Late to the party here. Currently driving an Ivanpah and have a Flexifoil Scout for freestyle. light riding and teaching.

The Ivanpah is a like Lazy-Boy recliner on railroad tracks. Very stable once you get over the initial twitchiness due to the high amount of caster in the front fork (but feet off the peg and it tracks straight and true) Not easy to disassemble for transport, though so you will need an external rack or trailer. Very secure ride; the only way out of the seat is straight up or straight out the front over the fork.

FWIW, Flexifoil is bringing back the stanless line of buggies later in the year, but prices not yet announced. Figure higher than before, as they will be made again in East Europe (good quality, though).

Yes I have had axle bolts back out of a flexifoil bug, (left rear) but that was due to my own negligence. +1 for jamb nuts, though, no trouble with the Ivanpah. Reverse threads are no substitute for a rider's diligence.

Yeah "terrain in the USA" is pretty rough, ROTFLMAO!!! Must be the plovers.

CSA, I think this will best describe me. Just starting out, but will pick it up quick, I know! I want to be comfortable and I want to cruise! I do want a Benz too! I love the looks of the Sysmic but 3K, yikes!

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Originally posted by AD72 Bobby I remember when you took my buggy for a spin and the back axle popped off!:wee::shocked2: There are few that dare take a ride in the ST crunchmaster.

Yes, I remember that well. I had very little experience in a standard size buggy with the back tires right beside me. Tire rolled over a back line from the bar and suddenly I had a tiger by the tail. Thankfully no one nor your buggy was hurt in this experience!

:puzzled: I don't know, but there are 2 PL buggy's for sale listed here(one new, one like new), which would enable 2 different style rides, at a combined cost of 1/2 the price of a Sysmic, just my thoughts, if I had the 1300+/- to get them both I'd already be doing the deal! :bigok: You could be riding tandem, or with a buddy/S/O!

my ride, desert set up.

As you can see, opinions are like @$$ holes, everybody has one. There are a lot of great buggies out there and it definitely depends on what kind of riding one is going to be doing. I agree with Sean's advice. Get with other riders and do some test driving and discussing what kind of riding you see yourself doing, keeping an open mind to the fact that it may change It usually does. Forums are great but nothing beats first hand.

My wife and I have been riding PL Comps since 1995 and PL Classics before that. We've transported them all over by air and on our camper (they fit side by side on the roof).

We're just cruiser, so they work great for us.

Couldn't have said it better myself sunset-jim.

I started on an early gerneration Flexi. It suited my need for a small, light, transportable buggy.
I have decided to take things more serious and have bought an Ivanpah.
Both of these serve me but in different ways.

If transport, location and cash don't hold you back + jumping is not in your future then you have choices like never before. For Freestyle it's still Flexi but Apexx is coming online.

One thing I decided was that a good buggy is going to serve me a lot more than a new race kite when it comes to getting speed!

Dino's Apexx and Flexiblade's Sherman buggy are great. Nice cruisers that can hold down a lot of kite. The last time I went to the beach in high wind my ST was just pulled sideways. The ST has been a great starter buggy and easy to transport. Plus it is an abdominal workout.

Mogul, With Apex, why would you not want to start out on this one. Just too hard to learn on? If so why, long wheel base ect??

He just had a good obe and hit his head. He is still not thinking clearly

Even a beginner can benefit from a heavy well made buggy. The ability to extract all the benefits might not be there though. The security can be felt by all.

I can't see why a person couldn't / wouldn't start on an Apexx or similar type buggy from the start?

It is a mattter of knowing that your location will support it, and having a method of transporting it.

I am pretty sure I will get to use my Ivanpah buggy on less than 6 occasions each year. Our locations + my desire to ride other styles makes it that way. Still I think it was a good investment.

Here are a few buggies and detailed descriptions of each, once again choices I hope this helps.
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-sprinter.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-vmaxii.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-hardcore.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-supertruck2.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-truck2.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-kbss-suspension.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-dragster.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_libre-protask.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_sys-sysmics2.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_sys-sysmics1.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_pl-folding.htm
http://kitebuggyspeedshop.com/b_pl-competition-xr.htm

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Originally posted by Bladerunner I can't see why a person couldn't / wouldn't start on an Apexx or similar type buggy from the start? It is a mattter of knowing that your location will support it, and having a method of transporting it.

Doesn't the second sentence kind of answer the first? Good investment? Maybe. However, if you are flying inland or limited to small fields.... it's sort of like owning a Koenigsegg Agera...



in a town made completely of heavily pot-holed two lane blacktop... with heavy radar coverage... and bored local constabulary who spend waaaaay too much time polishing their small fleet of "interceptors."



