Power Kite Forum - BIG TROUBLE 4 ME!

BIG TROUBLE 4 ME!

WELDNGOD - 23-2-2008 at 03:16 PM

Hello,

Your email regarding the incident at Grandview was forwarded to my attention. While the City of Hampton attempts to accommodate all types of recreational activities, in certain instances we have to examine the practice a little more closely. I have worked with Virginia State Parks and Hampton Parks for over 20 years and have dealt with a variety of situations involving natural areas. I have known the young lady who approached you at the beach for quite a few years and I can assure you that she has the best interest of the Nature Preserve in mind.

We have worked closely with the Virginia Dept. of Conservation and Recreation to develop a Resource Management Plan for Grandview in order to properly protect one of the last remaining preserves for wildlife on the Chesapeake Bay. We are now in the process of having Grandview Nature Preserve designated as a State Natural Area, with much stricter rules on usage by the public. Compatible uses that are approved by the state are photography, walking, swimming, sunbathing, and wildlife observation.

Any disturbance to the shore birds or other wildlife in the area is considered incompatible. The only wheeled traffic allowed on the beach is for maintenance and enforcement. Not only does beach activity frighten away wildlife, wheeled vehicles on the hard-packed mean low tide area disturb and destroy northeastern beach tiger beetle habitats. This is an endangered species and is protected by law. Our staff is being educated more now on what is and is not allowed on the beach at Grandview. Bicycles are no longer allowed and signs will be posted to this effect with a bike stand near the beach entrance.

It is not only the wheels on your particular vehicle that is of concern. The presence of such a large kite will certainly frighten away shore birds and wildlife that visitors come to observe. Grandview is one of the last and the largest nesting sites for the Least Tern on the Atlantic coast. They are slowly being driven away by beach activities. The endangered Piping Plover used to flourish at Grandview, but has met the same fate. We are limiting activities in order to reverse these trends.

While we appreciate the fact that people need areas for recreational use, we have to consider our dwindling natural resources and preserve what areas that we have left for this purpose. We would welcome your support and understanding in this matter as we strive to protect our wildlife resources.

Christopher Hickman

Natural Resources Manager

City of Hampton Parks and Recreation

(757) 825-4606

kullas - 23-2-2008 at 03:46 PM

And on top of all that i guess they charge you to go there (parking and other junk fees) and for the life of me i cant understand. They are funded by the state or the fed. and i pay taxes to both :?:

WELDNGOD - 23-2-2008 at 04:10 PM

Actually it is free, but it's a Land and Water Conservation Fund park

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beachrights - 23-2-2008 at 05:12 PM

Sounds like a tree hugger did not like your buggy? The fine disturbing those terns is $20,000 and a 2 year prison term! I know from nearly being arrested for static flying and my kites shadow was landing on a nesting area. Yes.. my shadow!

I knew the beach and the tern [piper plovers] issue from years of reading how off road vehicles have been banned from the beach during nesting periods.

I was about 200 feet from the nearest nest and there were plenty of others walking within 10 feet of the nest. They were left alone but my shadow was grounds for arrest. I got out of it- one ranger was really going to arrest me! I spoke to his superior and he knew it was an honest "mistake" and let me go.
Don't bother fighting this issue, the little birds will win! There is a local bumper sticker that you see on many trucks around here that say: "Piper Plovers, tastes like chicken" this is their way of protesting.

Sounds like it is time to find a "new nesting ground" for the buggy!

WELDNGOD - 23-2-2008 at 05:49 PM

They do?:flaming: Fried chicken?:flaming:

Bladerunner - 23-2-2008 at 07:08 PM

We have a nature group buying up one of our launch sites and generally trying to run us off the bay. They are actually a front for the duck hunters in the area. We have a potential battle with a much richer group than you.
You may want to look into what constitutes national waters. It is usually measured from high tide and often the flats you are riding at low tide are actaully off shore ???

beachrights - 23-2-2008 at 08:33 PM

Snowbird gets a star for extra credit!! The sad thing is I tried that approach on my "incident". A "shadow" or "scare" can come from any distance. I was standing on the flats at the waterline at lowtide.
You can use an area that has terns but disturbing them in any manner is unlawful.

