Power Kite Forum - HQ Mojo vs. Revolution

HQ Mojo vs. Revolution

Kinsztel - 8-4-2015 at 03:49 AM

I dont have a kite yet, but I want to start

I would like to buy one of Rev kites (Revolution EXP) or HQ Mojo.

I search through whole internet but I cant find any good information about Mojo and NO comparision between them at all! So I am not sure which one to start with.

Do you guys know and could help me with that?
I know Rev's and Mojo are similar in their "logic" of flying but still they are not the same... I found two sites that some Mojo owners said it's more twitchy then Rev (whatever that means). That's it.

I am really fascinated after watching dozens of Revolution stunt- movies (instant brakes, WOW! (edit: is it called a "dive-stop"?) but also Mojo sounds like a good fun and its a bit cheaper in my country.

So does Mojo can do "anything" that Rev's can?

I am total newbie so please forgive me if my questions are silly or stupid.

ANY ideas and opinions would be much appreciated. Thank you

Randy - 8-4-2015 at 05:30 AM

Looks like this Rev is still for sale, and priced like a mojo :

http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=29931#pid28...

Kinsztel - 8-4-2015 at 06:07 AM

Can you try to answer my question instead of sending me advertisement links? Revs are much more expensive than Mojo's in my country (I live in central Europe so you can imagine...). I dont need links to sale offers, I need an advice from people who know what I am sking. Thank you.

abkayak - 8-4-2015 at 06:39 AM

wow...harsh my melo

bobalooie57 - 8-4-2015 at 08:02 AM

I found this video of the Mojo, you may have already seen it. It certainly does a lot of tricks. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chmqRZ__t7Y

soliver - 8-4-2015 at 08:26 AM

Hey there Kinsztel, and welcome to PKF!... I know a lot of guys on the forum here do fly Revolution kites, but here we are mostly Traction Kite or Power Kite fliers, also flown on 4 lines but different. While some guys here may have experience flying Rev's we focus mainly on our Power Kites.

You may have better luck finding the information you're looking for on a stunt kite or Revolution specific forum. For instance (you may have already seen this)... I googled "revolution kite forum" and found this forum http://www.revkites.com/forum/ with the forum's search field I entered "HQ mojo" and found this thread: http://www.revkites.com/forum/topic/5772-mojo-quad-kite/?hl=... referring tho the mojo as more twitchy like you said... if I were to guess, they probably mean that Mojo is not as stable as the Rev EXP.

I'm not saying that no one here CAN answer your question, I just think you might find it easier on a different forum.

If I were to venture a guess, I would say that you could probably by a USED Revolution EXP for the same or lower cost as that of a new Mojo, and you may likely have a better kite, which is what I think Randy was trying to help you with above... just thinking out loud.

Good luck!

Kinsztel - 8-4-2015 at 09:34 AM

Yes, I have seen both the youtube video and the forum thread you mentioned.
All the youtube vids of HQ mojo are poor quality (like 280 or 480px)... and on the other hand most vids with Rev' stunts are in HD

I wonder why is that...

Thank you for your thoughts and for explanation about this forum. I might to look up more

I will try there.

PS. Shipping used kite from US to Europe would probably be as expensive as the kite itself. I think...

grigorib - 8-4-2015 at 09:51 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Randy

Looks like this Rev is still for sale, and priced like a mojo :

http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=29931#pid28...

yes it is still for sale and it's a private sale, not a commercial ad to address later comment. As a seller it is not most ethical to upvote the Rev but I flew the Mojo before and it felt much different than Rev. I get good precision out of Revs 1.5 which I fly and the Mojo was less precise and more moving around, more of random moves on its own. I believe once you have controls in your brain and muscle memory you'd fly either just fine but I'm with Revs and will stay with Revs - I haven't got impressed with HQ.

Again, to the Revs - I flew the power series, I flew Rev I, I flew Rev II and none of them are as much fun as Rev 1.5/EXP - the size matters here, the big ones are kind of "pull my hands out, I don't need 'em" kites, the Rev II is comparable to Mojo - kind of the kite that gotta fly fast and keep moving to enjoy it, none of the smaller or bigger ones are as stable and precise.

