Power Kite Forum

Beginners, have a seat

macboy - 12-11-2007 at 11:59 PM

I'm a complete beginner. I had flown some 2 line sport kites previously and tried to convince myself that that meant something but really only that I knew about the window, and pulling to turn a kite. I think it bred some naivety in me - these things PULL!

I took day three today in stronger winds (20 km/h) and while to this point I'd been doing some super shuffle footwork to keep my feet under me, a good tug by the kite and an unintentional 8-10 foot stride convinced me to take a load off. I sat down, launched the kite and me, on my keester, went for a good 30 foot slide. Immediate effect? Ear to ear grin followed by a good 30 minutes of grass stains that the best laundry detergent will shudder in fear of.

Make sure you sweep the grass off your socks before you go in - wife made me vacuum ; )

Pdxnebula - 13-11-2007 at 12:12 AM

Welcome & Enjoy, it just gets better... Those 1st butt scuds are cool & the 1st real foot scuds, are even better, hope you've got room for the extra kites & lines & other goodies you'll be getting, (No worrys, it'll happen (Cant remember who said) "Its an Addiction & Im glad I've got it" & it will) You'll never look at Wind the same way again... Dont be afraid ask anything, there are "NO" dumb questions... & BTW the only cure??? MORE Wind & Bigger Kites...

:yes:

NPWfever - 13-11-2007 at 01:57 AM

GOD I loved my first scuds! They were sooooo sick, like you and everyone else here I started on my a$$, but was able to get to my feet within 5 mins. Its a ton easier with a small kite in higher wind (especially) on a baseball diamond, perfect scud surface. I say high wind small kite as it is easier to go straight at the kite (although I can hold an edge sometimes which is a riot as you go sooooo much faster, I am working on a steel edge I can strap onto my sneakers to help) So anyways, with a small kite you can do super fast figure 8's to get a ton of apparent wind and keep the kite powered.

So if you have a large kite/when you get one the easiest scuds are one to launch in the power zone (Seen some youtube's of guys rocket at no joke like 30mph cuz they used too big of a kite, use commen sense) but the easiest way to get on your feet is to sit on your heels and not actually you butt, and do it that way for a while. After that stand up like halfway and lean back, when you feel comfortable stand up, before you know it you will be able to start on your feet. Then you can start looking into making the newest fashion statement in the kite community, pop bottle shoes. (Ask if you are curious)

BTW for good cheap kites that are somewhat reasonable to the wife look at
panshkite.com
You will need to replace lines and handles, but hell $200 for a 12.5 meter isn't bad. I'm lovin my Ace!

Bladerunner - 13-11-2007 at 08:41 AM

If you don't want to get your butt kicked launching in high winds specially with bigger kites, launch from the side !

1st you lay your kite down holding one wingtip and letting the other flag down wind. Fold the tip of the upwind wing over and put a weight on it. Walk your lines out cross-wind instead of downwind. Once your lines are just getting tight pull more on the downwind side. It won't have weight on it and should lift and start to fill the kite with air. Take your time at this point !!! The kite will adjust its self as it fills. When it feels like it is ready to fly give the whole thing a jerk to pop the weight off the bottom and come to life. The kite will just sit there at the edge of the window waiting for you to work it up. It wiil be at zero power just like at zenith so a good safe spot to start out from.

If you have a buddy then He / She can just hold the kite for you at the side of the window. This is also the PROPER place to put your kite down , if you have an assistant. Pactice taking the kite down to the edge and holding it therelike you have an assistant then working it back up to zenith because it is the way an experienced kiter will expect you to go about things if he is assisting you.

Thumbs up to go and a pat on the head to land are the signs the assistant will look for.

GulfSandEater - 13-11-2007 at 09:37 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by snowbird
1st you lay your kite down holding one wingtip and letting the other flag down wind. Fold the tip of the upwind wing over and put a weight on it.


