Power Kite Forum - New lineset ..... did I get junk ?

New lineset ..... did I get junk ?

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 10:07 AM

I recieved my new lineset in the mail the other day and the sleeving is knotted not stitched. I assumed they all came stitched. I guess I was wrong and thats what I get for assuming. Do most linesets come knotted or am I the lucky one? If I would have known they came knotted I could have done that.

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 10:12 AM

Oh forgot to include the brand they are suppose to be HQ lines. These knots suck they're getting caught up on my bridles.:flaming: I guess I need to learn how to sew faster than I thought.

Pdxnebula - 7-11-2007 at 10:17 AM

Unless whomever, states that the line loops are sewn, then you can bet that their probably just knotted...

JoJo1 - 7-11-2007 at 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dlish89
Oh forgot to include the brand they are suppose to be HQ lines. These knots suck they're getting caught up on my bridles.:flaming: I guess I need to learn how to sew faster than I thought.

'
Linesets come both ways to be honest. Knotted unstiched linesets can be equalized a whole lot easier without stiched sleeving, but stiched sleeving doesn't get tangled as easy I have both type of lines. I would have to say though that HQ line is not near the best line out there. Try some JoJo or libre linsets next time you will b a lot happier in the end as those lines do not strech near as easy as others leaving you flying instead of equalizing linesets . As you get what you pay for in this sport for sure.

Big John
JoJo1

Pdxnebula - 7-11-2007 at 10:24 AM

Also dont forget the difference in Spectra & Dyneema, Spectra 4% stretch & Dyneema 5%...

Quote:

Originally posted by JoJo1

Quote:

B-Roc - 7-11-2007 at 10:24 AM

I agree with Big John. I tie most of my own linesets and use knotted sleeves. Its not as clean a finish but it is more than satisfactory and much easier to equalize if the lines do stretch.

powerzone - 7-11-2007 at 10:37 AM

some heat-shrink tubing over the knotted area helps to "smooth-out" the grabby-ness of other bridles.

the ultimate is to splice the lines since the spectra is a hollow braid it is easy.

Pdxnebula - 7-11-2007 at 10:44 AM

This looks promising...

http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Food_Industry/Ho...

acampbell - 7-11-2007 at 10:50 AM

Some of the HQ plain white lines are sleeved and knotted.
Their colored line sets, now shipping with all 4-line production are pre-stretched, sleeved and sewn. I have had no problems with stretch or mis-match.

I have seen PL colored line sets knotted and sleeved that are out by as much as 8" right out of the bag, requiring evening up. Theys are in some production models. Again, I have never seen their sewn sets mis-matched.

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 10:50 AM

Unfortunately I read the difference between spectra and dyneema after I ordered the lines. Where is a good place online to buy bulk spectra and sleeving? I just assume make my own lines and maybe I will be able to save some money in the process.

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 10:58 AM

powerzone
heat shrink is an excellent idea. by splicing are you refering to making a loop and then bring the line back through itself ? Plus I thought spectra touching spectra was a bad idea.

B-Roc - 7-11-2007 at 11:07 AM

Bulk spectra may be hard to come by as Laser Pro was a major supplier and they aren't really selling to the kite industry in rolls any more though I know The Kite Connection has some. Shanti is another provider of bulk spectra though often not in the weights we require.

Spectra and Dyneema are pretty much the same thing except in the States we call it spectra (copyright reasons, I believe) whereas in Europe its pretty much Dyneema that is what's sold. Regardless, there's not that much a difference in the higher quality rolls but there will be differences from company to company based on the braid style of the line manafacturer.

Its dacron you want to avoid - not dyneema.

Bulk dyneema can be bought at http://www.funwithwind.com/store/dynamicIndex.asp weights appropriate for power kiting (I just picked some rolls up last month to redo lines).

Most good kite stores will sell linesets or spools and even make sets up for you if you ask. Don't forget your sleeving and calculate for that when ordering your rolls so you don't wind up short if making multiple sets off a roll.

Be careful with the heat shrink as dyneema / spectra has a very low melting point. If you over shoot the heat shrink with the flame or heat it too much, you are going to compromise or melt your line straight through. Better to use a heat gun or hair dryer then a zippo for this task.