If you're around Grand Haven, MI around 5/16-5/17 there'll be a big kite festival, with hundreds of stunt kites, Rev ballet and team flying - come over to try and play.

as of Revs - you'd want eventually to have two of them - regular and the vented one (for high wind flying), and also two sets of frames - a 2-wrap (for low-end lightwind regular canopy flying) and a 3-wrap. You might want to have 3 sets of lines - 120' (competition), 90' (regular) and 50' (narrow beach or other limited space flying).

Will be always glad to answer questions, I love getting people addicted to the sport.

povlhp - 8-4-2015 at 11:17 AM

You can also get a basic rev clone from feine-drachen.de for €179 rtf.
The mojo is not nearly As good according to drachenforum.de

volock - 8-4-2015 at 05:03 PM

In my experience the Rev is more stable and forgiving. When I flew a mojo the slightest input sent it all over the place. Kind of like comparing a race kite with a beginner kite, in terms of little inputs can really make a mojo move, and not in a good way. The Rev would be hands down the kite I'd choose, ignoring price. Especially as Revs are just more common inre parts or people for help. Note: Just because I compared a rev to a beginner kite for stability, it's still high performance and amazing to do stunts with.

riffclown - 8-4-2015 at 05:27 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Kinsztel

Can you try to answer my question instead of sending me advertisement links? Revs are much more expensive than Mojo's in my country (I live in central Europe so you can imagine...). I dont need links to sale offers, I need an advice from people who know what I am sking. Thank you.

I own both.. I have a Mojo and 5 Rev's.. To keep it simple, you want the Rev.. The Mojo has its niche but it is not a viable alternative to the Rev. It's a different animal entirely and takes quite a bit of practice to get used to. It will however fine tune your control and make a Rev seem easier to fly.. The Mojo is definitely not a beginner kite as it has a much steeper learning curve as a 4 line stunt kite. Try a Rev EXP, they tend to be a bit more price friendly.

I also acknowledge that Rev's are a bit on the high side in pricing.. To that I only can say, buy used...

Fly both, the decision will be easy.

I you are trying to save a bundle and the dive stops and maneuverability are what you want. You should check into modding a HQ Symphony foil.. Click on the Symphony 2.2.4 in my signature for more info on that. You can do that for less than the price of the Mojo.

Dayhiker - 8-4-2015 at 05:30 PM

My vote is for the Revolution kite. My first one was a gift from my wife. In the next couple years I decided I needed a few more of these interesting kites. The Power series are different beasts for sure.

povlhp - 9-4-2015 at 02:08 AM

The Rev is great, and the Polo kites from Spain (fully licensed) are very good looking. When I need to get my next Rev-style, I will probably get one of those.

Personally, I went the cheaper way as a noob, and got a Freilein Windrider X Rev clone (the patent expired) + a Freilein WindRider X full vented (original vent design, and my most used of the two, since I have gusty winds). Freilein workmanship is as good or better than Rev (even according to Rev dealers). The frame tubes are like 2-3 inches shorter than the Skyshark tubes I got, so maybe the kite is smaller than original ? Never got around to measure. But like the kites.

Also had feedback from a guy who said that in the UK, the Albatross brand was popular for beginners. Even a display team used them at one point. But many frowns upon the brand, as they don't do original kites. Only clones. OK but not great workmanship. And to get a vented, the UK guys seemed to favor a soldering iron, and making 50-100 holes in the panels. That is the price to pay for going cheap. Only one model to pick from.

I also got a Freilein TransEye (Original design by Freilein), which should be better for beginners, and move backwards better. It needs more wind than a full sail Rev. Not been using it much.

If you have gusty / variable winds, consider getting a semi-vent or full vented.

One thing to add, the Freilein handles are not that good. Bought a custom set from a guy on DrachenForum.de, which are closer to rev handles, and they make it way easier to fly. So the freilen handles are for emergencies only.

So be aware that not all lookalikes are good, and you will want at least a full sail and a vented at some point. And if they are from same brand it is easier to switch. So look at original used Revs, or consider the Basic / BasIcarex from Feine-drachen.de if you are in Europe. It is not necesarily cheaper to buy cheap kites in China, and they have a low / zero resale value, so might have a higher total cost of ownership.

