Power Kite Forum

Hooked in problem

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 07:00 AM

I've used my fb kites hooked in a few times and the venom static a couple of times. My problem is that I rarely trust my winds so I rarely fly hooked in. My winds are never smooth but I do have days that are less gusty than others. I'm happy flying fb unhooked in the buggy. Do I just give up on the idea or am I just being a wuss and should try going for it more? Another cause of my apprehension is my flying areas are not tiny but also not wide open. There is always some sort of hazards fairly close by that I don't want to get lofted into.

flyguy0101 - 23-4-2014 at 07:13 AM

I think it really boils down to what you are comfortable with- I probably rode buggies for 2 years before ever trying to hook in and still today when i am flying really small fields (ie a baseball diamond) and really am working slides and turns will often fly unhooked, But on bigger areas (ie soccer field or bigger) i hook in 95% of the time now. I feel safer and in more control when i am hooked in and yeah i fly in really bad inland winds not so much the gusts as the lulls- 0, 15, 6, 8, 0, 8,15, 4, 8,0 that is an example of the wind I buggy in at home and thats not considering the directional shift. I would recommend that you go out in the buggy with the beamer when there is enough wind to fly the kite but really need the 5.3 viper to get moving and hook yourself in sit in the buggy and just fly the kite try to make it generate enough power to move you but also just sitting and flying. this will help you build confidence and then size up a little more til you are comfortable with holding the power in your butt instead of your arms. Relying on your arms will cause you to use them for balance instead of control. Also I prefer using a block and QR when using a stroop, keeps it from "falling" out in the lulls. Just my .02
Scott
EDIT- as for the venom- you really need to get moving with ARCs or you will never appreciate them

podsds - 23-4-2014 at 07:18 AM

How do you feel about a quick release system to dump the kite?

PHREERIDER - 23-4-2014 at 07:26 AM

definitely comfort level, it will change in time. like flyguy said. and a little movement certainly adds to the nimble feature of most kites. so a little movement will give BETTER control than just standing around. also an unhooked kite fully depower is at its slowest , and theres a faster depower component to the kite as u hook n and let the bar out for even more depower which speed things up. unhooked its FULL ON just like C-KITE.

choose wisely the coniditons ...always look at history of closet windmeter so you can see what the breeze is doing. if it looks rough and switching on the meter --->expect it.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 07:33 AM

@podsds: I've looked into Jeff's aqr and will probably get one eventually. I'm going to test a homemade qr that's located where the strop connects to the handle to try and get the feel of it but also allow me to hook and unhook at will which right now is important to me.

@flyguy: I almost never get the wind to use the 3m beamer in the buggy between me being one of the fat kids and the rolling resistance of the field. I have the most fun and the most success if I fly overpowered. I can make it upwind easier and I stay moving in the lulls, but occasionally on a gust I get pulled out or let go of the handles. That's part of my anxiety of hooking in.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 07:38 AM

Thanks Phree, I'm hoping practice and experience will solve my problems. I don't practice hooked in often because I have too much fun trying to push the upper wind range of the kites in heavy gusty winds and working on my buggy skills. I'll have to tone it down to practice hooked in and exercise a little more patience.

flyguy0101 - 23-4-2014 at 07:54 AM

@ssayre- sounds like you fly like me - overpowered for a little adrenaline AND the ability to move so try round two then and that is BODY ARMOR- look into a motocross body jacket- mine has hard back and chest as well as shoulder and elbow pads that way when you get ripped out you will slide on the plastic until you pull the little red ball. My system is similair to bigkids i have just not hooked up the auto realease to the buggy (although i have promised the misses that i will when i get to sdtart flying again)
also you will find that you can hold more kite more comfortable when you are hooked in especially if you are a member of the clydesdale club (yeah i am the fat guy too)

Bladerunner - 23-4-2014 at 08:09 AM

I often ride unhooked with handles but not ever with my arcs. Not even for launching.

Unhooked with handles feels safer in sketchy winds + the extra movement can be helpful. I feel I gain some control ?

Unhooked with an arc doesn't work well for me. It turns so much slower and thrive on front line input. Hooked in I feel I gain control and am safer.

I find arcs are aren't exactly easy to fly static in gusty winds. It is in motion that they do their shape shift thing and it softens things up. Static they shape shift but without motion it turns more into a flare out. With the arc I suggest you get hooked in and get moving . Don't judge your arc by how it flies static.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 08:40 AM

I've only flown the arc hooked in static. Actually, I thought it handled great and was a lot of fun to fly static. I've just been apprehensive using it in winds that will get me moving due to lack of experience and fear of my winds. Mainly it's just been frustrating getting the right winds and time to fly it to line up. I've had good winds while at work and poor winds on the weekend.

podsds - 23-4-2014 at 08:41 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ssayre  
@podsds: I've looked into Jeff's aqr and will probably get one eventually. I'm going to test a homemade qr that's located where the strop connects to the handle to try and get the feel of it but also allow me to hook and unhook at will which right now is important to me.

I'm looking at the Mystic Quick Release, but I'm a newbie and even tried hooking in yet and I don't have a harness yet.

http://www.thekiteboarder.com/2013/11/2014-buyers-guide-myst...

