Power Kite Forum

The value in holding on to your kites.

Bladerunner - 27-6-2015 at 03:24 PM

I was very fortunate to have the chance to fly all sorts of kites through the years. Team riding gave me an opportunity to really " try before I buy " . Those were sort of " the good old days " and now things have sort of died off around here.

I think my Arcxperience was a big eye opener. I owned 12m F-arc, 13 and 18m Gueriila's . F-arc was too much and the G I's too slow. I moved to Flysurfer. A few years later I got to demo the Charger proto at NABX and was won over again. Fortunately for me it wasn't in production yet. In the mean time I was given the use of a 15m Syn' . Just right! I loved it and bought it once I turned it into a used demo. ;) . Best move I have made in this sport. The Chargers came out and just didn't fit my style so I sold them off and stuck with the Synergy's.

Times changed and I had to call a halt to buying for a while. What it has taught me is that I wasn't ever getting completely " in tune " with the kites I was flying. Sure I could react as each style of kite dictated but I wasn't really getting the most out of them. I don't do a log but would guess I get out less than twice a month averaged over the year. It took me a long time to not be afraid of my 18m Phantom and start really pushing it's limits. I am still just getting relaxed under the 19m SA.

I now have a quiver of older kites. On the used market they aren't worth much but to me they are priceless! Thing is I am enjoying them as much and more now that I know we are old friends. Having that connection with my kites is far more valuable to me. I already know how to get the max this or that out of them and realize now that it will take many hours to get that connected to something that can potentially do this or that better. I will stick with what I know and try to get the most fun out of my limited fly time.

I am in no hurry to replace anything in my quiver even though I can afford to again. That said there are changes happening out there. I am chomping at the bit to get into a single skin but am forcing myself to wait until more depower options become available.

Windstruck - 27-6-2015 at 04:37 PM

Ken (that's your name, right?) - That was a nice piece, thanks for posting. I have a fair number of "old friends" in my garage from various endeavors I've obsessed over through the decades of my adult life. I can't tell you how many times I've searched for some old treasure only to realize it just didn't make the cut in one or another move over the years. What I especially liked about your write up was the appreciation you clearly have gained over time with each of your various favorite kites. Evokes in me one of my more favorite expressions: "If a man knows what he likes he does not need to continue to change." :cool2:

I too look forward to a (hoped for) continued kite evolution into single-skinned DPs. While I don't hold a candle to your experience level or exposure to the multitude of kite design options that have risen and fallen over the years, my go-to kite for buggying this summer so far has pretty consistently been my 12M Peak2. I appreciate it for its sheer grunt, low wind starting range and DP safety valve, but also my lack of worry if I slam it into the ground (which I'm sorry to say I still do from time to time). Also, (and I don't know if this would be a class-effect or just a P2 peculiarity) that single skin DP has less lift than my two PL Lynx kites even though it is considerably larger. For me that is a distinctly positive attribute as I have little interest in going vertical.

Especially nice is the P2s light weight and small pack ability. It would be cool to be able to carry an entire SS DP quiver with just one bar in a single backpack. Loaded for bear in one tidy package! :thumbup:

Devoted - 27-6-2015 at 05:02 PM

I wish I could have had hold on to my quiver. Wow. But, the second hand market gave me the options to try new kites. Somehow I use make good deals. Like get a complete Venom range for x dollars and sell the 2 I did not use for the same amount of x dollars. So it got me going.
Besides that I used to organize events and help out at events by teaching people how to fly. Besides my own quiver, I used to fly a lot of different brands and kites because they where on demo or teaching material. It thought me what I wanted out of a kite.

When I moved to America and finally got married, I sold my quiver. I chose wife and kids. 2 young kids. Money was needed elsewhere. Best choice ever. I brought me family life and different responsibilities. And we discovered the world. Canada, America, Europe.

Looking around here, there are a lot of kitesurfers, but barely powerkiters or landboarders. Haven't seen a buggy since I moved to America.

I miss old days. Hanging around with a group of friends and fellow kiters. Sharing coffee and soup on cold days, or a beer on warm days. Talking about the great ride, jump or speed.