Hmmm, I'm not seeing this upwind wing fold in my head. Let's say I have the kite off to my right...the right of the power zone. It's laid out so that the right side of the kite is upwind and the left side of the kite is downwind. I'm not sure how I should fold the upwind (right) wingtip. Could you expound on the fold? Which direction? Fold over on top of the kite and weight the folded edge? Fold under the kite and weight the wingtip?

I assume that with the weight this is to provide a pivot point when filling so that the trailing (left) wingtip is forced to point toward the zenith as the kite fills. Is this right?

macboy - 13-11-2007 at 10:09 AM

Pop Bottle Shoes? Intrigued. Remind me to ask you in about a month or two so I don't take the new found info and kill myself with it before I really have a grasp of all the other stuff going on ; )

I'm assuming that provided your kite isn't prone to overflying the zenith, you could park it up there and slide it perfectly sideways down the window to end up softly coming down at the edge of the window? I'll certainly have to practice that next time I'm out. I was a little nervous yanking the brakes and bringing it down straight through the power zone yesterday. While the Rage does drop power nicely when the brakes are yarded in I do have a white knuckle grip on them lest I let go right in the middle of the powerzone.

DAKITEZ - 13-11-2007 at 05:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by snowbird
If you don't want to get your butt kicked launching in high winds specially with bigger kites, launch from the side !



If you have a buddy then He / She can just hold the kite for you at the side of the window. This is also the PROPER place to put your kite down , if you have an assistant. Pactice taking the kite down to the edge and holding it therelike you have an assistant then working it back up to zenith because it is the way an experienced kiter will expect you to go about things if he is assisting you.

Thumbs up to go and a pat on the head to land are the signs the assistant will look for.


I want to know how your suppose to pat your head in 25 - 30 mph winds !! :lol:

Bladerunner - 13-11-2007 at 07:34 PM

G.S.E.,

You pretty much have it. The right wing is the weighted on ( upwind ) when on the right side. Kite sits bridle up. Fold about one foot over and place a weight on top. The fold helps in 2 ways. It seems to keep the kite from blowing around + it tosses the wieght away without getting in to the bridles when the kite comes to life.

Dlish,
I hook in, hold my bar / handles with my right hand and pat my head with my left :puzzled: Is that so difficult ?

NPWfever - 13-11-2007 at 09:23 PM

Pop bottle shoes are just 2 (preferably empty) 2 liter pop bottle with a hole cut in the top big enough to fit you shoe into. But you might want to put ductape around the hole, as it's fairly sharp. Also I have seen these things go super overboard, on another forum someone made some out of 4" PVC with a good amount of the top cut off and a cap glued to the front and back with a piece of stretchy PVC fabric tied over the hole with a small opening to keep stuff out and he also had a strap to keep his foot attached. Pretty cool tho, thought bout making a pair, and if I do there will be instructions. Man talk about scudding addiction to make something that complex.

LQTMS!

(laughing quietly to myself)

Pablo - 13-11-2007 at 10:49 PM

So with the kite at the right side of the wind window, lay the kite on it's back, belly up, take the right wingtip and fold about 1ft of the tip over on itslef. This will put the top edge of the kite facing up on the upwind tip. put the weight on this upwind folded tip.

The kite will now be flagged out, with the upwind tip pinned in place and the downwind tip lightly flapping in the wind. Now walk cross wind from the kite, you'll want it about 10-20 deg downwind from where you're standing, so the kite's pretty much right at the edge of the window. When you start applying pressure to the flying lines the downwind tip will start to curl up catching wind and filling the kite. Eventually either the weight on the downwind tip will simply pop off on its own or you'll have to give it a little tug to shake it loose. You fold the tip over so the weight doesn't get stuck in the kite or on the bridal. You should now have the kite parked at the side of the window.

Side note, if you're badly overpowered never keep the kite at zenith. You're always better to keep it on something like a 45deg angle to one side or the other, If you get hit by a gust with it overhead you'll get lofted, if it's to the side you'll just scudd.

macboy - 18-11-2007 at 03:19 PM

Can you land out there too? If so, how?