@flyguy: I almost never get the wind to use the 3m beamer in the buggy between me being one of the fat kids and the rolling resistance of the field. I have the most fun and the most success if I fly overpowered. I can make it upwind easier and I stay moving in the lulls, but occasionally on a gust I get pulled out or let go of the handles. That's part of my anxiety of hooking in.

flyguy0101 - 23-4-2014 at 09:02 AM

@ podsds- are you going to make wildwood? if so you will get a chance to see several of the quick release options- i like the mystic idea for on the water or on a landboard but in a buggy i dont think that mystic would work well and would surely be very uncomfortable if you have any kind of a gut

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 09:10 AM


Quote:

in a buggy i dont think that mystic would work well and would surely be very uncomfortable if you have any kind of a gut


That was my concern as well when I looked at it. I looks like it's made to fit a variety of styles of harness making versatile but bulky. Maybe worth looking at after a bit of diet and exercise. :lol:

Demoknight - 23-4-2014 at 10:31 AM

Ssayre, like the others are saying, armor up and just start trying it. You will gain confidence. The only time I ever unhook in the buggy is in light winds, not strong winds. When you ride unhooked you are lifting your tow point a foot or more higher than when you are hooked in with a seat harness. Of course you get yanked over the rails. The lower your kite is hooked, the more you will slide instead of tilt. That is part of the reason you can hold down more kite when hooked in.

I love flying overpowered. The arcs are definitely only good for gusts while you are moving. You can really see them wobble and shudder, but barely feel it other than a smooth surge of power. Otherwise static, you still have to pay pretty close attention to keep it in the air. That is the case with most things I have flown that sit farther out in the window though.

Armor up and just start flying hooked in. Get familiar with your safety release. Once you get used to it, you will probably prefer it, even in your shaky winds. Flying unhooked can make you overly timid to trust your equipment, and that can make your progression really slow.

abkayak - 23-4-2014 at 10:58 AM

i was gonna come at you w/ yes you are a wuss...but after much thought and erasing several posts i have decided to just say you need to log more static time hooked in fb..and be real comfy w/ scudding hooked in...im sure this will transfer to confidence in the bug….there, problem solved

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 01:42 PM

It's true practice and experience will help, but our weather in the Spring is sketchy. For example, I'm in the roofing business and my guys were doing a 2 story commercial flat roof. It's been a beautiful day without a cloud in the sky. They called me today and said out of nowhere a gust of wind hit and picked up 4x8 sheets of foam board with 5 gl cans of adhesive sitting on them for weight and tossed stuff everywhere. They described it as a mini flash tornado that only lasted a few seconds. Before and after that the winds were light and varying between 8 - 10. That's what makes me the most nervous, not my abilities. It seems like it's one of those things like any freak accident. You might be able to kite 20 years without a major problem or there could be a rogue gust that has your name on it tomorrow. I'm not saying I'm giving up on the idea of hooking in, but I am saying it's almost impossible to predict what the wind in my area is going to do even in apparently perfect weather.

3shot - 23-4-2014 at 02:24 PM

I know it doesn't help, but your thoughts and posts are exactly why I bought an AQR system. All my inland winds are janky just like yours and Flyguy's and many others. Real janky wind, harness, and a fixed bridal sooner or later will put an @$$ whuppin' on you. My thoughts are suck it up, harness up, AQR in, and leave the rest to the good Lord!! :saint: :lol:

If you get snatched up. More likely than not, you will not be able to overcome the pull to unhook the strop. Not to mention by the time your brain processes the "oh sh#t" its too late. Even for static, you could use a system like Jeff's with a manual pull cord attached. You then may very well get snatched, but you can dump the kite and hope for the best.

Like you ssayre, my janky winds hold back my progression. That's why I'm so looking forward to JIBE. New winds, new experiences, and education.

IMHO

Demoknight - 23-4-2014 at 02:30 PM

Amen to janky winds. That is one of the reasons I am not looking forward to moving back to Georgia in a few years.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 02:35 PM

3shot, that does help. I'm not going to hook in without the aqr and it is reasonably priced anyway. That's what makes this such an interesting sport. Everyone's conditions, location, riding style, risk tolerance vary making it tough to figure out what to get to accomplish what you want to do. I'm close to figuring out what I like best and what works for my location. All that said, I just like getting out and riding no matter how I do it.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 03:23 PM

On another harness related issue. Does anyone have trouble with the harness loosening up? I've got the Ozone sb harness and it wants to loosen after the first good pull. It seems like I'm frequently tightening them. The adjustment straps work the same as the straps on the buggy seat which I have to frequently tighten.

RedSky - 23-4-2014 at 03:26 PM

Hey ssayre, I remember the same feeling when I first hooked in with FB kites. The ability to absorb the gusts through my arms was lost but I soon realised that instead of absorbing the wind through my arms I learnt to absorb the FB kite through the buggy by momentarily steering downwind as the gust hits. Basically mirroring the gust with your steering.

Hope that helps a bit.

ssayre - 23-4-2014 at 04:08 PM

Thanks RedSky, I'll definitely try that. I think I've done that before to a certain degree when not hooked in when a gust hit. I'm at the stage where I'm over the initial excitement of movement and really working on my skills. I thought my obsession with kite buggy would subside once I did it several times but it just seems to increase with each session. I guess there's no escape now.

flyguy0101 - 23-4-2014 at 05:31 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RedSky  
Hey ssayre, I remember the same feeling when I first hooked in with FB kites. The ability to absorb the gusts through my arms was lost but I soon realised that instead of absorbing the wind through my arms I learnt to absorb the FB kite through the buggy by momentarily steering downwind as the gust hits. Basically mirroring the gust with your steering.

Hope that helps a bit.



Red,
Thank you for saying what I was thinking and couldn't put into words earlier :thumbup:
Scott

ssayre - 26-4-2014 at 12:17 PM


Quote:

i was gonna come at you w/ yes you are a wuss


I stopped being a wuss and flew my viper hooked in today abkayak :lol:

The winds were suppose to be decent but they ended up being pretty lame. I was able to get a few runs in but I would have liked to have more wind to experiment in. I have flown a fair amount static while hooked in when I had the blade. It was much much less forgiving than the viper. Even though I sold that kite I'm glad I had it. I think I'm a much better pilot because I used a challenging kite early on.