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Originally posted by bigkahuna FWIW I've not seen much info on the Switch kites yet, but those prices are definitely interesting. Too bad they don't make a 16m, my Bularoo 16m will be the first to need replacement I'm afraid.

From the Switch Kites website... it's a 16m.

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The Nitro Race Edition is a specially designed light wind race kite. We optimised the profile, decreased the leading edge/strut diameters and trimmed weight to give the hard core racer the advantage in the lightest of conditions.

Interesting, I didn't look at the Nitro, just the Method as that looked to be the best surf kite they have. I don't know anything about their kites but I know Bill Hansen is a bit of a legend in the windsurfing community. It'll be interesting to see how well their kite will do. Lots of competition out there though.

He's very involved at the kiteforum with the Switch Kites thread. Much less pimping than Epic too

The range on the 16m bothers me - 8 to 18 knots with a 75kg rider? Seems a bit pessimistic - my 16 Xbow suggested 7 to 16 knots for the same but we all know that ain't the truth I reckon realistically for me, it's AT LEAST 8 knots to plane ...

Unless of course, Cabrinha is simply listed the absolute bottom end the kite will fly in ... and Switch is listing what rideable ...?

It's interesting...there is a flysurfer questionaire out right now, and sounds like they are putting out feelers regarding a tube kite as well.

I think the biggest issue Switch faces is that they don't have any stores or reps, it's strictly sales from their warehouse in China. They're counting entirely on positive reviews on the internet to sell their kites. The problem with that is that you can't always believe what you read on the internet (unless it's here, of course! ). Although $600 - $800 for a new kite is a considerable savings, it's still $600 - $800 and if you don't like it you're not likely to get it all back (especially if you have to ship it back to China).

As for Epic, that's just another soon to fail attempt by Dimitri at self promotion, just like Eclipse did. He's the perfect example of info on the internet that you cannot (and should not) believe. Perfect example is his claims for the Epic Infinity, where he claims his 11 meter kite pulls as much as an 18 meter kite. Yah, right. Only the feeblest of minds would believe that. I doubt he's managed to overcome the laws of physics. :bouncy:

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It's interesting...there is a flysurfer questionaire out right now, and sounds like they are putting out feelers regarding a tube kite as well.

That would be interesting. Flysurfer has built a reputation for kites that perform in ultra light wind and top notch construction. If they were to do the same in the inflato world, they might have a chance IMO. Perhaps release a "Mercedes" class of inflato that costs more but has amazing flying qualities and lasts forever. The whole "German engineering" thing could work very well in their favor. But it would also add fuel to the "foil vs. inflato" debate and "pumpmeup" would have a hay-day if it were to happen. Not sure that we'd ever see a Flysurfer inflato but it's interesting that Armin is even thinking about it.

looking forward to their inflatable finished product and reviews............................

I'm curious at how many people would actually fully switch from arcs to LEI's....or than just potentially adding a PL LEI to the mix.

I need to fly LEI's more (got my first one not so long ago and need to get used to it in all conditions), but I would find it hard to 'replace' the feeling my venom gives me during nasty inland gusty conditions. There were a couple snow sessions this year where similar projected sized foils and LEI's were setting down for a bit while the wind howled and the venom was still going along, it was powered for sure, but didn't feel unsafe. Honestly, the LEI's probably could have kept going cause of the insane depower they have, but I guess the guys just didn't feel safe on them. Even with LEI's depower, I guess there is a point in gusty winds where added performance becomes a liability. So, not sure I would be without an arc in the closet for the gusty days.

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Originally posted by bigkahuna Quote: It's interesting...there is a flysurfer questionaire out right now, and sounds like they are putting out feelers regarding a tube kite as well. That would be interesting. Flysurfer has built a reputation for kites that perform in ultra light wind and top notch construction. If they were to do the same in the inflato world, they might have a chance IMO. Perhaps release a "Mercedes" class of inflato that costs more but has amazing flying qualities and lasts forever. The whole "German engineering" thing could work very well in their favor. But it would also add fuel to the "foil vs. inflato" debate and "pumpmeup" would have a hay-day if it were to happen. Not sure that we'd ever see a Flysurfer inflato but it's interesting that Armin is even thinking about it.

I dunno if Epic will go down any time soon - they seem to be up and running nicely with quite a following ...

The never-ending stream of Infinity B.S. though is impressive in it's volume the latest is an 80kg guy is claiming he's out riding in 3 to 8 knots

LEIs are easy to use ... therein lies their charm. Gusty conditions aren't really their forte though ...

