making movies and video is always a fun but pleasing the viewers is also part of it.

Im just curious for some insight what viewers like and dislike. be the critic and let me know.

movie length

prefer stills or video or (both)

you tube or vimeo or (both)
do you prefer if the vimeo has the mobile version?

Stills, video, both.

Length 30 sec to whatever.

I'm easily pleased.

Video. Stills are for a picture gallery so the viewer can spend as much time as they like looking at each. Watching a series of pictures stream by is too much like watching someone's vacation pics after dinner while trying to remain polite. I get antsy and start skipping ahead.

If a You Tube video is much longer than 3 minutes and it fails to hook me right away, I find myself skipping ahead to get to the important part.

I guess my attention span isn't what it use to be.

I agree with acmbarber ,
Videos are a lot better. I think that the length is less important Vs the way you edit the movie.
Don't get me wrong, raw videos are the best way for me, but I also enjoy the art work that some of the guys are doing here with their videos (Just a side note : too much editing can sometimes spoil the point of the movie)

I short : 30sec and up, some editing is always welcome, a nice matching background music never hurts and of course, how can you end a clip without some bloopers.......my personal favorite and makes the ppl in it kinda "down to earth" in my taste..

Good luck, hope it helps

Both vimeo and youtube ...
What acm said - long video is fine if it hooks you good ... otherwise, I'm skipping around looking for fun stuff - I expect people do a lot of that with mine A mixture of camera positions is good - I think it's John what has like 12 GoPro all around the buggy

Titles too - watch it ... I've seen some that have had nothing but titles for like over 60 seconds - seriously? I don't need 20 seconds staring at the same sponsor logo

content wins... There's a hadlow video that its like 10 mins long, and its awesome. Good music, diff tricks, different locations, great video...

A flysurfer vid comes to mind as a good example of a cool video, that is pretty boring... Its just a guy getting huge floaty hang time... Its awesome for the first min, but then you like, ok u can float... Do a 360

Fine line between great and not so great

I like them short (2 maybe 3 songs tops). One thing that's driving me nuts and it seems to be the current trend is the 2 minute intro of the flyer leaving his house, going down the highway, through the country, out to the ocean, setting up and then flying. Let's face it, all highways look the same around the world so spare the viewer those shots and get right to the good stuff.

Stills don't do a whole lot for me. anytime you can see what both the kite and rider are doing is a plus. Don't feel like you have to edit an epic jump as the rider comes in for a landing. If they crash, they crash and that's OK to see too.

I love the way the Push Kiting crew edits their vids together - they always seem like they are having fun while they are killing it.

Song selection is key to set the tempo and feel. I prefer the vids without heavy profanity so I can show my kids.

Prefer vimeo as I can see that at work where Youtube is blocked but whatever is easier for you.

Quote:

Originally posted by acmbarber Video. Stills are for a picture gallery so the viewer can spend as much time as they like looking at each

QFT! Couldn't have said it better myself. Don't really care btween youtube and vimeo. Never used mobile function even though my phone supports it.

Just don't include in the video the drive to the site. That has been done enough times. Cut to the chase. Seems like a lack of content filler like an episode of Catchin' Air in Alaska.

Quote:

Originally posted by ripsessionkites making movies and video is always a fun but pleasing the viewers is also part of it. Im just curious for some insight what viewers like and dislike. be the critic and let me know. movie length



Errr....ummmm... I am going to go with "It depends..." Well, it's not like you were expecting a straight answer from me anyway However, I'll try to qualify the answer a little bit so it's a bit more constructive.

I think video for our demographic would generally fall into 4 categories and that has some impact on what is a good fit.

For whatever reason, the number of video out are definitely skewed towards only one or two categories.

OK, so the categories that come to mind are:

1. Stoke
   
2. Narrative
   
3. Instructional
   
4. Product review

Depending on what category the video falls into, I think the length, composition, etc. have different recipes for what's good, what's bad and what's ugly.

Stoke
This is probably the most common video type currently out there. Basically, it's a showcase of a particular kite, venue, or someone just having a fun day. One song, seems to be a good length for these. It would have to be a special case to merit a song as long as Don McLean's "American Pie" or the Alarm's "Spirit of '76" (both in excess of 7:00 minutes).

Narrative
Generally these can afford to be a bit longer due to the fact that they generally tell a story that occurs over a period of time (i.e. a day long session or a multi-day event). Their longer length and (possible) changes in mood/settings mean that they also lend themselves to multiple songs or a medley of songs. One of the recent NABX videos falls into this category.

Instructional
These can be as long as they need to be to cover the material being discussed. Music applied to only parts of the video or run throughout as a subtle background. Anything that doesn't distract from the instructional aspect is fine. We see a smattering of these, but not a whole lot. If the camera supports a seperate dedicated mic for the narrator, that's cool. Otherwise, it should really be dubbed after the fact. There is nothing worse than trying to listen to instructional video that is plagued by muddy or unintelligible instructions/commentary because of wind noise and other ambient distractions.

Product Review
These are fairly scarce but have a lot of potential. Pictures are one thing, but being able to explain things like safety features, quirky gear, etc. can just be done so much better with video.

Stoke is probably the most freeform and a lot of warts can be handled in post-production editing.

Narrative generally seems to work better when there is some storyboarding done.

Instructional and Product Reviews really, really need some basic (at the very least) scripting. Product review videos are very popular on one or two of the other forums I frequent. I can't tell you how many times I have wanted to knock myself unconscious with the keyboard because a couple of minutes into the video, digression seemed to be the rule of the day. It became very much like listening to a 45 rpm record on the 33 1/3 setting, because all the little side comments and observations that had little to do with the product itself bogged down the production.



Quote:

Originally posted by ripsessionkites prefer stills or video or (both)


Well, since we are talking about videos, it seems like video would be the way to go. The addition of stills are still viable in a couple of scenarios, like:

1. If the video is long enough, bookending it with stills in the Titles or Credits works.
   
2. In Narrative videos, like a video for an event, a montage of stills capturing "Kodak moments" can be very effective.
   
3. Stills for teaching concepts in Instructional videos.
   
4. Using stills in Product Review videos to enumerate features or layouts.

Gratuitous use of effects and fonts can get annoying really quickly.

One exception to that rule, at least when used with some restraint, is the application of the Ken Burns effect to stills when it doesn't detract #3 or #4 in the preceding list.

There is a very subdued version of the Ken Burns effect here:
http://www.monoslideshow.com/

The drive to the site gets tedious in a Stoke video, but can work in a Narrative video if it is actually an interesting drive or if there are several flyers in the car and your capturing the mood. Restraint is a good thing here too.

Sorry for being so longwinded, but hopefully you find it of some use.

ATB,
Sam

Quote:

One thing that's driving me nuts and it seems to be the current trend is the 2 minute intro of the flyer leaving his house, going down the highway, through the country, out to the ocean, setting up and then flying. Let's face it, all highways look the same around the world so spare the viewer those shots and get right to the good stuff.

Ditto. I don't press play on a kiting video to watch someone driving down a road. I usually give a video maybe a minute to get me hooked. And I usually turn it off if it's really, really low quality- like almost blurry cos the pixles are so big.

Most of my first vids are too long - nearly 10 minutes, 30 seconds to 1 minute between cuts. I'm trying to make em shorter, more punchy, faster edits, more variety of angles and shots. I don't use the headcam much anymore because I think that can be really distracting.

And clean my lens often.

I actually almost had a plan for my last 'kite skating with Spartan' vid and for the first time, I put the music down first and then edited the video to fit the music. I enjoy the heck out of making vids and I'm always trying to do it better and pick up hints and pointers/ideas anywhere I can. Including from threads like this which are most helpful.

Cheers

Length is definitely dependent on video-by-video basis. I don't mind the drive to site scene as long as its not more than 20 seconds. Seeing shots of people standing around doing nothing does nothing for me either. A solid review with clear narrative is awesome when you are looking for a product. Too many times you watch a review on a kite and it just turns into a commercial of kiters flying high, pulling off tricks that could be on any kite, not really going to the trouble to describe the actual kite and what might make me want to buy it. If its just a general kiting video, those that include more than one aspect of the sport seem nicer than seeing one aspect. Please include bloopers, fails bails!!!!! Its nice to know that everyone isn't superman with perfect skills.

The highway intros is a euro i swear. I used the same intro style for WC.

Bloopers are always great, IMO. Coolbreeze became famous now with his ejects.
I have to say it's a good riding day when he does = wind and right on-shore winds.

I dont care, so long as it's good... I'm easy to please. Kite porn of any kind is OK with me... :bigok: