Isn't that spelled AlaSCa ? :tumble:

So much talk with the spelling issues, calm down lads!!! I just use short cuts as if i'm texting on mobile. I'll try and use proper grammer and spelling for you all to understand!! I have a budget of around £1000, I quite like the idea of the HQ neo as I can use it on land and water.

oh be nice

Ps the Neo is a great kite and great price too

Ah, nice to hear the King's English! I'm too old to have the texting gene.

I have the the 11m Neo and like it on land in winds from 6-8 to about 16-18 mph, where I start running out of de-power. It take will someone around 200 Lbs / 14 stone on the water around 12 mph, I recon.

It's stable and easy to fly. Lands and takes off like a foil with no pumping, and pre-inflation pretty much happens by itself. Unless you are doing freestyle, fly on a reach hands-free with an occasional poke at the bar, or fly with a couple of fingertips, drinking a favorite beverage with your free hand. For landing in high winds over 14-15, I'd add a safety leash.

Then there are the ARCs from Peter Lynn. 15m is a good cross-over size and will do all of the above while munching gusts a bit better.

Neo is a nice kite but just remember most foils can be very frustrating on the water. Relaunching can be a bear,

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Originally posted by snobdr Neo is a nice kite but just remember most foils can be very frustrating on the water. Relaunching can be a bear,

Without trying to challenge your position one bit, I'm wondering why you say this. I can't offer perspective here due to circumstances that keep me off the water so help me out.

I would think that, besides a bow-tie - which is hard to do with a Neo - it should not be much different than a land relaunch. One clear exception might be prolonged dragging on a nose down crash that might allow ingress of water through the vents, but what else? It's not like a high aspect Phantom or Scorpion that takes a lot of trickery to tease it into the right taco position for relaunch.

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Originally posted by snobdr Harden the F... up

hahaha you obviously have never hung out with me.......sometime you can come up and first,we'll do a little "light" powerlifting and if you survive that--we'll do a bit of car pushing for some cardio--if youre not hospitalized after that--i'll take you on a little trip of xtreme kiting "kj style" if you live thru all that--i'll be VERY impressed----so far,none of my friends have made it through lol

oh,about the depower....sorry........my vote is for a flysurfer

Beside bowtie,they tangle,invert, and will tend to lie flat on the water. Im not saying they canot be relaunched but it takes some time and tecnique to do, whuch can become frustrating for someone learning. New LEIs almost launch themselfs and are a much better choice on water.

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Originally posted by snobdr Beside bowtie,they tangle,invert, and will tend to lie flat on the water. Im not saying they canot be relaunched but it takes some time and tecnique to do, whuch can become frustrating for someone learning. New LEIs almost launch themselfs and are a much better choice on water.

I too do not want to challenge you, but I'm curious if you have flown a neo? I can not imagine how someone could bowtie this kite. The other things you mentioned I could see possibly happening, but I just can figure how someone could bowtie this kite.

my Psycho 3, Pulse, and SA have never bow tied...............Synergy and Venoms water relaunch fast, and the Phantoms relaunches fairly easy too. As a matter of fact, Ive never flown the Phantom on land......................................:duh::duh:

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Originally posted by DAKITEZ Quote: Originally posted by snobdr Beside bowtie,they tangle,invert, and will tend to lie flat on the water. Im not saying they canot be relaunched but it takes some time and tecnique to do, whuch can become frustrating for someone learning. New LEIs almost launch themselfs and are a much better choice on water. I too do not want to challenge you, but I'm curious if you have flown a neo? I can not imagine how someone could bowtie this kite. The other things you mentioned I could see possibly happening, but I just can figure how someone could bowtie this kite.

Hi, I have a neo 14,11 and just ordered an 8 - so I like them.

I have also got a venom 13, 19 [arc] and a waroo pro 14.

I have bow-tied the venom, now that is really frustrating. I have also from time to time struggled with the venom relaunch, but that is mainly due to being in underpowered situations. I have inverted the venom, well I contributed to it, mainly when the wind lulls and I am not quick enough, good thing about a venom it flys inverted so just crash it again and allow it to roll, problem solved.