BeamerBob - 7-11-2007 at 11:21 AM

Ok, you hit on something I don't understand. I have sleeved multiple sets of lines and had matching lengths to within 1/16" or better. Was I supposed to heat shrink my sleeving? I've never heard about doing that. Does this apply to all sleeving or just some types? Would that not make it difficult to untie your knots it you needed to adjust the length slightly in the future?:puzzled:

Edit: Sorry, some posts came in that I didn't notice. I understand now that you are shrinking the tape over the sleeving and not the sleeving itself. That would really smooth things out.

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 11:32 AM

B-roc check it out.
http://www.gwtw-kites.com/extras/shanti.htm
Not quite the same as we thought.
Beamer the heatsink would be to cover the knot to keep the knot from catching on the other lines. Then cut off the heatsink, adjust your lines and put on new heatsink. This could even be done with some black electrical tape, but it wouldn't be as nice as heatsink.

acampbell - 7-11-2007 at 11:43 AM

Dyneema © is a registered trade name of the Dutch company DSM Dyneema, B.V. They have a factory in Greenville, NC, U.S.A.

Spectra © is a registered trade name of the U.S. firm Honeywell International Inc.

Both are fibers independently developed by their respective manufacturers and while their production details likely differ, both are made of Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene, or UHMWPE fibers. Spectra has slightly less stretch and has a slightly different feel to it. Shanti kitelines are spectra woven to a certain specification for them. They go up to about 360 lbs test.

awindofchange - 7-11-2007 at 12:18 PM

We have Shanti Warp Speed Spectra in stock up to 500# and can make any line set at any length, even multiple weights. We have both pre-made linesets that are stretched and sleeved, also bulk line, bulk sleeving and sleeving tools. Shanti and Laser Pro are the best kite lines you can buy. I also prefer sleeving and knots for easy adjustments. We also have a page that shows knotless loops (splicing) if anyone is interested in this method. It takes much longer than knots but is very clean with nothing to snag. The page shows splicing 500# spectra but any weight can be spliced as long as it is hollow core.

Here is the splicing page:
http://www.awindofchange.com/splice.html

Hope this helps.

Mikey17 - 7-11-2007 at 03:48 PM

i use ozone line at the moment and it seems strong (havent had any stretching problems) tis a bit expensive though. £36 for the freestyle set:wow:

Pdxnebula - 7-11-2007 at 04:14 PM

Ya; what you said Angus...

BeamerBob - 7-11-2007 at 07:32 PM

I like that splicing stuff. Only the first 3 pics work. It says forbidden.

DAKITEZ - 7-11-2007 at 08:54 PM

I agree splicing looks very clean, and no loss in line strength is just a bonus. I couldn't get all the pics to work either.

JoJo1 - 7-11-2007 at 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mikey17
i use ozone line at the moment and it seems strong (havent had any stretching problems) tis a bit expensive though. £36 for the freestyle set:wow:

The ozone stuff is the same as the libre and JoJo lines. I have been using them for probably the last 6-7 yrs and they are amazing lines they just don't stretch. I use these brand lines on all of my kites to 8 meters and above that to 14 meters I use Lazer Pro Gold I like this stuff a lot, but it will stretch so I stick with it where I feel that it is most important light wind big kite flying where even line shape is important to me and a couple of other guys I know :smilegrin:

. I have also used berry blue if I spelled that right a long time ago, but that stuff was better for stick kites not power kites and may not even be made any more as this was back in the mid 90's and I have not really flown or owned stick kites since I started buggying.

I would definately stick with one of these three above mentioned brands for the newbie it is less maintenance and for the seasoned guy more time ripping up the session. You may purchase the JoJo and Libre lines from KBSS my sponsor.

Big john
JoJo1

speleopower - 7-11-2007 at 09:08 PM

I was a huge fan of Laser Pro Gold line for my brakes but I've not seen it for sale in while. I had several 1000' spools but either used it or sold it :mad:

Scott

B-Roc - 8-11-2007 at 07:00 AM

I like LPG too but I think it maxes out at 300#. It is not being distributed on small spools anymore and only selectively to kite stores in large spools (1000').

I talked to Dave Shenkman at the kite connection last month about this - he is a personal friend of the maker of LPG and they have turned their business more to the fishing and textile market than kiting but they hook him up as a favor to a friend.

awindofchange - 8-11-2007 at 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BeamerBob
I like that splicing stuff. Only the first 3 pics work. It says forbidden.

The pictures are now fixed and should work for you. Let me know if you have any other problems viewing the pics.