ATB,
Sam

Sam you are being way to logical.:dunno:

I'm not saying someone CAN'T start on an Apexx, I'm just saying I would not recommend it to a beginner. Yes it's an amazing buggy. Yes it's quite difficult to flip. Yes it will last quite some time, as well as hold it's value IF someone decided to sell it for any reason. I just wouldn't tell a new pilot to run right out and buy one as a first buggy. Why? Indigo made a VERY valid point above. You need space. Lots of space. These buggies love to run, and I can't see spending the cash if you don't have room to open it up. Now, seeing a how these buggies live for speed, we should consider the engine. Vapor, reactor II, Cooper, prodigy, combat, you get the idea. Fast buggy would warrant a fast kite I would think. I can not see putting that caliber kite in the hands of someone new to kiting. Sure, you could run a slower, beginner friendly kite in an Apexx but not running a fast kite with a race buggy would be like buying a Ferrari Enzo only to run a Toyota Corolla 1.8L 4 cyl in it. Lots of flash? Sure! But why drop the $$$ on a performance machine if you can't power it properly? Maybe it's just the recent knock to the head talking an I'm waaayyyyy off base here, just my thoughts

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Originally posted by jellis Sam you are being way to logical.:dunno:

That's quite possibly the funniest notion that has ever been posted to PKF.

A long time friend tagged me with a nickname that is the very antithesis of logic.

I was just addressing BR's notion that he couldn't see why someone wouldn't just jump to a Apexx or Sysmic.

It's all just for giggles, so buy what makes you happy (as long as it doesn't put the wee furry ones on half rations). Just hoping that people take into account that depending on local conditions, the top of the shelf isn't going to be the best fit.

ATB,
Sam

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Originally posted by indigo_wolf Quote: Originally posted by jellis Sam you are being way to logical.:dunno: Just hoping that people take into account that depending on local conditions, the top of the shelf isn't going to be the best fit. ATB, Sam

This is what I was trying to say.

I do NOT buy in to this a race buggy MUST have a FB race kite powering it ?

I don't like race kites and have no intension to fly them. I DO want to join the 80KPH club and am confident I will do it with arcs ( or Flysurfer) . I won't be the 1st !

I think that a good buggy will take you into those type speeds far more safely than a FB race kite and Frankin'buggy or a PL thin! My used buggy cost much less than a new vapor and I'm SURE it will serve me better at reaching my goal safely.

Then again, I never was one to go about thing the conventional way !


GREAT TOPIC by the way !

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I don't like race kites and have no intension to fly them. I DO want to join the 80KPH club and am confident I will do it with arcs ( or Flysurfer) . I won't be the 1st !

Ask AJ how fast an arc can go?

If you have the money you cant go wrong with a small stout one for banging around and easy transport add to it a big one for the big events and rough fields. Given your background you will be drawn into all that land kiting has to offer.

I just went to Popeye the welder................ man those buggies are works of art. Beautiful. I'm sure they are expensive. Anyone have one? Snow spider, great advice, I will be pulling the trigger real soon. I guess you can always buy a better buggy down the road. I really do like to way the LIBER side rails that come up around you. Seems you sit down in it deeper, where the Peter Lynn seems you sit higher. I have a small trailer so transportation won't be an issue. Just looking for the perfect buggy. This has turned out to be an awesome thread with great information. Thank you for the responses and education.

Have a look at VTT.com. He also makes some nice buggies.

i have/had 2 large (extended/elongated side rails and wide rear axles to match) buggies.
i ride in a small area and in gusty winds with far too much lawn junk/obstacles around(which is why i now prefer landsailer). my area is surely not a "race" environment and i did not buy the buggies to race. i bought them because they are comfy and more stable (better suited to handle the sudden "added wind power" from gusts i deal with)... i'm sure the large buggies helped save me from an OBE or two that would have occurred in a standard/short buggy.
Paul

Rev, I think I'm leaning towards a larger buggy. I want comfort! I will be riding on beaches mostly hard pack with some soft sand.

Since you have a trailer a large buggy would probably suit you a little better. I have a large buggy and no trailer and it has often prevented me from getting out. Too much hassle to break down. So I got a PL XR+ for convenience but I must say you are right on the money. With the PL buggies you kinda sit "ON" them more so than "IN" them. Van made me a set of side rails for the XR that have a higher profile and offer more of a bucket seat.

I really like this Black Widow. Seems that this buggy might be on the money. Well see

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Originally posted by Powerws I just went to Popeye the welder................ man those buggies are works of art. Beautiful. I'm sure they are expensive. Anyone have one?

I bought the Hero buggy from him when he was here for NABX this spring. Yes it is a work of art. It is too small for me but my sons really appreciate what a nice ride it is. My avatar pic is Popeye and I with my son Wexler sitting in the Hero.

Beamer, are his buggies expensive? Even though it's not what I need, I love the looks of his Dominator 4 buggy. Beautiful.