In the end I discovered I love kiting. I like to surf, but love to kite.
I was fortunate, just as bladerunner, to be able to try kites. And I notice at least one of the kites in my quiver has to be an oldie. For me its going to be a phantom. Just because of the feeling they give me. I learned jumping under these kites and to me the phantom stands for a time in my life where I lived inaccurate different country and had fun hanging around with friends exploring the sport. And the wonderful design.ofcourse.

So I agree with Bladerunner...who used his words wonderful and with passion.
We can become attached to kites for several reasons. And the good feelings a kite can give.

Sniff, sniff,....I need a phanny...
:smilegrin:

soliver - 27-6-2015 at 08:10 PM

I only wish I could have held on to what I've had, because I really have loved something about all of the kites I've had... problem for me has been that in order to get the next thing, I've had to sell the last thing... I've only been at this for 3 years and have loved and lost many a kite :no: ... its too bad too because in spite of selling them, there has been something really valuable to me in each one... barring a small few.

1oldkid - 27-6-2015 at 08:17 PM

I have felt the same way...
The whole time I had my 19m SA and Montana listed, it didn't "feel right" to sell them. My kites are the one's I learned with, even though some were used less than others.

Good words above, and as we all experience, life does happen.

:thumbup:

jrhook - 28-6-2015 at 03:44 AM

...and just to throw in here, it's the willingness of others to unload kites for whatever reason that helps to expand the sport to folks just discovering the awsomeness of it all, like myself.

The cost of putting together any viable quiver is greatly reduced by the willingness of others to part with kites that overlap too much with others they own. I've purchased 3 new and 3 used (original trainer sold) right here on PKF, and appreciate every one of them equally. Smoke 'em if you got 'em or unload them so somebody else can have the same experience you did and learn a bit more along the way!

PHREERIDER - 28-6-2015 at 04:51 AM

i guess we all have a threshold of the variety we want and value that. kites that will last for 1000's of hours of use are worth holding onto , like arcs and flysurfers, these units are ALWAYS ready to rock.

tubes turn to uselessnes fairly quickly, and make poor back up. definitely have fun with vintage stuff but an old slow tube is just not enjoyable at all. for some easy land board sessions they do ok but for water not even a consideration. old, fragile, better off harvested for material sometimes, i have an old 19m takoon i've been clipping on for years for material backing for repairs.

for heavy use, safety is a consideration once the fabric starts failing its over. there are limits



Devoted - 28-6-2015 at 08:22 AM

Jrhook and Phreerider both make a good point. The secondhand market helps me out now. 10 years ago, a wifeand two kids less, money had a different value for me.

AND YES...the kitss be ame different, but most progress booked o er time is the safety. Now we know safety is important. Back in the days..it was just trying things out and see how it goes. I appreciate better safety on the kite and body.

Bladerunner - 28-6-2015 at 09:14 AM

I thought about both Phree and Soliver as I wrote this. Nice that you both read it!

I expect that you get almost as many hours in over a 2 - 3 month period as I get in in a year Chad. As you know, I envy you and your situation. Lots of time to experiment. I can go almost 2 months between seasons without any fly time. Winter offers me about 4- 6 sessions and often those are limited time with days being so short up north. Having the kite and it's safety set unto my old reflex memories becomes priceless.

Changing out your quiver for something that better suites your needs ( and reduce injury ) made very good sense Soliver. Your situation is slightly different. The NS3 and Peak are sort of break through kites? NS3 may not develop too much farther too fast but I suspect the single skin depower market to change + gain competition. Still ..... you have found " your " kites now. Both kites take a unique style of handling and I can only imagine that becoming as one with them will take a bit of time. You are well on your way. The tuned down lift is sort of attractive to me with the new single skin depowers. When I do expand my quiver it will be with the fact that my jumping days are going to run out sooner than later.

soliver - 28-6-2015 at 12:27 PM

Thanks for the kind words Ken,... I have moments where I think about and seriously regret passing on my very loved RII's and even the 5.1m PL Core I sold a while back (REALLY loved that kite)... but the truth of the matter is that I just cannot afford to get new (even used) stuff without parting with something. If I have bought stuff, I've sold stuff from my shop, from my closet, from my quiver... I parted with a 1978 Ernie Ball Stingray Music Man Bass guitar that I LOVED to buy my first buggy, because it was doing nothing but gathering dust in a closet. The other thing I think about when I consider missing my previous foils is that potential for injury... I feel safe with my NS3's because I KNOW they're safe... the potential for getting lofted is so small, it's almost not there. And all of this is not to say that foils are not safe... I know they are if you use them safely,... but I fear that one split second oops that they present and I just can't allow myself to go through that again.

