I just had my first confrontation with a no-kiting allowed incident. I was out with my gf, both flying our kites in a field that was next to a church. There is a baseball field, and what appeared to be two soccer fields that arn't used anymore (no goal posts). While we were out flying, static flying even! So no possibility of tearing up any grass or anything. A guy came out from the Church and told us we need written consent from the property owners to be on the field and said he would call the cops if we wouldn't leave (very grumpy and angry). My gf had just said sir no reason to be upset we will pack up and leave, you can be a little more considerate next time. So we packed up and left. In the process now of finding the property owners so I can get written consent hopefully...

You did the right thing ... no matter how annoying.

Here's hoping you get that written consent

Her response was perfect, You are a good pair of hoodlums. Good luck with the permission.

I found out the church is the property owners of the whole field, baseball diamond, park, and church land. So in turn the pastor has control over it all, so I spoke with him. He told me that they don't allow to use it because of insurance/liability issues, if you were to be on it doing something and get hurt you can sue the church. So I asked if I could sign a consent form stating anything I do on the property is at my own risk, he said no because that wasn't enough of a binding clause (what????). I said my cousin is a lawyer and I could get him to come up with something that is binding enough and he can show it to their insurance company as well. He said no, its not worth the risk to the church. So I asked why they even have it and whats its use? He said its for church members to use... I said okay thanks have a good day./end convo. Sooo church members can't be liability issues? Makes no sense.

You looking for a church? Church might need a "Kite ministry".

Wait, someone who sells a product that is destroyed by logic.....was immune to your logic? That's a sad situation.

If it was me, I'd keep flying there, any disagreement I'd tell em I'm just getting closer to god, one 15 foot jump at a time.

[The pastor is not the end of it, there is someone above him. Keep asking. Now, if you find a pastor who says there is nobody above him in the organization, then you've got a problem. Even the Pope has a boss. ]

omni- not sure it is worth the effort but most states (i know VA does) has a law on the books that if you do not "pay" to use their land and do something that could get you hurt you can no sue them anyways just FYI
Scott

erratic - Haha, yes religion is immune to many forms of knowledge. I really don't want to get the cops called on me and get in trouble for this, the rochester police (its where I work/my girlfriend lives) already don't particularly care for me. Hopefully the pastor is not the end of it though... I'll have to do some further digging.

fly - I'm not sure MI is like that, but if so that'd be hilarious and awesome, but I'm sure he would just ignore that claim.

I was also thinking though if I just go in for 5 minutes of mass and come out to fly, am I considered a member of the church? Or should I sign up for their newsletter or something too.

If you are a member of NAPKA, we would be happy to get you a copy of the insurance cert for this very thing. If that doesn't help out the liability issue with the pastor and the church than I would say to stay away from that denomination and the church members.
Don't want to hear of any kites burning up as the congregation get hit by the lightning bolt.:saint:

2 good angles there.

Ask your Lawyer to check how the law reads on your situation.

NAPKA is for this kind of thing. You will need to apply for certian days but will be insured for them ?

Living in Canada the idea that the Church would be so uptight about getting sued is kind of foriegn ? School fields too EH ?

If there really is a God you will get your spot! :duh:

I work in a church in the facilities department (yes it's a big church), and part of my job is chasing off kids who are skateboarding in the parking lot, reason being that it's a matter of safety, both for the kids and the people driving through the lot... I try to be a good deal nicer than the fellow who pooped on your fun though

More than likely (especially if it is a small church), if there IS anyone over the Pastor, it will be a board of elders or deacons. Yet, it is likely that if there is such a board, the Pastor may have the final say... that's Church politics in a nutshell.

Unfortunately for you, regardless of a common misunderstanding, church property is not public land. While the church may allow the public access and use, the fact is that it IS private property, and regardless of what the law is regarding liability, you can be considered a trespasser, especially if you have been previously asked to vacate. Even people who are members of the church (at least where I work) are subject to that truth. A line I hear often when I have to ask people not to do something on property is "...Oh, but I'm a member..." well "yes sir/ma'am but we would still appreciate it if you would not...(fill in the blank)..."

Our fields are open for public use, as long as it is what the staff deems reasonable. For instance if a group of kids wants to play a pick-up game of football, or a guy wants to fly an RC helicopter, that's fine. But if a couple of organized teams that are not church sponsored show up to use the fields, they will likely be asked to leave. Or if someone spots someone using the fields in a way that they might deem unsafe, or may damage church property, they will likely be asked to leave. The long and short of it is, while the Church property is OPEN to the public, it is NOT public land, and its owner, or representative thereof has every right to ask people to leave, regardless of the reason.

My suggestion would be to try to meet the Pastor to discuss it with him in person, as long as you are reasonable and explain the sport and it's safety, and even show him your gear it has the potential to go well for you. If he still doesn't like the idea, then unfortunately, you're out of luck, because as I said before, it is Private property.

Good luck to you!

Well said.

At least it wasn't a Taliban Church!
You know how THEY felt about kite flying in Afghanistan!

I'd continue flying and when you get caught, just as them to forgive you like Jesus did.

-joedy

Really well said, soliver. No matter how delicious the parcel of property, or how many defeat-able reasons a owner might not allow ya access, we ultimately respect their decision.

I still think NAPKA might be able to help?

I would approach them again. This time hoping to hold kite flying events . Insured . Who knows you could grow to a chapter ? Starting out with just you and the GF is a start?