I went out today to practice but rather than start out there I figured I'd play a bit and then practice and never bothered because I couldn't figure out how to drop it to the ground over there.....

Pablo - 18-11-2007 at 08:56 PM

You can land at the edge, simply fly the kite towards the ground and keep going, Once it hits the ground, full brake. The kite will roll over a number of times and settle down close to straight downwind of you. If it settles nose down it may try and relaunch backwards, if it's nose down and opened up, let off the brakes and feed in some main lines. It'll park nose down on the ground.

Hardrock - 12-6-2008 at 01:53 AM

Hello all,
I'm very new to kites. Can't figure out what I need. Winds here are always around 5mph, thats what the weather channel says. I bought a Prsim P3 just to learn to fly. It seems easy enough. I want to be pulled around a bit and get some lift but not be killed. I'm 200lbs 5'10". My GF wants to get into jumping but is only 135lbs. I figure we need a 8m or so for the light winds but I'm reading there is a lot to consider between lift and pull. The guys I watch on youtube with four line kites doesn't seem to be able to apply the breaks. LOL. I'm thinking there isn't much advantage to having four lines on foot out in a field.
Your thoughts would be greatly apprecated.

Re tract that

Hardrock - 12-6-2008 at 01:19 PM

Hey guy's,

I found some real good post from Scoop. Answers alot of questions.

I need to spend a few more hours in this group, all the answers are here some where.

I'm sure I will post something later in the wrong group or just plain newbie like this again, please bare with me,

Laters,

furbowski - 13-6-2008 at 05:07 AM

@ hardrock: nice move, bro. you'll like it here....

you need to look into what the winds are seasonally in your area...

also do you live near any oceans or large lakes? If not, how about treeless hills?

i think you're about to learn a lot about wind!

i sailed over 50K miles offshore, about twice that coastal, and so i already knew wind pretty well when i started out, and that was a big help to me when I started...

don't get that 8m just yet... :lol:

edit... sorry macboy got carried away... yeah leading edge away, trailing edge closest to you, bridle on top, and gently with the left first to fill up slowly until it's pulling on the sand pile / weights, then give it a smooth pull back to get the the sand off. In dry soft sand with smaller kites, you don't need to fold the tip, but folding makes it easier to dump the heavier loads you need to use with bigger kites and winds. :ninja:

My first scuds were in dry soft sand and onshore breezes, so I didn't have to learn sitting down, it was a natural extension of leaning back and digging in to hold the kite. It's the safest surface to learn on.

I recently got dumped over ten feet in a gust while jumping and walked away from it to teach kayaking the next day with no twinges at all...:o

scudding hard on wet grass scares me, but I'm going to try those pop-bottle shoes!

furbo

Hardrock - 13-6-2008 at 08:22 PM

Hi furbo,

Been learning a little bout wind over the years. Got into putting up single line delta's while drifting on the lakes in a powerboat. Then flew some stunters on the long points to save on some boat gas and have some fun.
Bought a sutton flowform which the GF and I flew out of a kayak several times but never got any real wind, it was still fun to lay down the paddles and ride.

Maybe its the season but wind is not to good here in upstste SC. We have a nice park a couple miles away with 8 really big and nice baseball fields open to the public. Will be in there some.

Saturday we will be back on the lake looking for the wind. Taking the P3. There is usually good wind where we park the boat and get out for the day.

Maybe by next year we can try some duel line kites from the kayaks and leave the big boat.

Yea, the 8m seems a bit scary right now. But I was thinking it might fly eaiser in the light winds. Kind of like what ppl are saying bout the beamer 4 and 5, also the Ace 5. But don't know if we are ready for that much lift.