Wifey just chimed in too and said it also is important to sell to buy so she will still continue to love me :smilegrin:

ssayre - 28-6-2015 at 12:36 PM

I'm in the same boat as Spencer. I would have kept most of the kites I've sold if I could. However, I'm not interested in a huge collection of seldom used kites. I like having a small collection of kites that I can fly blind and get the most use out of for my conditions and style. There is huge value in knowing and understanding all of your kites capabilities and limits. I feel like I have exploited nearly all of my kites potential with the exception of continuing to push the upper end of the peak. I'm quite familiar with the low end by default.

riffclown - 28-6-2015 at 01:02 PM

Yeah, Getting there. Contemplating unloading a lot of what rarely gets used...

PHREERIDER - 28-6-2015 at 02:00 PM

great topic! Ken u know i gotta have my daily motion

kites can be replaced, and i like a bunch different types. the good ones always hang around and the more time spent on the good ones is what you want! keeping them long enough so you become well matched with it, for reasons like... feel at the bar , usable power range, and if it aligns with your balance, speed and timing you will want to keep it.

theres KNOW warranty with fun like this.

and true, a huge collection will go unused even if you got breeze.



Cheeks - 28-6-2015 at 05:35 PM

A while back I cleaned house. Kites and buggy. I had made the mistake of trying to get into the sport on the cheap buying some pretty knurly junk. Had to dip my toe into the pool first.
They flew and I learned on them but I realized that I needed to move up or get out. The quiver I sold was a good training set for someone also wanting to get into the sport on the cheap.

At this point in time I'm pretty happy with my quiver. Several kites of the same just different wind ranges with the same or similar flight characteristics. Some are new and some are used but this set will stay with me till I master them all before I move on and that may take a while.

The worst thing is the trendy impulse kites that come along from time to time . Single skins and NPW's. You just have to try them. These I will move on if they don't pan out.

One other point is how much money are we going to spend on this sport. I will ride out my investment for a while as best as I can (yea right). Maybe adjusting my wind range to fit my flying style and the fields I fly on. But my big bucks have been spent and I'm a happy buggy pilot.

Cheeks - 28-6-2015 at 06:51 PM

A while back I cleaned house. Kites and buggy. I had made the mistake of trying to get into the sport on the cheap buying some pretty knurly junk. Had to dip my toe into the pool first.
They flew and I learned on them but I realized that I needed to move up or get out. The quiver I sold was a good training set for someone also wanting to get into the sport on the cheap.

At this point in time I'm pretty happy with my quiver. Several kites of the same just different wind ranges with the same or similar flight characteristics. Some are new and some are used but this set will stay with me till I master them all before I move on and that may take a while.

The worst thing is the trendy impulse kites that come along from time to time . Single skins and NPW's. You just have to try them. These I will move on if they don't pan out.

One other point is how much money are we going to spend on this sport. I will ride out my investment for a while as best as I can (yea right). Maybe adjusting my wind range to fit my flying style and the fields I fly on. But my big bucks have been spent and I'm a happy buggy pilot.

Proletariat - 20-10-2015 at 10:29 PM

You guys are makin' me feel bad. Yeah, I know I have a problem :)

Like Blade, I don't get out much. Young child, demanding job and garbage winds all conspire to keep my kites in the bags. (Un?)fortunately, in my down time, I have a hobby. I buy and sell kites, apparently. I love trying all the different kites out and I'm sort of a gear nerd so I love checking out the innovation in the industry (like the Peak and the Cronix, for instance). I have a decent quiver right now, but there are a handful of kites that I will always miss.

