So, here it is one of the hotter and more humid days of summer '16 so far here in New England, and I find myself thinking about this upcoming winter.

I became interested in Power Kiting for two reasons really. Static flying seemed like it would be a very good form of exercise and agility development - which I have definitely found it to be - and I wish to explore kite skiing in the winter months.

As soon as the conditions up north are suitable for kite skiing, I plan to set up a lesson or two with Feyd at Hardwater Kiting, and I will save my technical questions regarding proper technique, gear (de-power kites), and assorted other stuff until then. Prior to this however, I can envision a fresh few inches of early winter snow on some of the larger fields that are available to me nearby - simply for playing around on - and I have some basic questions now.

So far, I have only fixed bridle Flexi Rage kites (1.8, 2.5, 3.5, 4.7m) which I fly with handles. I am wondering if anybody has had success with these kites on the snow, and specifically, I am wondering if the opened webbing along the leading edges creates a real frustration by allowing snow to get into the kite's baffles. I seem to have read somewhere that this is a factor with this design, and I'm wondering about practical experience.

It also seems like a simple next step toward kite skiing at this point - after extensive 4-line static flying - would be to think about getting a harness and setting up a pair of my Flexi Prolink handles with a STROP. I would then do some static flying with this rig to get used to the new feeling of the harness and handle setup. Does anyone have pics of their setup in this regard? It would be much appreciated!

just my opinion based on cold weather kiting (which I've down a fair amount of in the buggy but only a couple of times on skis this past winter). Sure you can use fixed bridle to get going BUT, your hands will freeze if not hooked in because your hands will be over head and pressure from the handles squeezes the blood out of your fingers, If hooked in with strop, there's no quick release you will be able to get to quick enough if things turn south which brings me to my next point which is good clean winds will almost be a must if using fixed bridle hooked in. Then there is surface conditions. If on low resistance (ice for example) you could probably get going easier and be able to hang onto the handles easier if flying unhooked. Hooked in on ice (fixed bridle) would be at your own peril if just starting out.

A proper depower will solve most of the above issues, however there are guys that snow kite frequently with fixed bridle (skimtwashington) so you can always get started with them and sort out what you eventually want.

take my advice lightly, I'm by no means a snow kite expert.

As soon as it got hot here I started thinking about the fall and winter. I was on the buggy the other day and ran over some leafs and the sound made me think of the fall when that is a common sound.

That's awesome you have a full set of Rages. I knew I should have got a 4.7m when they were on sale.

One option to keep in mind if you start to not feel comfortable using the strip is to geta Bar with a proper chicken loop for the ability to get it unhooked.

Ahhhh...the wonderful world of snow kiting....

Skiing without vertical!


Your kites are fine for any surface including snow. I have never had a problem with snow getting in kite. You invert it in air and stall it... and shake it out. Dry snow shakes out like sand...

Or..put it down and go down and shake it out if you have to. Wet snow sticks a bit but will also slide out. If it is really wet you have other problem like trying to fly a heavy saturated kite.

Flying in a snow storm may put snow in chambers as well as dragging kite on launch/landings. But again.. you can shake it out typically

SAFETY:
It is possible to have a quick release on a FB setup if you add a PANIC SNAP onto your harness and put the strop through it . Very cheap to buy($3- $10..swivel hole is best). You may need to use a slightly shorter stop( as it will extend the slide point of strop about 3.5 inches out from hook and away from your body...or try to attach Panic Snap more directly onto harness (alter/mod) instead of hook.

Strop line length is variable based on flyer's preference..typical is 18 -24 inches. Power kite handles usually have either a loop of cord, or piece of straight cord w/ knot to attach strop line-located at handle top, on opposite side of lead line cord where the Power line attaches.

Hot damn BrockRock, welcome to the wild, wonderful world of snowkiting, if even only in your mind at this point. It is far and away my favorite way to enjoy mobile kiting of the four ways I've tried it so far (buggy, skates, ATB, and skis). While I really prefer snowkiting with DP kites (best-in-show IMHO being Ozone varieties equipped with the venerable Re-Ride system, viz., latest generation Access, Frenzy, and Summit), I too have had good success using FB on snow. In my case this was limited to NASA Star-3s flown from a bar with chicken loop. What Tuck (my affectionate name for skimtwashington) is describing sounds up to the task and elegant in its design, though I've never seen a panic snap (sure have experienced a few though).

Funny how things work out this way, but I just so happen to be selling a superb near-new snowkite right now at 50% off retail. http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=32263#pid31... Did I mention it was 50% off? :evil:

Great call on your plan to enlist Chris at Hardwater this winter. That's exactly what I'd be doing if I still lived in New England (grew up in VT). I bought this kite (and most all of the kites in my quiver) from him.

Here's a panic snap:




A creative mod to attach left side 'ring' to harness- ......strop through right side ...... pull middle toward you(direction of arrow) to release. Ring swivel on this... some non-swivel solid one piece section ring.

First power kite (ParaSki Flex kite and Paraski Flex harness) used this system.

Oh, snap! (couldn't resist!)

Quote: Originally posted by skimtwashington

Here's a panic snap: A creative mod to attach left side 'ring' to harness- ......strop through right side ...... pull middle toward you(direction of arrow) to release. Ring swivel on this... some non-swivel solid one piece section ring. First power kite (ParaSki Flex kite and Paraski Flex harness) used this system.

