Power Kite Forum

3M- BUT, Hortnet, twister or beamer or flow or crossfire ?? and y

OllieN - 24-6-2009 at 12:24 AM

Dear everyone,

You have all convinced me of getting the 3m as it " will be an investment of fun in the time to come ". which i agree is right. I wanna get good at this sport, but i'll need to do as im told to get get, in this case " get a 3m".

BUT, what 3m ? So far i've seen the Hornet , twister and beamer, all in my price range.

What one do you think i should get and please specify why !

Thanks everyone for you support :wee:

furbowski - 24-6-2009 at 01:32 AM

hornet and beamer would be good, the twister is a liftier kite, quicker, but less comfy to learn on.

you really do want stability over performance for a first kite.

I've not flown them, tho, so others with experience will likely come on this thread and give you more specific advice.

elfasa - 24-6-2009 at 02:11 AM

theres loads of info on these kites in this forum, try doing a search.

i havent flown any f these kites, however, from what i have learned in being part of this, and other forums i would say go for the hornet or beamer. they are both good begginer kites, i think the twister is a bit older, and a bit more advanced for someone starting out.

if you get the beamer, i would make sure i get the newest model. choosing between the 2 may just come down to price and/ or accessories.

tim

Drewculous - 24-6-2009 at 06:40 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by elfasa
i think the twister is a bit older


They have new model twisters out... i own one lol!
but seriously, the hornet, the flow and the beamer are all good beginner kites i doubt you'll be dissapointed with any of them. The twisters and the crossfires are good kites, but they are "lifty" kites and tend to want to pull you up off of the ground (bad beginner trait)

You are dead on with the size you should get... now just pick one you like the design of!
After you get comfortable with your choice and eventualy want to jump... look into the twister or the crossfire.. both very stable, and good quality kites... but that's another topic in itself!

Welcome aboard and let us know what you go with!

mougl - 24-6-2009 at 06:58 AM

Great to see you are looking in the 3m range! Twister II and Crossfire are high aspect kites (lifty) and are a LOT of fun. My friend got me started on a Twister II 4.1 (almost wish I had started on the Hornet)

It really comes down to:

What kind of winds are you going to be flying in? If you are going high wind, I wouldn't recommend the Twister or the Crossfire. They are going to want to loft you in higher winds. I haven't personally flown the hornet, beamer, or flow but if you check the kite review forum, Screwey has some primo information on the Hornet :)

OllieN - 24-6-2009 at 10:17 AM

So are you guys saying the Twister isn't really an option here and i shouldn't buy it. ? :dunno:

mougl - 24-6-2009 at 11:07 AM

I'm not sayin don't buy the Twister but if you do purchase one, fly it with CAUTION. It WILL lift you in higher winds and as we all know, being lifted with any kite, let alone a 3m can end very poorly.

f0rgiv3n - 24-6-2009 at 11:37 AM

Hornet! hornet! hornet!!!

The hornet is an awesome kite, and SUCH A BLAST! I have the 2m and it pulls like crazy and is incredibly fast. The 3m would also be a blast :D .

The twister as said above is a high aspect kite, which, in turn means in order to safely(key word) use it to its full potential(jumping) you need it to be a larger kite(5m+) for softer landings... For your first kite you cannot safely kite jump at all. You will have more fun with the hornet because you will be able to fly it a lot more often!!!!

Drewculous - 24-6-2009 at 01:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by OllieN
So are you guys saying the Twister isn't really an option here and i shouldn't buy it. ? :dunno:


not sayin it isnt an option, but its not the best option out there for your level. A lot of kite flying is instinct. You do it enough and you just can feel when something is about to go wrong, and you react almost instantly. If you dont, and something big is going wrong... like getting lifted off the ground... the hesitation you havent gotten rid of may be enough to land you in the hospital, and not the couch for the weekend.

Its hard for me to say the twister isnt a good first power kite... cuz it was my first... but ive been flying other kites for the better part of a decade and i know how the wind in my area behaves with a kite. If you do go with the twister... BABY STEPS!!! Low wind, no gusts, and stay on the outside of the window! Ease into anything new, and you would be fine. As far as lifty kite are concerned, the twister is probably the most tame one out there, and the least likely to give you troubles.

The other kites you mentioned just lack the lifty-ness of the twister... which means you get a feel for what these kites can do... ie massive pull... once you get that, then you can add some air a lot more safely

SCREWYFITS - 24-6-2009 at 04:46 PM

mougl, thanx for the props...

