Howdy,

Im toying with the idea of dipping my toe in the world of depower. Ive seen a Ozone Frenzy FYX 2010 9m going at a reasonable price. How would you rate this as a first de-power?
On the other hand I know Ive got LOTS more to explore in fb world (only been at the the past year or so) Should I resist the urge or is more kite always a good thing (have a feeling what the general consensus might be on that!)

For static flying and buggy riding I'd say you don't need a depower.

For landboarding or snow kitng I think they make a huge difference.

A 9-10 is a great size kite but not if you weigh less than 150 pounds.

I'm leaning towards selling my 6 and 4.5 yetis and you could buy both for much less than the cost of a 9m Frenzy. They are in the for sale section if you are interested.

I think it also depends on where you ride and the wind conditions. Where we buggy we are inland north of the great lakes and rarely get a steady wind. Often either light or when it's windy it'll be gusty - there are the odd days that are steady nice wind but hitting those days to kite don't always match up. Next, the two beaches that are hardpack need the perfect wind direction to to be onshore and with a slight curve to the beach it means running upwing a bit one way and downwind the other. When we buggied exclusively fb I might change kite sizes several times a day if the wind shifted. Then with teh angle you might be overpowered one way and need more power running downwind the other way - then the gust factor. So when depower came along it changed our buggying into a far more enjoyable day staying in the buggy most of the day and not switching kites or fighting power or crying about being underpowered. There are days when both work perfect but far more days when we really ride way better on the depowerables.

My first de-power was 6m Gin Eskimo ...... and that was plenty to start with .....
By the time I learn how to use bar, strap and needed technique to fly it I been accidentally in air way too many times ..... with bad landings filling up my mouth with grass and sand .....lol,,,,, Cant think what would be happening if I have 12m at that time ..... So if you can ...... Its always good idea to start with smaller size....
As flying inland ..... gusty conditions make you depower experience learning way harder ..... PL arcs are just perfect for that ... Not sure if good as first depower since smaller sizes are very quick and set up needs some extra knowledge .... but when gust pass by it will keep you on the ground .....

Quote:

Originally posted by Kober As flying inland ..... gusty conditions make you depower experience learning way harder .....

Why would you feel gusty conditions make learning depower way harder? Just curious on your experience - Up here in the winter we get really gusty winds and lot's of wind swirling as it comes over trees onto lakes. The problem with f.b. is you need good kite skills to keep it in the right position. In the gusts the f.b. rocket forward with no power control and then in the dead air behind the kite the kites overshoot and collapse - time and time agin guys walk back with a balled up kite throwing it in a bag and wishing they had a depower.
I day like all styles of kites but when it comes to gusty conditions that's where the depowers give a day of riding vs a day of frustration.

Gusty inland wind is not fun with most kites but I too think some fixed bridle kites do better than some depower kites in those condidtions. FBs are quicker to respond to input and can sometimes be recovered more quickly than a DP that gets wacked by a gust. They can also be a bit easier to reinflate in the air if the handles aren't linked together as you can work the kite more effectively than with a bar. I don't fly inland much anymore but last time I did I switched from my 10m DPs to my 5.5 and 6m FBs and the day was more enjoyable.

Good to hear other perspectives, interesting....
When i think of our gusty winter winds - the winds might be doing around 30km with gusts 50-60 km and then you can get next to zero wind behind a gust. Part depends on the style of depowerable as well as comparing A.R. or performance on the foils. In those ranges of gusts you cannot find the right size of fb foil - the gusts way overpower and kites then collapse and roll in the bridle where the depowerables 95% of the time you are just adjusting bar position to ride out the gust with no collapse so there is never a need to re-inflate. With my race foils I always think I'll give them another chance on the higher wind days, as I used them exclusively for so may years before depowerable without thinking twice - but every time I still end up regretting my decision to give them a go when it's that gusty - depowerable, no issues at all other than the launch and landing zone when all kites are squirrely as hell and you just need to get out and get moving. It's really like night and day - the f.b. never seem to get going more than 10-15 seconds at a time without some issue of overpower or dying or front inversion or... and again, this is only on really gusty days.

The other part on the depowerable is open cell vs closed cell - yes the open cell depowerables can collapse at times and having handles is easier to pump and get them open, the closed cell don't really collapse as much as jellyfish etc but the trade off again is usable wind range that you don't need to switch kites 3-4 times to find the right size.

If I may, I think gusty winds make everything harder to learn. I think a lot of B-Roc's perspective is driven by the fact that when he's flying FB he's on handles which definately allow for a certain added element of recovery and control over a bar can added (or maybe exaggerted) response when needed?

I think the way we all refer to as "Gusty conditions" is a pretty relative. I've seen footaage of MarS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-s riding territory and the kind of gust factor it gets and I have to say I wouldn't want to deal with a FB in those conditions. Just as I wouldn't ride a FB here. Our gust factors routinely doubles the base windspeed and if we didn't fly sheetables we'd get thrashed or at the very least spend the day being dead in the water then moving for a bit and then dead. Or moving, completely overpowered and back to normal when the gusts pass.

I'm always a little tickled when I ride somewhere new and the wind is awesome (IMO) and the local riders complain and tell me it's wicked gusty. Sure part of it is that I'm riding Arcs but I just think that my definition of gusty is different than others. It's all about what you're used to I guess.

If I lived on the coast maybe I'd have a few FB's on hand.

What he said.

Flying in Gusty Conditions...
FB foil - you can flail around like you're sending semaphore and keep the kite flying.
Foil depower - you can desperately pull leader lines and hope the kite keeps flying and doesn't open up again in the power zone.
LEI - you watch with disgust as it hindenburgs then tumbles through the powerzone. And then deathloops.

Quote:

Originally posted by Kamikuza FB depower -

0_o Think you missed something there....

Ha ha Kami.

I knew what I meant :ticking:

It looked a lot cooler in my head.

+1 for starting off with a 6 or 7m depower.

Meterage is HUGE in kites, just 1m extra creates exponential power differences with even small increases in windpower

I think it depends on the direction you are heading and the conditions you are flying in.

If you plan to get in motion then I think you will enjoy going to depower.
If you just want to static fly then another FB would probably be best.
You don't have to have tons of FB experience to move to depower. Having flown 4 line helps in that you get to experience brake input but many go straight to depower or start on a 3 line bar.

I find the best kites for gusty conditions are closed cell. My arcs and Flysurfer. Pansh is coming out with a closed cell FB that should be interesting ?

Depending on where you live 9m may be a very good size ? It would be around here. We rarely have winds more than 14kts and they are clean.