The waroos a great kite, but it has no character. The waroo would be the slowest kite i have owned to water launch but it gets there with some technique, and when the wind dies, then its a plastic floaty tube.

So to get to the point, the Neos have been the easiest and fastest kite to relaunch i have ever owned, I have not had a bow tie and I cant really see why i would to be honest. In fact I read this post last night and went out today to see if i could, but its just not the same relaunch method as an arc, so it just does not do it. The venoms bowtied for me on relaunch from water, but its 90% technique and positioning your body relative to the kite, so i blame myself when it happened. I have never seen a Neo lie flat on the water, unless i wanted to but i would have to walk or swim to them to achieve the task.[sometimes you wish it would lie flat as it can develop quite a pull in the down position] I have got a wing tip wrapped in a bridle, but it still flew and sort of flapped its way in to shape.
Never seen it tangle either.
I guess give it time and all these things are possible, but bowtie and relaunch problems are not a Neo's weakness.
To balance the ledger, the Neo is a technical kite to land, especially in higher winds.
I had an interesting thing today when i was playing around with the bow tie thing. I deployed the neo 11 to safety [primary top hat] I had the cam cleat on full depower, when i deployed it [shortened front line]. The wind was quite strong, but the damn thing just didnt come down again, it sat in the middle of the wind window about 10ft up doing slow circles pulling me merrily along until i grabbed the rear brake and dumped the Chicken loop. It then flagged out and we went calm again. The Neo has in my opinion has a weakness here in that they advocate a leashless safety - do not ever go out with out a leash. The problem with the top hat and extendible front line is that with the depower pulled in and then dropped to safety, its clear that the extendible frontline in this situation is not long enough and the kite is still flying. The solution is to max out the trimmer [lengthen front lines] before you deploy the safety, this adds another 18 inches to the front line and the brakes then tighten more and the kite comes down. Not an entirely obvious or intuitive thing to do.
So the good and the bad

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To balance the ledger, the Neo is a technical kite to land, especially in higher winds. I had an interesting thing today when i was playing around with the bow tie thing. I deployed the neo 11 to safety [primary top hat] I had the camcleat on full depower, when i deployed it [shortened front line]. The wind was quite strong, but the damn thing just didnt come down again, it sat in the middle of the wind window about 10ft up doing slow circles pulling me merrily along until i grabbed the rear brake and dumped the Chicken loop

Thanks for illuminating this so well. Nothing is worse in powerkiting than feeling out of control, and the only time I have felt this was landing the 11m Neo in winds building to 18-20 mph. Luckily I had a fellow kiter to help me kill the kite, as my last hope for control was to dump the kite altogether into the dunes (I could not reach the landing handle).

Ironically, having the power strap in "full depower" in your case is what kept it flying at all, since you lowered the angle of attack and kept it from a full stall. In my case, I let the strap all the way out, which is what put it on the ground in a full stall but it was still fully exposed to the wind and not flagged.

I love the Neo but will only fly it with a leash to the landing handle from now on.

good point, full power then I yank on the rear lines and down she comes. I had no probs landing the 11m Neo proto this way or on the safety...............Flysurfers same same.......back to bowites, virtually non exsistant. I think alot of it has to do with tubies take a few lessons and boom theyre on depower and water, were as many here on PKF flew for a couple years then took it to the H2O. Bottom line, technology will never outweigh experience....................................:duh::duh:

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Originally posted by acampbell I love the Neo but will only fly it with a leash to the landing handle from now on.

where would you hook the leash to the landing rope? center or one side to try and flag it out?

center of landing handle at the stake loop, a' la Ozone

Snob.

The problems you describe tend to be more with older closed cell foils.

Just like with LEI's the kites have improved emmensly in the last few years. Would it be right for me to knock LEI's because I had a tough time relaunching my 03 Airush C-kite ?

I am NOT anti - LEI. Even on land. I just don't think that foils deserve the negative attitude you put forth.

What was the last Neo YOU have flown ? Flysurfer ??? Sky Country ??? Arc ?????

Until you try them please don't sound so sure of your judgements ! You mates opinions aren't your own !


P.S. The AlaSCa is how Sky Country spell it. That was my poor attempt at a joke !

I flew the 11 neo, i didnt like the safety at all and wouldnt think of taking one in the water without something better. Im not anti foil, as a matter of fact i would love to own a sa 15 or 17 as they are the lightwind masters. Foils are just not made for learning to kiteboard. I havent seen any foils easily relaunch after piling in or pulling the safety. Now im up in the air about pl and the auto zenith, if i got overpowered and wiped out would i still want the kite in the air? Seems like a good chance of getting tea bagged there.
But anyway foils have superior power for their size over LEIs they have their place. But i think for the beginner, in the water, you cant beat an LEI for ease of relaunch. Most LEIs now launch from just pulling an outside line. Simple.
And I dont know anyone that ever had problems with relaunching a waroo. Read reviews ot them things like " wont stay in the water" and " almost relaunches itself"," relaunches in seconds" are always mentioned.

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Originally posted by snobdr And I dont know anyone that ever had problems with relaunching a waroo. Read reviews ot them things like " wont stay in the water" and " almost relaunches itself"," relaunches in seconds" are always mentioned.

I mentioned the waroo, and simply said its the slowest kite I have owned for relaunch, which by logic infers that I have owned faster and thats the Neos.

The Neo is an intermediate - expert kite.

I dont really have an opinion on what is better, just depends on what you want to use it for and where you ride, and in what conditions.

Today, winds were gusting 6kts to 25kts, unkiteable conditions for the Waroo, the Neo's mmm, maybe, but why bother when you have a venom, so you cant beat a peter lynn in gusty conditions like that. To answer your question about would you want an auto zenith Lynn waiting for you sucking up gusts. YES PLEASE

Another day is different, on average, the Neo's fit my local area more days than not, hence a preference over Peter Lynn, [emphasis on lower power]. If Waroos fitted the profile I would use them, just so happens that the tube repair guy is driving a ferrari here and cant decide on wether its a new pool or a tennis court. Oyster Beds, they are not compatible with tubes.

So I read daily on forum people asking for advice, the best advice is based on the best questions asked.

There is not one solution fits all and we cant all be doing kite tests and writing magazine reviews in the Dominican Republic, but im open to offers.

Yea ok, im sorry the neo is the perfect first depower kite.

Thanks guys, ive made my mind up, neo 11m it is!! Ill let u know how I get on once ive ordered her!!

Wow did someone just suggest an 11m Neo for a 150lb person for there first depower kite? a little big no?

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Originally posted by dgkid78 Wow did someone just suggest an 11m Neo for a 150lb person for there first depower kite? a little big no?

No - i think he was suggested an 11m as a good cross over kite for water and land, based on his own needs and wants.

People just agreed in general that a NEO was a good depowerable foil for an intermediate and beyond.

Kite size is up to the user to decide based on there needs and manufacturers recommendations.

11.5 stone is 161lbs which is near enough 74kg, so i guess moving from a fixed blade at nearly 4 metres, there is a degree of experience there so a 11 seems ok to me - given that it is used in the appropriate wind ranges with common sense.

There has to be some input here and thought from the person who wants the kite, they have to feel confident in the step up.

Oh ok my bad. :bigok:

Ok, I have same question. What kite should be my first depower? I have read all the above posts. Sounds like it is between Arc (what is an arc?) Neo and Best Waroo?

Well, I want it for landboarding and kitesurfing (if possible). I am starting to hang with some kitesurfers in my area. They use Waroos for both kitesurfing and landboarding.

We have gusty wind here. Normal is 15 mph with gusts around 25.

Do yourself a favor, talk to your locals, let them recomend a kite for you. Very biased opinions here. The locals will know more about the conditions there and what kite will work for you.

good advice from Snobdr, go with what the locals ride, what shops support the area and what personally suits the type of flying you want to do.

Like cars we are spoilt for choice, so work out what aspects appeal about the various flavours of kites and of course what does not.

Most people here on the forum like traction power kites, many like me are lucky enough to have a choice in what they use and when they use them.

Lots of cars in the garage so to speak.

Since you have asked a question, I like in no particular order SLE, ARCS, FOILS the technique is knowing their strengths and weakness and applying them to your environment and skills.