Is someone at PL a Denver Broncos Fan?Feyd - 4-12-2012 at 09:11 AM
No kidding right? I gotta say that one is my favorite colorway.BeamerBob - 4-12-2012 at 10:44 AM
Very nice looking kite! Way better colors. Minimal white on the backside. Makes me want to fly one.g00fba11 - 4-12-2012 at 12:07 PM
I can just imagine those colors against a nice snowy background.....hmmmmmmarkite - 4-12-2012 at 03:05 PM
ooooh a box of Charger 2's arrived at my door a few hours ago .... gotta go peek in the box.... :-)RonH - 4-12-2012 at 06:58 PM
Nice Colors!
So what is the difference between the MK1 & 2?Feyd - 4-12-2012 at 08:22 PM
Apart from the colors there have been some minor changes to the wing itself. Higher AR in the bigger sizes, same VPC that is spec'd on the Phantom 2,
improved Autozenith, reduced twitchiness, reinforced spar pocket ends etc.
Lots of little improvements.Cheddarhead - 4-12-2012 at 08:42 PM
VERY NICE! Does anybody have prices?mougl - 4-12-2012 at 09:57 PM
Can't wait to fly one!!geokite - 5-12-2012 at 08:03 AM
Is the official name "Charger 2" or "Charger 2013"?
They aren't seriously going to start naming the kite with the model year...Feyd - 5-12-2012 at 10:00 AM
hehehe good question.
Everyone, myself included has been refering to the kite as the "Charger 2". The logo on the kite itself only say's "Charger" and is a different font
than the original CH1.
I think theres some translation loss when the boys from PL post stuff in English. I would like to see the Vid titled something like "2013 Peter Lynn
Charger 2" as that clearly defines a date, brand and model even though it isn't "technically" called the Charger 2 if going by the name on the actual
wing.
That said there is nothing on the Phantom 2 that denotes that it is a Phantom 2. The logo just says "Phantom" and the assumption is that since it's a
new kite it is the "2".
I say call it what you want. I'm sticking with Ch2 for lazy typing purposes and completely disregarding any oversightes by the PL marketing machine
in favor of focusing on how good the kite is and how Peter Lynn made an effort to address and resolve the issues that many had with the Ch1.
Persoanlly I liked the Ch1 and I like the Ph2 and I suspect this new kite, and it is new not just new colors on the exact same kite, is going to be a
sweet compormise between the cruising nature of the Ph2 and the agressive nature of the Ch1.
I wish winter would figure out wht to do so we could get out on our's!:D
tag photo from one colour option
markite - 5-12-2012 at 10:11 AM
DemBones - 5-12-2012 at 09:32 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by markite
So it has basically the same design as the phantom 2 with different colours?markite - 5-12-2012 at 09:37 PM
this weekend I'll lay out and compare a 12m Charger 2 on top of an original Charger and a Phantom 2 all the same size to check out the differences for
you.
Mark-mj- - 6-12-2012 at 01:39 AM
Charger 2 or 2013, adding the model year might not be the best way to go, but hey, It's the next Charger! who cares about adjectives :-).
We wanted to step away from numbering (Charger 2) but when putting it online the original Charger webpages were in the way so we made it Charger 2013.
Graphics look similar to the Phantom but are not exactly.
Good winds.
P.s.
Hope to see some reviews soon :-)flyjump - 6-12-2012 at 06:02 AM
Cool graphics and colorsBladerunner - 6-12-2012 at 07:23 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by markite
this weekend I'll lay out and compare a 12m Charger 2 on top of an original Charger and a Phantom 2 all the same size to check out the differences for
you.
Mark
I wonder if you have a Synergy to side by side compare ?
Seems to me like the VPC and a few things may match. Of course the Syn' will be the fat kid in the group but ???geokite - 6-12-2012 at 07:57 AM
Yes, the colors and graphics look great.markite - 9-12-2012 at 03:49 PM
Okay here are some photos - quickly laid out on a tarp and photographed from my upper deck so probably around 15-20 degree angle (not shot straight
down)
I compared all 12m sizes of Charger 1 - Charger 2 and Phantom 2 (didn't have a 12m Synergy handy today)
I can compare a 8 Syn to an 8 Ch2 (to a Ph 9 to a Ph2 9 to a Scorp 10 to a ....)
I haven't taken any measurements but at a quick look comparing Charger 1 and 2 you'll see the the TE of the Ch2 has has been trimmed back toward the
wingtips and a shorter wingtip. Charger 1 - 12m has 29 cells, Charger 2 - 12m has 27. The kites are the same width so the cells on the Charger 2 will
be wider.
(depending on how far apart you space ribs increases the curve - amount of billow - on the outer skin)
When I laid out the various kites in some shots I aligned Leading edge and others Trailing edge so I wrote a short note on each photo.
here they are:
Mark
markite - 9-12-2012 at 03:53 PM
close of wingtip difference - aligned at top corner
markite - 9-12-2012 at 03:56 PM
Phantom 2 12m on top of Charger 2 12m with LE aligned
markite - 9-12-2012 at 03:58 PM
then with the Charger 2 placed over the Phantom with TE aligned
markite - 9-12-2012 at 04:03 PM
Phantom 2 over Charger 2 showing wingtip difference
Feyd - 9-12-2012 at 04:08 PM
When you fly the Ch2 the cells look very fat. Especially compared to the PH2 IMO.markite - 9-12-2012 at 04:21 PM
remember Tungsten's mod on the Charger adding the adjuster on the wingtip mid braid. He was talking about the slightly shorter height of the rib
having less left on wingtips that could result in tip clap on gusty conditions etc. By adding that adjuster and squeezing the wintip cells it would
cause more bulge in the outer skin increasing lift - decreasing the cell count over the span would result in a fatter bulge between ribs. I haven't
had a chance to fly one yet - kites arrive, rain starts...Snake - 9-12-2012 at 05:11 PM
Markite, you are correct about the bulge, but why wouldn't they just use a thicker profile at the tips? The bulge can be bad. It distorts the profile
causing the wing to be less efficient. Race kites have more cells makeing them high preformance. So why don't they make it have more cells? First of
all it adds more weight. More weight causes the kite to have less low end and prefomance. More cell also make the the kite too efficient. Most people
don't need the prefomance of the original charger so they may have dialed it back. It also makes it easier and cheaper to produce so they can pass
those saveings on to you.markite - 9-12-2012 at 05:44 PM
You are right about race kites having more cells and there are quite a few things that come into play while trying to find the right balance that each
change makes. I very smooth thin rigid wing would be a higher speed wing over a fatter wing but there is also instability potential when the airflow
changes. Reducing the shape of wing tips (both in rib profile as well as shape of the tip - trimming back the trailing edge) is a way of increasing
turning speed. Bulging wingtips would be slower dragging the the tps back, wider turning, more chance of a kite opening up etc so it,s a fine balance.
The original charger had more cells added and profile adjusted a very small amount but the trade off is stability of auto zenith. The changes in the
Charger 2 as mentioned are to dial back some of the flight characteristics for broader user appeal.
A for easier and cheaper to produce, not really. Having a couple less ribs to sew in is ver minimal and I can tell you as prices on materials go up
every year the kites are not getting cheaper. Making a different option on a kite like this using a cheaper nylon would be the only way of reducing
production costs. But then you have a different feeling kite which may be good to have a slightly heavier more robust kite that is ver stable targeted
to beginners.markite - 12-12-2012 at 10:53 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Bladerunner
I wonder if you have a Synergy to side by side compare ?
Seems to me like the VPC and a few things may match. Of course the Syn' will be the fat kid in the group but ???
Oh man, I said I didn't have a 12m Synergy to compare at the time and just realized the Synergy I have sitting here for a minor repair is a 12m - I'll
see if I can get a day to lay it out in the same place to photograph. What are you interested in comparing the 12 Synergy to - which kite Ken?