I guess you could say the little buggers are in a witness protection program!

WELDNGOD - 24-2-2008 at 07:32 AM

My biggest beef is Langley AFB runway is two miles away and pointed right at this place. Fighter jets comin in off the ocean screamin so loud it's crazy. But that is O.k. that doesn't disturbed them?

beachrights - 24-2-2008 at 09:46 AM

The Feds supply the terns with ear plugs!

WELDNGOD - 24-2-2008 at 10:27 AM

Be better to supply the tree huggers w/ buttplugs

barnes - 24-2-2008 at 10:33 AM

Why do people like them feel that they can interfere with normal nature? Man develops fun, birds deal with it, go to a new tree. Beatles can't mate? Well thats called evolution. Life supposed to carry on that way, why do they think they can rewrite the inevitable?

WELDNGOD - 26-2-2008 at 12:55 PM

I forgot to mention all the dog walkers that let their animals run loose. Wouldn't a predator in the dunes be a problem? Happens several times a day. And the beetles don't live underwater, the sand I ride on spends 50% of the time underwater. My lines are 82 ft long ,the beach is 100 ft wide. I can't fly over the dunes(most of the time it's over water)So I'm not disturbing anything. It's all just a way to harass the LONE kiter.They don't like what I'm doin' so they gotta squash it before it spreads. I am literally the only kiter around here. And for them that is one to many .ATTENTION! THE CITY OF HAMPTON VIRGINIA IS NOT KITER FRIENDLY DON'T COME HERE FOR VACATION .IF YOU COME TO THIS AREA STAY OUT OF HAMPTON AS THERE IS NOTHING HERE FOR YOU . NO FUN ALLOWED consider yourselves warned.

barnes - 26-2-2008 at 02:07 PM

Perhaps a kiter meetup/protest... :saint:

KYTE SLINGER - 26-2-2008 at 04:16 PM

it for your own good....

they don't want to alarm/panic the public.... that the Snowy Plovers are a nocturnal creature and has a appetite for flesh and blood..... don't underestimate them in large numbers

seals and other marine animals wash up on shore all the time... ever thought what happen :puzzled: ..there you go !

PLOVERS:bird:

it's for public safety to stay away as far as you can from the one tooth flesh eating creature or theirs going to be a homicide chalk out line next to that guy who use to buggy :lol:

:D

But really we had the same go on here but won them over
so we made a joke out of it

Its because you can read &write English ...try telling a raccoon "CAN"T YOU READ THE SIGN"

WELDNGOD - 26-2-2008 at 05:39 PM

A protest of one? not gonna get very far w/that.

KYTE SLINGER - 26-2-2008 at 06:48 PM

Protest is NOT the way to go....

1st I buggy in a Marine sanctuary and one of the largest along the California coast in Monterey...

get Involved, study the birds and the habitat, are they nesting, feeding or resting{ take photos }of the surroundings, is the beach in a metro or secluded area, if so how much of each and were else {near by areas}

what are they feeding on?

log any other predators

attend any meeting that are involved in the beach front

Head up a beach clean up, volunteer with the SPCA, life guards , harbor master and fish and game all of of the agencies know who I am and what I do, I can cover more beach {and faster} with less harmful effect on the environment in short I'm an extra pair of eyes for them and I'm down at the beach almost every weekend and then some.

get involved, introduce yourself , give them a bit of history pertaining to kites Samuel F Cody , the Wright bros, Ben Franklin, and one of our greatest play writers of all time use to fly kites for 13 years for the Royal Kyte Fliers.......William Shakespeare...

have ammo instead of being a target

Sthrasher38 - 27-2-2008 at 05:32 PM

Excellent advice KYTE SLINGER! I am impressed.:wow:

KYTE SLINGER - 3-3-2008 at 10:17 AM

I ran into a different group the other day that belong to Moss Landing Research Center that surveys the sanctuary along the beaches and tributaries that has a two day class for their volunteers...
not that I want to volunteer or go on research studies but for my own knowledge on what is going on with the habitat surrounding the beach I fly on...
in the short time I spent with the two beautiful ladies I learned a bit more in what to look for in dead birds as for cause of death.. the species that was present was starved and the lady's went into in how the food they feed on moves in and out of migration periods due to weather, tides and thermal currents in the ocean....