Laters,
Hard

pyro22487 - 25-7-2008 at 05:54 PM

i must say i have always wanted to fly my larger kites in higher wind. 7m and 14m ozones. the best i have done is teathered my self to a stake and that as fun and all but i really have been interested in jumping and the first time i tryed my 7 meter in higher wind about 10 maybe 12 miles i got pulled right of my feet the bottle shoes sounds like an idea i need to try. i also need to stop being such a baby i guess and untether my self. I'll let you guys know if I die. i really like this idea of soda bottle shoes. i am so trying that sunday

WELDNGOD - 25-7-2008 at 06:18 PM

you should NEVER be tethered. Does the term "drawn and quartered ring a bell"

BeamerBob - 25-7-2008 at 07:09 PM

Yep, you are just asking for an unpredictable situation to become life threatening instead of scary.

pyro22487 - 27-7-2008 at 01:08 AM

im a bit confused if seen people teathr themselves to cars and things alot. i also saw a pic on this site where a guy was teathered to something not sure what. i was told keep the lease short like 10 feet or less. im not quite sure how this could be life threatening though. please elaborate on these. im just trying to understand here.

pyro22487 - 27-7-2008 at 01:55 AM

ok i think i see where the confusion is i dont tie the teather to myself i tie it to my harness in the back and the kite in the front if the kite all the sudden gets a good gust all the strain from the kite teather combo are put on the harness. not on my body now i have heard of people like tieing ropes around themselves and then to a tree or something. that is a bad idea becuase yes drawn and quartered about describes it. there is a pick of a guy on this forum in another thread with a similar setup. i cant remmber the thread but its in this area.

SCREWYFITS - 27-7-2008 at 02:36 AM

hey pyro, is this the photo your speaking of...
http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=4714
This is strahser's son and strasher is on the other end of this tether ready to let some out or move forward and or around, but not a stationary object... I still don't think its recommended, tether is adding danger overall to a sport that is already dangerous... biggest thing is to be as safe as possible... a lot of things can be done but most people are going to recommend against them just to keep this a safe sport...

There is a point at where you kinda got to step up and fly in higher winds, bigger or more advanced kites but make sure you understand the winds, the kite and know your ability... this all comes with progression...

I just recently bumped from 3m kites to 5m kites and now I'm feeling out the 6.5m's, in winds that I would have never thought of when I started the 3m's... I call it bite the bullet and man-up, I also have the privilege of flying in clean wind... this speeds the learning curve pretty quickly...

Have fun and fly safe...

USA_Eli_A - 27-7-2008 at 10:20 AM

my first slides were from Ft. Stevens State Park to sunset beach, about 4 miles long, I was probably 8yrs old with a Team Hawaiian on 120 ft of 200#.....

then I stacked 2 of them....then something stronger.....2 stack of cloud cutters, then a 3 stack.....right after that we scored 4 6 and 9m force 10 foils....then pro-foils, then quadrafoils, then jojos, then ozone....pkd was in there but not long enough to remember them.

to think...it's been 20 years of getting "drug" around....I have super clean feet from all the sand and my shoes average about 10lbs each...

I've probably had 12 buggies, 20 mt boards, 10 kiteboard, over 50 different kites....all over the years...
geez.

pyro22487 - 27-7-2008 at 07:23 PM

ok that i understand i have talked to a few people about this one guy said as long as you keep it short there is no problem like maybe 6 or 7 feet but like i said i think it is time to step it up. I am getting tired of putting the stake in the ground anyways. I wont fly the 14 in anything stronger than 8 mile gusts mainly becuase I was lofted when the kite was strait up above me again i was tethered but no more now that i know about the shoes thing. I want to go to the beach to learn that way the only thing i have to worry about hitting is the graound around here the biggest place to fly is a field about maybe 350 yards long and the same wide. THe end of the field is nothing but trees so i dont want my kite to get away from me. Anyways i will definatly try this shoe idea.

lad - 2-1-2009 at 07:20 PM

I'd like to hear a little more about those PVC skis :smug: I guess turning and crosswind action is still out of the question?