BTW: The sail or the EXP is the heavier older style nylon. So in low wind you are better off with an Icarex PC40 kite, like the Rev B series (which comes with 2 frames BTW). And for frame, many Rev users are using Skyhark Rods, as they are cheaper. Might be something to consider if you are cash limited.

IMK - 9-4-2015 at 03:54 AM

I've got a Mojo and two Revs and I find the Revs much easier to fly.

Kinsztel - 9-4-2015 at 05:25 AM

Hi guys, thanks for great and tremendous help and all your answers. Mostly thanks to volock, riffclown and IMK who actually answered to my questions

and did fly Mojo before.

As I have a chance to talk to Mojo and Mojo+Rev owners, can I still torture you with some questions?
You all said Rev's are easier, more stable and more forgivin, more precise - right? Will that apply also to Revolution EXP?

I have only those in the store selection... nothing else unfortunately:
HQ Mojo
Revolution Exp
Revolution 1.5 SLE
Revolution 1.5 John Barresi
Revolution Blast
Revolution I SLE
Revolution Indoor
Revolution Power Blast
Revolution Supersonic

Rev EXP is the cheapest Rev available in my country and I really can't afford anything more expensive (I am 18 yrs old for god sake ;P)
All of you suggested to not buy HQ Mojo (I am really sad about it) and go for Revolution. In the beggining I really believed you will say it is just slight difference between those.

OK so the questions to HQ Mojo owners:
Are those "tricks" and kite behaviour presented in the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87JvCGMC514
possible to do with Mojo? Mostly I didnt get answer - is "dive-stop" monouver possible to do?

Questions to Rev (Rev Exp) owners
is that "flat spin" done by Mojo shown here possible in Rev?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnsduNkASLc#t=19 (0m20s)

Also: HQ Mojo in the shop I can order comes with 4 links (how you call it in english?) and the kite cover. Those are not included with any Revolution offered... so the question is - how do you pack and keep you kite in your home? Do you use "cover" so it is protected?
Edit: I found it called "kite bag", isn't it?

And what about Kite lines?
How strength (kilograms) and how long (meters) should be a line for Mojo/Rev Exp?
I have seen lines that have between 30kg - 500kg strength
and also were between 20 metres - 100 metres long

And what about differences between Revolution Exp and Revolution 1.5 SLE. There is this description in Revolution 1.5 SLE:

"It's quicker, more maneuverable and more precise than Revolution EXP".

How is that comparable to all Rev being better than HQ Mojo?
Isn't it like Rev Exp is just cheaper version of Revolution 1.5 and thus comparable to Mojo?

Is that true that Mojo - because it is more ovoid and smaller - will be faster than Revo Exp?

Kinsztel - 9-4-2015 at 05:42 AM

... [sorry for double post]

grigorib - 9-4-2015 at 08:02 AM

Kite lines length - read my first reply above. The lines are usually 90 lbs. strength for non-power series Revs.
SLEs used to have 1/2" leading edge frame and polyester canopy compared to heavier nylon on EXP.
Now Barresi 1.5 come with 1/4" frame so frame-wise just stay with 1/4".
Again, you might want to get yourself a set of 2-wrap frame spars for ultralight wind but if you get the EXP it'll fly for you just like the 1.5
The 1.5, Barresi, New York Minute are "f$&@k, I am rich" kites, they are certainly more refined but a half-decent pilot can pull just as good flying out of EXP.
I fly Barresi 1.5 vented, 1.5 regular and still have two EXPs including the very first one I have owned.

Which country are you in? Shipping from US is not as expensive as old world VAT

BigMikesKites - 9-4-2015 at 05:03 PM

I have an opened EXP on my sale page. Displayed it and couldn't find the bag afterward
http://www.bigmikeskites.com/WebPages/SaleItems.html

volock - 9-4-2015 at 07:07 PM

Quote:

[quote=289408&tid=30250&author=Kinsztel]
You all said Rev's are easier, more stable and more forgivin, more precise - right? Will that apply also to Revolution EXP?

Yup. I've had my Revo time split between the EXP, Blast and Indoor. Outside of low wind range, I'd not there's a any practical limit on tricks that can be done on one and not the other (indoor being a slight exception inre tricks with no wind). I only got to fly the indoor once though.