They do a study once a month on my sector of beach were is I'm OTB {On the Beach} every weekend..... I'll be tending the classes just for my sake

SamN - 24-7-2008 at 01:37 PM

I fly in the flats off of factory point(hampton). The cops/ marine patrol have never aproached me...

kitedemon - 24-7-2008 at 03:50 PM

KYTE SLINGER Has the right of it, you can't beat em so join em and kite on the side.... :karate:

There is this pesky article... I can't even get a copy of it... (if anybody sees it I want to read the .... thing!!!) That seems to be at the root of the issue. I think it would be enlightening if a new study was done with a foil kite say a 10-20m and see if that flushes the plovers in my experience they ignore me. Sometimes they follow in my tire tracks. Here is the only bit I found...

Hoopes 1993 (p.89) Massachusetts Mean response distance (all ages, all behaviors) was 23 m for pedestrian disturbances (range = 10 m to 60 m), 40 m for vehicles (range = 30 m to 70 m), 46 m for dogs/pets (range = 20 m to 100 m), and 85 m for kites (range = 60 m to 120 m).

WELDNGOD - 7-8-2008 at 05:03 PM

there is no one to join, unless your suggesting that I work for the city! :lol:

anyway this problem is solved ! WERE KITING ,screw em'!!

dustin.burch1 - 11-8-2008 at 04:34 AM

you could alway strap a camra to your kite and say you are taking pictures of wildlife:singing:

WELDNGOD - 11-8-2008 at 08:11 PM

hell, 2 weeks ago my kite and fishin buddy John left early and was attacked by a Least Tern! It kept dive bombing and peckin at his head for about 1/4 mile down the beach :lol:

I told him it was obviously a Redskins fan :lol:

He's a dallas fan and was wearin a dallas cap! :lol:

hamaidan17 - 3-5-2009 at 09:07 AM

Guys if you are afraid of being caught by the cops just go to any near beach or go to any public free space were wind is available.

tridude - 6-6-2009 at 03:49 AM

I would guess this Christopher Hickman cant see down to tie his shoes or take a leak. Invite his fat ass out for a fly/observation........might change his mind................and if it doesnt you could stop by some fast food joint to satisfy his caloric intake................................ :lol:

:duh::duh:

tridude - 6-6-2009 at 05:27 AM

for me I simplify all this hugging/bans, BS, etc to Al and Tipper Gore. Thank god Florida rigged the election....................................... :lol:

:duh::duh:

tridude - 6-6-2009 at 05:29 AM

LAND AND WATER CONSERVATION FUND ACT OF 1965

Findings/Policy. The purposes of the Act are to assist in preserving, developing and assuring accessibility to outdoor recreation resources and to strengthen the health and vitality of U.S. citizens by providing funds and authorizing federal assistance to states in planning, acquiring and developing land and water areas and facilities, and by providing funds for federal acquisition and development of lands and other areas. § 460l-4.

Kamikuza - 6-6-2009 at 06:43 AM

There's no money for us in your sport so #@%$#! off. The corporate giant who builds a monstrous factory just along the bay gets our full support cos they pay taxes and back-handers.
... where's the rolleyes emoticon?!?

WELDNGOD - 22-7-2009 at 06:27 PM

It's all cool now. I talked to Mr. Hickman at length, and he said as long as the state did not come back w/ a negative reply, he had no problem with it.as long as it doesn't become a problem. That was last summer, and I'm still flying
WG

lad - 22-7-2009 at 06:35 PM

Wouldn't it be simpler to just supplement the Tern's feed?

hazegry - 2-5-2010 at 09:23 PM

Wow I am surprised they havent kicked you out this whole area is so uptight with thier we think we are a resort area attitude. ( I live in Va beach by the way. I am glad you are still able to use the area.

flash - 3-5-2010 at 06:54 AM

I live in Boulder, CO and have more restrictions then you can imagine, the thing is to do what kyte slinger said earlier, work with them and from the inside. When you can educate them that you are actually less destructive then the bike community (and we are one hell of a bike community) then it does more then just poaching rides. I hope everything worked out for you and you are still flying!