@ OllieN,

If I where your best friend or vise versa, and you had unlimited $$$ I'd say go with the Ozone Flow: Why? because I haven't flown one yet and and I'd be stoked to try one out, I've heard phenomenal reports from reputable sources, and seen these fly and they are a top notch kite... not only that, I have access to the Hornet and Beamer and could let you try one of them so you could decide yourself... unfortunately we don't live next door and hang together, I'd love to if we ever cross paths...

I just sold my Hornet with the intent on getting another but ended up with the Viper 2.6m... If you had friends with experience watching your back or I could trust that you where not going to go out in a tornado or extreme high winds I'd recommend this lil bugger (the Viper 2.6m), as it is a fantastic kite and pretty easy to fly, it's just that it can generate a ton of power in higher winds and your safety concerns me...

Now, as a fellow kilter to another, I'd like to recommend the Hornet and/or the Beamer as they are both phenomenal starter/back up kites (the kite you always have in the trunk)... They end up going a long way and end up being the kite that is got the most use after you've been kiting for years...

The Twister II's and Crossfire II's are the kites that you pull out based on conditions and more of a specialty kite (jump/freestyle) and once you get to these and fly them with skill you'll have to have 2-3 different sizes for the different wind conditions... also, these are both fantastic kites and both have there benefits, I like both for different reasons... I wouldn't recommended these to beginners and I'd have a cautious recommendation to and intermediate pilot...

You could start out on a lot of different kites, but you'll enjoy starting on beginner kites more and believe me you'll end up with more than one kite in the long run, mougl (among others) is a great example of a power kite newbie that started out with the lifty kite and the 2nd kite a more intermediate kite and mentions that we wished that he'd started with the beginner type... So if you start on a lifty kite you may get discouraged, hopefully not hurt and not stick around in the sport as long, or you'll find out you want the beginner kite and end up with it any ways... I'm still getting beginner/intermediate kites "they are just plain FUN"... Another thing is that the lifty kites raise the chances of getting hurt 10 fold with lil to no experience... We'd like (no!! LOVE) to have you in or sport and stick around to help others and represent it safley... I know you "will not" regret getting the Hornet, Flow or Beamer, heck I started with a 1.7m Bullet (tad old school'er and wish Ida gone with a 2.5 or a 3m) and I'm here 7+ years later, love'n it!!!

Shout your location out here on PKF and see if there is any kiters in your area that'd like to take you out/meet up for a test fly, or even a kite shop that demos kites... Us kiters are family and love sharing our sport with others, I just taught 3 kids (strangers at a park), probably 8-10 yrs old, to fly my 2.6m Viper in about 0-5mph and they got a kick out of it, they didn't do all that great but it was safe and they got a go at it...

Good luck on your go at it and let us know what you end up doing... Fly safe, fly hard!!!

Berg25 - 26-6-2009 at 02:29 AM

I think we're missing a point. OllieN, what exactly do you want to do with the kite in the future? Do you wanna use it for jumping or scudding? Do you wanna try landboarding later or maybe buggying?

If you wanna use the kite for jumping, I'd recommend the twister. The twister is not unsafe as a beginner kite, you just have to start in low winds (max 3 bft). Make sure you control it and then take it out in higher winds. Imo this goes for all beginnerkites btw... Once you get better at kiting the kite will still be a lot of fun in higher winds, whereas a 3m hornet becomes a bit boring.
I started out with a 3m twister as well and now only fly it in 5+ bft. great fun!

If you wanna go scudding the hornet may be a better option, but imo most people who start out scudding will start jumping eventually, so a twister is still a good choice...

If you wanna go buggying the viper is probably the way to go.

Bottomline: first make up your mind about what you wanna do and then pick the kite that is best suited for that activity. All PL kites mentioned here are great beginner kites, so unless you are reckless you will be safe with either one of them. I don't have any experience with the flow or crossfire II, so I did not include them here but I guess someone else can gove you some info on them.

acampbell - 26-6-2009 at 06:37 AM

I have flown all of the kites listed above side-by-side.

As stated, Twister is a lifty kite and should be used with caution if at all by a first-timer.

Hornet and Beamer are in the same class with similar design objectives as all-around performers, stable and easy to fly. Beamer is 4th generation and very refined, and Hornet is the replacement for the popular Pepper II so it is also a refined design.