Switch might do ok - after all, most people are searching for the best price and may not have a local store to "support" so getting gear is a bidding war ...
Getting candid info from Bill is good too - he says that they're not really parS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-n'ride kites - which is what I prefer

I would consider riding the new LEI but I find it highly unlikely that I would give up the ride qualities of an Arc for one. I wouldn't turn one down that's for sure.

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Originally posted by Kamikuza Quote: Originally posted by bigkahuna Quote: It's interesting...there is a flysurfer questionaire out right now, and sounds like they are putting out feelers regarding a tube kite as well. That would be interesting. Flysurfer has built a reputation for kites that perform in ultra light wind and top notch construction. If they were to do the same in the inflato world, they might have a chance IMO. Perhaps release a "Mercedes" class of inflato that costs more but has amazing flying qualities and lasts forever. The whole "German engineering" thing could work very well in their favor. But it would also add fuel to the "foil vs. inflato" debate and "pumpmeup" would have a hay-day if it were to happen. Not sure that we'd ever see a Flysurfer inflato but it's interesting that Armin is even thinking about it. I dunno if Epic will go down any time soon - they seem to be up and running nicely with quite a following ... The never-ending stream of Infinity B.S. though is impressive in it's volume the latest is an 80kg guy is claiming he's out riding in 3 to 8 knots LEIs are easy to use ... therein lies their charm. Gusty conditions aren't really their forte though ... Switch might do ok - after all, most people are searching for the best price and may not have a local store to "support" so getting gear is a bidding war ... Getting candid info from Bill is good too - he says that they're not really parS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-n'ride kites - which is what I prefer

he likes to talk a lot ... big name behind the brand, is how most survive. than you get top riders completing and the odds ones doing the insane stunts for promotions.

each area has is own following, so I didnt see other brands on the beach in the at video other than WH. WH doesnt make a light wind TT board, in that condition wouldnt a SURF be more fun. if some dude had a FS and Door I can see him not talking so much. put the little asian guy out there and and I would be doing tiny jumps than cruising back and fourth.

not to knock any brand 15 to 17m have their place (i miss my BigMama), but giving wind conditions is difficult to judge.
-you got all this guys standing behind a wall of bushes.
-taking a wind reading from beach is different if you were in open water, no obstacles.

IMO for the landlocked riders, I cant see them going to the LEI (why too), they have their CH and other TS models. maybe add one or two just incase

for the cross-over riders, i believe most will demo one first before making the leap over or more it an addition to their quiver.

kitesurfer, is iffy ... but because PLP has a huge following I think most will go with the NEW but at the same time keep what they currently have as well.

every brand has a following, just pick yours. hehehe

tick tick, its coming.

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I'm curious at how many people would actually fully switch from arcs to LEI's....or than just potentially adding a PL LEI to the mix.

My guess would be that if PL sold inflatos it would be to add to their customer base rather than switch their existing customer base.

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I need to fly LEI's more (got my first one not so long ago and need to get used to it in all conditions), but I would find it hard to 'replace' the feeling my venom gives me during nasty inland gusty conditions.

You might be surprised at how "arc-ish" some inflatos are now-a-days. I made the switch some 4 or so years ago, absolutely no regrets. Best thing to do is to give as many kites a try as you can.

There are a number of members that use Ocean Rodeo inflatables on water and Arcs on land. Different tools for different jobs. Arcs are great for inland gusty winds. I don't think I will use the LEIs to buggy or landboard. Also I am not sure I want to try the Arcs on the water mainly because the locations I go to the launch and culture is not conducive.

''You might be surprised at how "arc-ish" some inflatos are now-a-days.''...

mmm, you caught my attention with that. I Are you referring to the smooth feeling during gusts? I would be interested in which LEI models you would say arc-ish? Don't have much experience with LEI's.

@kitedelight - I've been very happy with my quiver of Best Bularoos (10m, 13m and 16m) and 20m Waroo. They have been every bit as smooth both in gust handling and in power delivery as my Peter Lynns were (Venoms and Phantoms). I also gave a North Rebel a quick try (seemed to be a bit "liftier" than my Bularoo) and a Cabrinha Crossbow (seemed faster but not as smooth in delivery) which although I didn't like as much, other kiters I know swear by them. I think the best thing to do is to try as many kites as you possibly can.

I like my Crossbows ... I liked the Rebel I used too.

http://peterlynn.com/the-sardegna-trip/

thanks Rip........................looks alot like the SS Rev which is an outstanding kite...................my inflatables and Flysurfers are much better on water IMHO......................

looks good . tick tock

i agree with TRI ... this is 1 of 3 models. I'm still hoping for something like my/your Rabbits.

On the Nav bar too!

1 of 3 models.................so possibly a SLE/Bow, C, and Delta designs..........this would be interesting...............as stated with the Navi bar would make a dynamite package...........