WELDNGOD - 26-6-2010 at 05:55 PM

Well, I'm screwed now. This jerk:piggy: showed up and said I had to get my wheeled vehicle off the beach , blah blahh, ahhh crap.

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kteguru - 26-6-2010 at 06:04 PM

Sorry to hear that WG. It's never good news when we lose beach access.

On the brighter side this now gives you and the Mrs. good reason to relocate near Wildwood.:wee:.

silvereaglekiter - 26-6-2010 at 06:13 PM

well dang dont that bite

WELDNGOD - 26-6-2010 at 06:15 PM

first he said they passed a law 2 wks ago ,then when I left ,I waited for them. And asked for the section of code that they were refering too. Was it state code or city ordinance? Then all the sudden ,it was a rule they made 2 wks ago ( by some biologist named Dawn Carrier). There are no signs posted saying this rule. They also stated the rules were on the website . Funny I don't see any such rule Have a look ,tell me what you guys think.
http://www.hampton.gov/parks/factorypoint.html and http://www.hampton.gov/parks/parks_and_trails.html

I have looked up hampton city ordinances and found
http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=14532&st...

and http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=14532&st...

WELDNGOD - 26-6-2010 at 06:29 PM

oh and dont you know ,they had to bring up that damn beetle that I have never even seen in the 30 yrs I have been going to this beach. Northeastern beach tiger beetle
http://www.dcr.virginia.gov/natural_heritage/documents/fsneb...

silvereaglekiter - 26-6-2010 at 06:34 PM

If these new "rules" are over those q#%t#@r BIRDS(Turns). I have them nesting all over the marina so pristine sand dunes are not a requirement for them.

silvereaglekiter - 26-6-2010 at 06:40 PM

losing the beach to bugs is almost as bad. if their that Endangered close all the Beaches and see how well that goes over

WIllardTheGrey - 26-6-2010 at 07:45 PM

Wow that sucks. Good luck.

From the look of that pic it's part of a video?.. Did ya get the part were he is changing his tune?

WELDNGOD - 27-6-2010 at 04:10 AM

yeah, I got him saying"we passed a law 2 wks ago" and I got him saying they"made a rule" I can find no state law ,or city ordinance that say I can't ride there. Still looking....

Kamikuza - 27-6-2010 at 05:33 PM

Big rant deleted :lol:

Good luck!

WELDNGOD - 27-6-2010 at 05:56 PM

time to take to the water!

Kamikuza - 27-6-2010 at 06:28 PM

Yeah but I bet they'll have rules about where you can and can't inflate and launch your kite ... not to mention your kite will be flying near the chicken-hearted terns scaring them all witless :rolleyes:

WELDNGOD - 27-6-2010 at 06:37 PM

so far it is just wheeled vehicles not the kites

Kamikuza - 27-6-2010 at 06:43 PM

Is that the other thread then ... it all sort of merges into my "Ffffffffffffff ... uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu ..." state of mind :lol:

I'm curious as to how kites in the sky are a fear-inducing threat but people stomping along the beach aren't ...?

flexiblade - 27-6-2010 at 09:25 PM

When they say wheeled vehicles are they referring to motorized vehicles? Here on the West coast we lost Ocean Beach in San Francisco based on, of all things, skateboarding regulations relating to public areas and wheeled vehicles. Totally lame to be bunched in with the skating crew that have done little to better their standing in the community and really only get limited permission based upon events. I don't know about you but I would rather not have to be limited to certain days of the year rather than proper public access like everyone else.

As for the bugs I prefer Barnes notion, if they can't adapt to one guy in a three wheeled vehicle then they really don't need to be around. Have the state bring in meals on wheels for whatever feeds on these damn beetles.