9m Peak I
15m Phantom I
10m Speed 4

I flew these guys enough to where I really understood them, with the exception of the phantom, which I just never gave enough attention to. Now that I'm onto Tube kites the only one that I feel this affinity for is the 2012 14m Slingshot Rally. Unfortunately, like Chad says, the life span on these things just isn't the same as foils, so if I don't go riding soon, I'll probably sell it out of sheer boredom :)

Also, I think it's important to look back nostalgically on the kites we hate. The ones that betrayed us. The ones that we were glad to see go. For me, these are (in order of dislike)

3m Pansh Ace
4m Pansh Flux
12 Cabrinha Omega
18m Guerilla I (okay, I actually kinda loved the Geurilla. It was a pig but awesome. I was not unhappy to see it go, however)
19m Venom I (long story)
10m Psycho 2 (my head STILL hurts!)
15m Psycho 3 (these kites are fine, just keep them out of Colorado)

Balance in all things. Embrace your dark side, Blade :)

bigkid - 21-10-2015 at 08:53 AM

I just got around to reading this post, not bad Ken. Great topic.

being a dealer and a distributor for a half dozen companies has given me the opportunity to try and use most every type and make of kites along with buggies, boards, and all the stuff that goes with the sport.
It has been frustrating and enjoyable to demo everything. Some of the stuff I like and some of the stuff is on my "never again" list, while the rest of it is OK stuff.

Biggest problem for me is that I have a style of flying and not everything is conducive to that style. You might know the style, "Mach 10 with my hair on fire". At least it was until June of 2010, now its just be able to drive home after a bit of flying.
With that being said it has taken some time to complete my quiver of Centuries of which the 12.5m is my go to kite for most of the time.
I have sold most of the demo kites and most of the new demo kites that I never got around to flying and have kept a few complete quivers of the ones I liked the best. I have the first 2 kites I bought that started this long road to where I have ended up. For me I have no kite that I regret selling or miss. If we are talking about buggies, thats another story. I regret it everytime I get in my buggies, the one I sold that I will regret until the kid calls me to say its for sale. At which point I will drive 6 hours one way to buy it back. The MG Croozer is the one that got away.

abkayak - 21-10-2015 at 05:49 PM

I hate selling a kite...even to finance another
It's just so sad

3shot - 21-10-2015 at 06:01 PM

Miss my Bullets...

volock - 21-10-2015 at 06:46 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Proletariat  

3m Pansh Ace


But how can you not miss your Ace? I love both my Ace(s) despite I rarely can fly them because of our gusty winds. They're a ton of fun, kind of like a cheap version of the PL Twister. I still like going arm workout with the 5m/7m in the winter in thick wind and deep powder.

Dayhiker - 22-10-2015 at 02:45 AM

Edit: I have much to learn.

Windy Heap - 22-10-2015 at 12:37 PM

In the OP's message, what I heard is Become in Tune with the kite(s) you have.


literally tune them, trim the brake lines to your riding style and conditions that day.


So often people buy buy buy, always in search of the magic pill, or magic bullet.


Good example is the idiots who will buy a ~$800 golf club thinking it'll help his game.



I have no problem re-homing a kite, it'll be loved instead of growing dust on a shelf.

But you do have to sample lots of flavors of foils, to find what taste you like.

AD72 - 22-10-2015 at 11:23 PM

I am glad to hear my old SA2 19 is still in use. That was a fun kite. I am just down to 3. 7m 10m and 13m. I once had 10 kites at one time. It was good to try different things. Now I like the consistency of the 3 I own for muscle memory. I know exactly how they behave and am used to their timing.

Bladerunner - 23-10-2015 at 05:12 AM

Quote: Originally posted by AD72  
I am glad to hear my old SA2 19 is still in use. That was a fun kite. I am just down to 3. 7m 10m and 13m. I once had 10 kites at one time. It was good to try different things. Now I like the consistency of the 3 I own for muscle memory. I know exactly how they behave and am used to their timing.


The 19 has definitely found it's place in my quiver! It doesn't fit our small parks but is ideal when I get room. I'm only really at the comfort zone stage with this one. I think I have only had it out 1/2 dozen times so far. I KNOW I will get much more out of it in good time. It leaves me in no rush to jump on the depower race foil band wagon. Actually it's a good example of what I am trying to describe. Selling a technical kite like the Speed for a newer more technical kite is something I would have done back in the day. Now I am seeing that holding on to a quality kite that is doing everything you hope it will has value. Selling before YOU have become in tune with it completely is sort of a shame. Something I have been very guilty of in the past!

I totally agree with folks who talk about wanting to fly all styles. That was a big part of my goal at 1st. I am very glad I went through that phase. Now that I get out less often I am just seeing the value in having " old friends " that you can fly comfortably into their upper wind ranges. In many ways being able to do so is making me a better / safer pilot.