Quote:

OK so the questions to HQ Mojo owners:
Are those "tricks" and kite behaviour presented in the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87JvCGMC514
possible to do with Mojo? Mostly I didnt get answer - is "dive-stop" monouver possible to do?

Yes those are possible for the Mojo, but the dive stop is going to be a bit harder, and take a lot lot more finesse to manage. The mojo was twitchy enough, I'd have been concerned with inland wind/or twitchiness and hitting someone even with my few years of flying.

Quote:

Questions to Rev (Rev Exp) owners
is that "flat spin" done by Mojo shown here possible in Rev?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnsduNkASLc#t=19 (0m20s)

No different doing it on one or the other.

Quote:

Also: HQ Mojo in the shop I can order comes with 4 links (how you call it in english?) and the kite cover. Those are not included with any Revolution offered... so the question is - how do you pack and keep you kite in your home? Do you use "cover" so it is protected?
Edit: I found it called "kite bag", isn't it?

I have http://intothewind.com/shop/Line_and_Accessories/Kite_Packs_... which I use for carrying all of my sparred stunt kites and keep everything stored together and organized. Kite bag isn't necessary, any duffel bag could be used as one. Truthfully my wife bought me that bag so I didn't have stuff everywhere.

Quote:

And what about Kite lines?
How strength (kilograms) and how long (meters) should be a line for Mojo/Rev Exp?
I have seen lines that have between 30kg - 500kg strength
and also were between 20 metres - 100 metres long

Whatever lines it comes with will work. I don't fly stunt kites enough anymore to have a well formed opinion. Generally speaking lighter strength means that it has less drag and can allow low wind a bit better, but reduce the ability for high wind if you go with too weak. Generally I fly stunt kites on whatever lines I have and don't pay attention. Power kites I pay attention to strength as I don't want it to break if I jump or at a bad time.

Quote:

How is that comparable to all Rev being better than HQ Mojo?
Isn't it like Rev Exp is just cheaper version of Revolution 1.5 and thus comparable to Mojo?
Is that true that Mojo - because it is more ovoid and smaller - will be faster than Revo Exp?

I'm not well informed enough to comment specifically. Smaller kites can often be faster, and also twitchier and harder to control in unsteady winds and easy to have get out of control while doing spins and such. That's not necessarily true of all or the two you're comparing, so I'm going to shut up now.

Kinsztel - 10-4-2015 at 02:22 AM

Thank you volock

What did you mean by

Quote:

No different doing it on one or the other.

I really didn't get syntax of that sentence (sorry, english is not my native language so I am missing those subtle speech-things)

povlhp - 10-4-2015 at 10:22 AM

The EXP is heavier due to cheaper materials. The newer models are Icarex PC40. So will fly in lighter wind. But lighter wind requires lighter frame.
Look for skyshark P90 for light frame, P200 for std frame, lighter than included. Available in Europe for €7 or so per rod. Keep center piece in Leading edge or remember to buy ferrules to glue into custom centerpiece.
Kitelife.com and rev forums has more discussion on this

volock - 11-4-2015 at 08:34 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Kinsztel

Thank you volock

What did you mean by

Quote:

No different doing it on one or the other.

I really didn't get syntax of that sentence (sorry, english is not my native language so I am missing those subtle speech-things)

The trick is done exactly the same on both kites. You won't have any problem doing it on the mojo or rev. It's done in the same way on both.

grigorib - 13-4-2015 at 08:25 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Kinsztel

Isn't it like Rev Exp is just cheaper version of Revolution 1.5 and thus comparable to Mojo?

Is that true that Mojo - because it is more ovoid and smaller - will be faster than Revo Exp?

A basic version of Corvette is still way much cooler than a fully loaded Taurus.

You'd have to whack the EXP with a hammer couple of times, repair it with a heavy duct tape, spray the rods with WD40 so they would slide into the leading edge with that duct tape on and probably then you'd twice as much more precision and fun as on Mojo. A bit exaggerating but you're looking for fun in first place probably, the most affordable is to have no kites at all but when you're getting kites - get a good one.

Smaller results in less precise, more unpredictable and jerky behavior. And Mojo is not so much smaller than EXP, BTW.

You can get a used EXP off ebay for a $120 plus shipping and then you'd keep and fly it for decades not ever having to regret in tune of "have I had bought the Rev...".