And the last time I saw some plovers they looked like they were having the time of their lives chasing me, passing me, and just hovering in front of me while I cruised around 30mph - was actually a pretty cool experience. I don't think we bother these birds as much as the lawmakers think, or those that influence the lawmakers think.

Insect00man - 27-6-2010 at 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WELDNGOD
they had to bring up that damn beetle that I have never even seen in the 30 yrs

The U.S. Marines were (are still?) prohibited from conducting landing operations on the beaches at Camp Pendleton because Rainbow anti-war environmentalists got a bird on the endangered list.

It's an abuse of environmental law. Thank Guss Hall - founder of "Earth Day" - and, coinkidinkly, leader of the Communist Party of the USA back then too.

WELDNGOD - 28-6-2010 at 05:25 AM

I'm pretty sure if they made a law about "wheeeled vehehicles" it would mean motorized vehicles. (cars,motorcycles,atv,go cart,moped)
A kite buggy has no way of powering(no motor , no sail) I fly a kite that pulls me around without the use of anything but the kite. Therefore,if I sit down on a kite buggy,I then transfer my motion thru the buggy. I am basically pedaling in the air by working the kite. Which means it is human powered like a bicycle.

PHREERIDER - 28-6-2010 at 05:40 AM

so no wheel chair bond people can in joy the beach !

uh oh! ACCESS DENIED !

stir that into their wishful "rule making "

rdavis - 28-6-2010 at 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WELDNGOD
so far it is just wheeled vehicles not the kites

Well, if that's the case, maybe you should look into a "sandboard". There was a thread here talking about it a while back. Sounds like a nice little loophole. :lol:

WELDNGOD - 28-6-2010 at 07:16 AM

I got one made otta stainless steel. This wknd I will take the landboard and the sand board, I'm gonna make a ply kiteboard or skim board for the shallows (3-4 ft). I will not just go away:P

Todd - 28-6-2010 at 12:07 PM

I've gone over the Municipal Codes and I'll be darn if I could find anything. Is there a person that you could contact that's in charge of the park? How did the officer get down there to tell you this? Walk or Drive? I thought you told me before that the often did patrols down on that beach, correct me if I'm wrong.

Off to Google some more.

mougl - 28-6-2010 at 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by PHREERIDER
so no wheel chair bond people can in joy the beach !

uh oh! ACCESS DENIED !

stir that into their wishful "rule making "

The county I live in has openly said no wheelchairs to me

trying to find a way to fight for my beaches too.

Anything I can do to help WG, let me know and I'm on it.

WELDNGOD - 3-7-2010 at 05:38 PM

I went back today with the buggy and the ATB, and it was high tide. East winds :thumbup:

8-10, so I just flew the reactor and fished a little. Had a freshly downloaded copy of the RULES too. But no earth shattering kaboom, nothing.:saint: :lol:

Just a matter of time , the summer just started...

WELDNGOD - 25-4-2011 at 06:02 PM

update: beach is off limits as per department of conservation

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stetson05 - 25-4-2011 at 09:33 PM

how about scudding shoes? those off limits too?

lunchbox - 25-4-2011 at 10:11 PM

Quote:

time to take to the water!

indigo_wolf - 25-4-2011 at 10:30 PM

HDPE/PTex skids on the the buggy instead of wheels . :wee: :wee: :wee: :lol:

ATB,
Sam

WELDNGOD - 26-4-2011 at 02:48 PM

ortho home defense !

kiteetik - 26-4-2011 at 07:26 PM

lets eliminate the radical environmentalists=problem solved!!! :thumbup:

WELDNGOD - 17-7-2018 at 03:40 PM

https://www.facebook.com/HamptonVAPolice/videos/255784987424...
Look what the authorities can get away with to make a stupid video. YES!That is Grandview nature preserve that I got banned from...SMDH.

Kamikuza - 17-7-2018 at 04:35 PM

Yeah you'd think if wheeled vehicles were such a problem, then bigger heavier dirtier noisier wheeled vehicles patrolling the beach would be the definition of problem?