The Hornet has an aspect ratio of 3.0 and the Beamer has A/R of 3.5. As such, the Hornet will be more comfortable in higher gusty/ lumpy winds, as the lower A/R will power up smooth and eat gusts better. This comes at the expense of the lower wind performance by just a little bit.

The Beamer will fly easier in lighter winds, with a lower low end than the Hornet by about 1-2 mph, which is a lot when under 10 mph. It will power up faster in moderate to higher winds. Arguably it will have slightly better upwind performance.

Construction quality on both Hornet and Beamer are very good. Differences in performance characteristics are subtle and either will be a great choice. I have had customers come down to deciding between the two based on color preference.

DAKITEZ - 26-6-2009 at 08:28 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by acampbell

Construction quality on both Hornet and Beamer are very good. Differences in performance characteristics are subtle and either will be a great choice. I have had customers come down to deciding between the two based on color preference.


That is exactly what I have experienced also. The beamer and hornet are so close it comes down to color preference. But I will say the viper shines over both the hornet and beamer, with little to no higher performance side effects. Just my opinion.

SCREWYFITS - 26-6-2009 at 07:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Berg25
I think we're missing a point. OllieN, what exactly do you want to do with the kite in the future? Do you wanna use it for jumping or scudding? Do you wanna try landboarding later or maybe buggying?

If you wanna use the kite for jumping, I'd recommend the twister. The twister is not unsafe as a beginner kite, you just have to start in low winds (max 3 bft). Make sure you control it and then take it out in higher winds. Imo this goes for all beginnerkites btw... Once you get better at kiting the kite will still be a lot of fun in higher winds, whereas a 3m hornet becomes a bit boring.
I started out with a 3m twister as well and now only fly it in 5+ bft. great fun!

If you wanna go scudding the hornet may be a better option, but imo most people who start out scudding will start jumping eventually, so a twister is still a good choice...

If you wanna go buggying the viper is probably the way to go.

Bottomline: first make up your mind about what you wanna do and then pick the kite that is best suited for that activity. All PL kites mentioned here are great beginner kites, so unless you are reckless you will be safe with either one of them. I don't have any experience with the flow or crossfire II, so I did not include them here but I guess someone else can give you some info on them.


I understand, but not sure I completely agree, If this where my two best buds that have athletic ability up the ying/yang then I might agree, but not knowing someones abilities I "personally" would never recommend the twister as a first power kite, I know it could be done but you would not catch me recommending it... I love the twister myself and think its a fantastic kite, but not (in my opinion) a beginner kite...

I understand that if he knows what he is looking for then try and find a kite that fits, but if he's looking to get into Kiteboarding then I don't agree with going out to get a kiteboard kite, that's dangerous...

I feel safe recommending to walk before you run even if ultimately you have running in mind...

Just my two cents, and your opinion is understood, valued and appreciated, hope I didn't rub your hair the wrong way, that was not my intention...:saint:

Berg25 - 30-6-2009 at 07:13 AM

@Screwyfits:
I guess I was not as clear as I intended :) I think most beginners can safely use a 3.0 m twister, AS LONG AS they first learn to handle it in low winds of 3 bft max. Once they master the kite at these winds they can slowly try the kite in higher winds. The twister is part of the Peter Lynn access range after all...

I do agree it is not safe to start out with a kiteboardkite. But I do think that you can use any kite from the access range as a beginnerskite. And so it is smarter to start with a twister if you wanna learn jumping or a viper if you wanna learn buggying imo.

So yeah, it's safer to learn to walk be4 trying to run, but if the goal is to run I'd rather advise shoes that hint towards running than ordinary shoes :D

And no offence taken. nor intended here...

SCREWYFITS - 30-6-2009 at 08:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Berg25
@Screwyfits:
I guess I was not as clear as I intended :) I think most beginners can safely use a 3.0 m twister, AS LONG AS they first learn to handle it in low winds of 3 bft max. Once they master the kite at these winds they can slowly try the kite in higher winds. The twister is part of the Peter Lynn access range after all...

I do agree it is not safe to start out with a kiteboardkite. But I do think that you can use any kite from the access range as a beginnerskite. And so it is smarter to start with a twister if you wanna learn jumping or a viper if you wanna learn buggying imo.

So yeah, it's safer to learn to walk be4 trying to run, but if the goal is to run I'd rather advise shoes that hint towards running than ordinary shoes :D

And no offence taken. nor intended here...


Very well put and I agree, but have to stress to the beginner "start in lower winds" that would be "KEY" to your theory IMO...:wee: