may even be removed the next time we see it. A few changes to tolerances and materials to be made also.

Managed to get a bit of footage which I hope will show it better from a few different angles. BTW - the brackets underneath loosen to slide the seat fore and aft. Seat is actually quite comfy and has plenty of room to lean back for upwind turns too.

MDK - 6-11-2012 at 11:29 PM

got'a hand it to'um it is sexy! one piece axle and cargo space and he has something. one piece axle will reduce the cost considerably. since he was shy to tell :)

MDK - 6-11-2012 at 11:36 PM

I am a designer, and I have learned to be careful not to go too far.... build from what works...evolve. designs that go too far are usually not excepted or don't last. JMHO

popeyethewelder - 9-11-2012 at 12:17 AM

I received this email from Dave, I hope he does not mind me sharing it with you guys



Quote:

Hi Carl,

After plenty of good feedback from speedweek the buggy will now
undergo some revision before its release to the market. Most
noticeably to the suspension which as many have commented on did not
perform as I would have hoped. I believe that it generated to much
traction which although great on straight runs made power slides
incredibly difficult even in the hands of Cris Italy. The other issue
with utilizing a fully adjustable suspension is 'set up' together with
to many variables ie pilot weight, surface etc.

Modifications to be made will include

Removal of suspension and a standard style front end assembly
manufactured - this will reduce weight and cost

One size fits all seat - This will be replaced by manufacturing seat
hip / leg size mouldings for different sized bodies that will be
bonded to the inside of the seat during manufacture.

Attached is a photo of a proposed rear axle strut which will require
extensive destructive testing prior to release.

Material - carbon fibre aerofoil shape - weight 420 grams

Many Thanks for the hospitality and support off all who attended
Extreme Kites Speedweek including Joel, Cris, John, Nigel and many
more!

Kind Regards Dave Hobbs



Dave has had critism from around the globe about his new buggy, and to be honest with a claim "the most advanced production buggy on the planet"
the buggy was always going to get extremely eyeballed from everyone....and rightly so with such a bold statement.

What has come out of all this is certainly from me anyway, a great respect for not only trying to take the kite buggy to the next level, but more so the way he has listened to constructive critism and taken it all on board, and now heading back to the factory to rectify problems and issues, and come back stronger and better.....he has not even once defended himself vocally on the forums which I know he watches, which is extremely difficult to do, everyone wants to defend their baby right...

So yeah, respect to the guy, and I am looking forward to see whats next.

Photo of the proposed new carbon strut HERE

WIllardTheGrey - 9-11-2012 at 01:20 AM

I like the strut idea. If you decide you want/have use of suspension it would be a very simple task to upgrade. Two buggies for the cost of 1&1/4? :cool2:

Now I want to see the front end.:Ange09:

silvereaglekiter - 9-11-2012 at 06:28 AM

great demo vid, I didn't see any if the listing I expected in the aft end suspicion.

geokite - 16-11-2012 at 04:01 PM

I really like the suspension in my PL Monster buggy (thanks Dean!). As long as suspension is not independent for each back wheel (it is not on the Monster), there is no lean of the buggy with the pull of the kite. Power slides are great

I haven't seen the video (at work right now), but is there any reason the front end couldn't retain the suspension?

I'm in the process of replacing all the shocks on my Monster with air shocks (replacing the coil spring shocks that it came with). Expensive, but the ability to fine tune it to my weight should be worth it. I'm using new, but older model, rear mountain bike shocks.

cheezycheese - 16-11-2012 at 07:26 PM

Steve, would you mind sharing your source for the shocks...? :Ange09:

popeyethewelder - 17-11-2012 at 12:22 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by silvereaglekiter
great demo vid, I didn't see any if the listing I expected in the aft end suspicion.


Probably for two reasons..

1/ there was hardly any wind, so not fully powered up

2/ they have said the shocks were pumped up solid, so like comments that have already been mentioned, if they are that hard, there is no point in them being there really

geokite - 17-11-2012 at 09:35 AM

The original front shocks were 6" eye to eye; I'm increasing that to 6.5" (it will raise my foot pegs a bit, a good thing). Got two old Rockshox SID dual air shocks from hippietech suspension. Not the most reliable store for getting work done on your shocks that you send him, but he mailed me the purchase of these two shocks in about a week.

The back shocks are a more standard 7.875" eye to eye. I'd look for something on ebay, then get another on ebay for the pair. I got a pair at cambriabike.com for cheap, but the deals there change all the time.

If you get old model shocks, you might want to get them checked out by your local bike shop. The first pair from cambria had a rattle inside. My lbs checked them out, the rattle wasn't series and easily fixed, but it turned out they were bone dry on the inside (no lub). $20 for the pair and they are in great condition now.