Wow! Thanks to all for the replies. Pretty much what I expected from this community of great folks. Any advice on a good harness, and I would not be adverse to flying my kites off of a bar for skiing, but I know very little about this. What would be a good bar for a 4-line, fixed bridle kite. Intuitively - and based on the little that I know - it seems like a bar is the way to go.

Quote: Originally posted by brockrock1000

Wow! Thanks to all for the replies. Pretty much what I expected from this community of great folks. Any advice on a good harness, and I would not be adverse to flying my kites off of a bar for skiing, but I know very little about this. What would be a good bar for a 4-line, fixed bridle kite. Intuitively - and based on the little that I know - it seems like a bar is the way to go.

If you are (rightly IMHO) considering using a bar and harness for Snowkiting then you are heading towards DP and probably need to swallow hard and jump into the DP fray. Most (though certainly not all) FB kites are severely dumbed down when flown from a bar (even a fancy bar) and I would venture to say that better satisfaction could be had by just about any properly sized DP in this setting than the most carefully selected and optimized FB. Others may differ in this opinion.

I had some modicum of success using various Born Kite NASA Star3s flown from a bar while Snowkiting, but please note that NS3s (and I believe most all FB kites) each have relatively narrow wind ranges (certainly a lot more narrow than DPs) necessitating a fair number more FB kites in your quiver to cover a wide wind range than with DPs which by their very nature have wider wind ranges per kite because of, well, their DP system.

Now, about your question about harnesses, a great basic harness that I and a lot of other snowkiters use is the Ozone SB, incidentally sold by Chris: http://www.hardwaterkiter.com/store/p67/Ozone_SB_harness.htm...

As much as I'd love to sell you my 9m Frenzy (and it would serve you well) if you are ultimately going to take the DP plunge I would highly recommend starting with an Access V6, Ozone's latest model featuring Re-Ride: http://www.hardwaterkiter.com/ozone-access-v6.html Yes, money buys wonderful things. Another good choice would be a Flysurfer Peak-2, maybe in the 9m size:
http://www.hardwaterkiter.com/flysurfer-peak-2.html

Others may differ in their opinion, but my experience has not been all that favorable flying 4-line FB kites from a bar. It's sort of like giving your kite a lobotomy. But hey, at least it's harder to control; it's got that going for it. :saint: The thing is you can sort of have your hands full just dealing with the winter elements so you may want to think about simplifying your kite situation instead of severely compromising yourself with a FB flown from a bar.

Windstruck - Thanks for that very practical info! Greatly appreciated!

So what I have taken from this is that my Flexi Rage kites would work for this intended purpose, and it would probably be best to fly them off the handles during my initial stage of just 'playing around'. Then, after a session or two with Feyd, I will no doubt see about a proper DP kite.

Also, this thread has temporarily gotten my mind off the near ninety degree temp outside - along with its associated, windless humidity - and I find the idea of my fingers freezing off to be rather inviting. I say bring it!!

Quote: Originally posted by brockrock1000

Windstruck - Thanks for that very practical info! Greatly appreciated! So what I have taken from this is that my Flexi Rage kites would work for this intended purpose, and it would probably be best to fly them off the handles during my initial stage of just 'playing around'. Then, after a session or two with Feyd, I will no doubt see about a proper DP kite. Also, this thread has temporarily gotten my mind off the near ninety degree temp outside - along with its associated, windless humidity - and I find the idea of my fingers freezing off to be rather inviting. I say bring it!!

Bring it indeed! Good call all around. I just sold my Frenzy this morning so you're off the hook. :saint:

I think you are exactly on track. Fly your Rages off of handles, thus providing you an easy escape hatch if things go South and you find yourself skittering towards a bench, some bleachers, a fence, a soccer goal post, whatever those idiots put in your way on your otherwise pristine field (what were they thinking?). As I've found out the hard way more than once, relying on remembering to actually pop the chicken loop at the moment of truth is no way to ensure staying out of trouble. I'm cracking up right now remembering getting Aqua Man'ed behind a tow boat when I was just learning how to water ski, being too stubborn (or probably, too stupid) to let go of the darn bar even though I was being pulled underwater with no skis on my feet. How was I going to save that exactly?

Chris Krug will be a superb instructor and you won't go wrong heading up to the Conway area for some Hardwater instruction. Wish I could join you!

You'll wet your whistle with the Rages and I bet like the whole snowkiting experience so much that after some Hardwater action you will gear up and become a hardcore addict like me and many others. Snowkiting it da bomb! Good news is you can buy great gear and get great support from Chris. I look forward to reading about your adventures in a few short months!

become one w/ your fb kites on handles, harness and strop too...best move you will ever make
then go play dp
im actually pretty sick about the frenzy sale:barf:

I spent my 1st snowkite season learning with a 3m JoJo on bar, 4.5 and 7m Bullets. I learned a lot but mostly learned that FB was not ideal.

You are on a good path. Get all the fly and motion time in that you can before getting together with Hard Water Kiting.

Flying unhooked is very different than taking the power through a harness. Getting a harness and getting comfortable hooked in will be a big advantage. You can hook into your handles with a strop. Consider the fact that your harness will go over your snow pants etc. Get one that is big enough.