The thing I hate most about this sport is the fact that although you get all kinds of great advice, eventually you have to come to terms with the fact
that buying and trying is the only real way to figure out the right decision.
Anyway I hear what you're saying about the silver arrow (which I assume is also called deluxe fabric) but maybe in the 6-8m range, it's not as much of
a deal breaker to go without. It doesn't sound like I should be too worried about buying something like a peak or either of the discontinued psycho
or outlaw, since they are all solid tools for they jobs they do.
I'm not strictly thinking about touring anyway so a peak isn't a must but more of an option to consider. They do sound versatile even if you don't
count that toward being a good all-round design.
You're in Halifax Yeti. Take a small winter break and come down here to NH. You're welcome to come try out the Peaks or any of our demos. You're
right, otherwise its a leap of faith and a decision based on reports/opinions from people who may or may not really know how to fly kite XYZ or have
enough time on it to form a worthwhile opinion. Often, better than nothing but not nearly as good as flying it first hand with the people who know it
well right there with you. Snowkite is one of the only sports I know where you are expected to drop money on something sight unseen. Skis, you can
demo. Bikes, same. Cars, yup. Even water kites seem to have more demo access. We're doing our best to change that by offering demos here. But it
only works if people come to usnornwe go to them.
It's true, they are all good kites. It really depends on your tastes and needs. But don't let the "touring kite" label fool ya, the Peaks are pretty
ridiculous fun to ride.
I was out last night playing with our new 6m school kite and I had forgotten how nimble it is. There is nothing else out there that I can think of
that can be thrown around and positioned like the Peak. It makes me laugh. And unlike the Peak 1 the peak 2 will boost. Not like a Psycho 4 but if
the winds are up its boosts surprisingly well. To be honest, I never really explored the boosting potential of the Peaks. But last night I played
with it and started to get the timing figured out. I'm a little excited.:D
Chris Krug-Owner @ Hardwater Kiting. Authorized Dealer of Ozone, Flysurfer, HQ kites. www.hardwaterkiter.com 603-986-2784
It really is a shame that it is so hard to " try before you buy " when you fly on land. Back in the day some dealers were generous enough to take part
in a " pass the ... kite " plan. Unfortunately it turned into a big hassle for the dealers and we seem to have ruined that opportunity for ourselves.
:embarrased:
We have a brick and mortar surf store here. Lots of opportunity to demo water gear but I would have to beg on all 4's to get them to bring in a Peak
for me to demo.
Thank goodness for this forum and people like you Feyd! I was going along thinking I would replace my 2.5 pro foil with a 4m Peak. Thanks to your
hands on advice I see that I would have bought the wrong kite for my needs. If we can't get our hands on your demos you do a fantastic job of sharing
your experience with new products. This place wouldn't be near as valuable to me without you here Kris!
I sure miss the good old days when I had more Ripsession demo's than I had days to try them.
Thanks for the kind words Blade. (isn't it like CRAZY early for you out there?) I try to help as best I can though to be honest, I always feel a
little uneasy sharing my experience with these things as I feel like I'm coming off as a "know it all" which is not my intention. I appreciate being
reassured by members like you, who have been here a long time and know where I'm coming from, that I'm doing a service to the forum but I still worry
a bit. Since leaving the Peter Lynn team, starting the school and becoming a dealer I'm in the unique position of having access and opportunity to
put a broad spectrum of kites to work and see how they fair both for myself as well as our students and clients. And I'm not a "Fanboy" of any brand.
Being neutral is the only way to have your opinion carry any weight IMO. Fortunately it's easy to remain non-brand biased when all of our vendors
make such good stuff these days.
I remember the days of "pass the kite". It was an amazing concept but in practice I can see how it became problematic. I wish we could do something
similar but from a liability POV I think my insurance company would pretty much laugh at me.
I'm glad you didn't replace your 2.5 Profoil with the 4m Peak. HAHAHAHAHA! Wow, that would have been a surprise!!!:evil:
Chris Krug-Owner @ Hardwater Kiting. Authorized Dealer of Ozone, Flysurfer, HQ kites. www.hardwaterkiter.com 603-986-2784
Yeah decided to join the buy and sell rental program myself. Taking advantage of flysurfer's worldwide shipping promo and went for an outlaw over a
peak1 in the same 6m size. The wind range on the outlaw is supposedly a whole lot higher, but I believe Chris when he says they under spec the peak
max range. The peak would have won the low end of the range competition but then I'm not going to fly a small kite in under 15-20 knots. I hope it
works and there isn't too much gap to my 11m Frenzy. I nearly went full on buy/sell rental mode and bought both kites, but resisted for now.
Someone turn on the snow. But I'll probably be on the water until that starts happening.
2nd the Peak. Broadest wind range and great low end. Has awesome active gust handling. The 12m is a powerhouse but can be managed well. If the winds
get too high it is a great kite to "half line" (doubling back your lines) with. Makes it like having another kite.
Chris - can you please describe how to "half line" a Peak? Those of us watching at home want to follow along! :D
I'm going to put a little tutorial video together. It's a great way to get more top end out of a given kite without the need for extra lines. Also
it has saved my bacon once or twice when caught in a situation where I didn't bring small enough kites and the wind came up a lot higher than
expected. :P
Chris Krug-Owner @ Hardwater Kiting. Authorized Dealer of Ozone, Flysurfer, HQ kites. www.hardwaterkiter.com 603-986-2784
2nd the Peak. Broadest wind range and great low end. Has awesome active gust handling. The 12m is a powerhouse but can be managed well. If the winds
get too high it is a great kite to "half line" (doubling back your lines) with. Makes it like having another kite.
Chris - can you please describe how to "half line" a Peak? Those of us watching at home want to follow along! :D
I was thinking about that as well and can only imagine that you go up and through the rings you normally larkshead to then connect on the bar side as
you normally would but only with 2 loop ends together instead of one. Could be totally wrong but I don't think so. :D
2nd the Peak. Broadest wind range and great low end. Has awesome active gust handling. The 12m is a powerhouse but can be managed well. If the winds
get too high it is a great kite to "half line" (doubling back your lines) with. Makes it like having another kite.
Chris - can you please describe how to "half line" a Peak? Those of us watching at home want to follow along! :D
I was thinking about that as well and can only imagine that you go up and through the rings you normally larkshead to then connect on the bar side as
you normally would but only with 2 loop ends together instead of one. Could be totally wrong but I don't think so. :D
My thinking as well. I'm not in a place I can get to my kites right now and that was what I was visualizing too. What was hanging me up without
looking at the setup layed out was how the "5th line" flag out system would work with the lines doubled back as you describe. I'm thinking that if I'm
going to this sort of MASH unit fix in the field I'm a long way from my base and the wind is strong, making the possibility of pulling the safety a
genuine possibility.
aha the footage has mysteriously disappeared. we need to get a good private eye on this case. or may be I will look up some of my own footage of the 4m's bad behavior to post when I have time. In all fairness I flew the 6m and it
flew ok.
The problem is brutally simple. You bought an apple hoping it would taste like an orange. Flysurfer advertised this kite as an easy introduction to
power kiting for beginners and that's it's a touring kite that will pack small and handle back country gusts. It does all that and does it well.
It's not the apple's fault it doesn't taste like an orange, but you can do all sorts of stuff with it like cider, apple sauce etc...
So why do I care? Well this style of kite possesses qualities that I prefer for my conditions. I'm guessing here, but I think you bought it hoping
it would possess many of the same qualities of your "normal" kites but for few dollars less (costs less than 6m access I think). When it didn't taste
like an orange you didn't like it.
If your going to experiment with kite types, you have to be prepared for the possibility your not going to like it.
If we all preferred the same kite, it would be a pretty boring place around here.
ps. the peak is the most super fantastic kite the world has ever known :moon:
Yes. You can witness the "ground kiss" I described right in the beginning of this video (red 4m P2). I have footage of the other more violent incident
that occurred with my blue 9m P2, but this is a family show and we don't need to be posting that sort of kite-carnage here. :evil:
Wow so people are still attacking my post about the peak 2 4m huh, Ok I'm going to keep it real and this will be my last post on the peaks. I lost
300 dollars on the resale of this kite and frankly I'm a little pissed about it. Honestly I read a review on the kite and was under the impression
that it was a really great kite and its not. The kite flies like crap - it depowers horribly by folding its wing tips on it self only to power up in
strong gusty winds, bar pressure is high and the vibrating back lines are annoying along with the off and on power delivery sucks. Those who say this
kite (4M peak ) is great are lying to themselves and others and its a shame because people who buy this kite as a high wind will be disappointed . It
would be nice if others would also stop attacking peoples honest opinion of a kite on the forum. Originally when I posted my review of the kite I was
quoted as spreading misinformation and that's not right in my opinion. I have been flying kites for more years than most people on this forum and know
a good kite when I fly one. I enjoy reading peoples opinion on a kite and don't think that people should attack others honest experience. And to
ssayre I dint buy the kite expecting apples or oranges or whatever . I bought the kite as a high wind kite after reading a review right here on this
forum and also from flysurfer about its features only later to realize that the negatives of the kite far outweigh the positives. Ok end of my rant.
aha the footage has mysteriously disappeared. we need to get a good private eye on this case. or may be I will look up some of my own footage of the 4m's bad behavior to post when I have time. In all fairness I flew the 6m and it
flew ok.
The problem is brutally simple. You bought an apple hoping it would taste like an orange. Flysurfer advertised this kite as an easy introduction to
power kiting for beginners and that's it's a touring kite that will pack small and handle back country gusts. It does all that and does it well.
It's not the apple's fault it doesn't taste like an orange, but you can do all sorts of stuff with it like cider, apple sauce etc...
So why do I care? Well this style of kite possesses qualities that I prefer for my conditions. I'm guessing here, but I think you bought it hoping
it would possess many of the same qualities of your "normal" kites but for few dollars less (costs less than 6m access I think). When it didn't taste
like an orange you didn't like it.
If your going to experiment with kite types, you have to be prepared for the possibility your not going to like it.
If we all preferred the same kite, it would be a pretty boring place around here.
ps. the peak is the most super fantastic kite the world has ever known :moon:
MY KITES
nano- 0.5m - high wind kite
mega-2.2m- low wind kite
"Wow so people are still attacking my post about the peak 2 4m huh"
No, the post you quoted me on is over a month old. It was during the last discussion / argument in the access review thread. I quoted you there and
posted here so the discussion would be in the appropriate thread, but you hadn't noticed until now.
Your entitled to your opinion, but the way you have expressed it, makes it sound like you know more about kiting than anyone else who owns or has
reviewed this kite and does not share your opinion. I would respectfully disagree with that.
Wow so people are still attacking my post about the peak 2 4m huh, Ok I'm going to keep it real and this will be my last post on the peaks. I lost
300 dollars on the resale of this kite and frankly I'm a little pissed about it. Honestly I read a review on the kite and was under the impression
that it was a really great kite and its not. The kite flies like crap - it depowers horribly by folding its wing tips on it self only to power up in
strong gusty winds, bar pressure is high and the vibrating back lines are annoying along with the off and on power delivery sucks. Those who say this
kite (4M peak ) is great are lying to themselves and others and its a shame because people who buy this kite as a high wind will be disappointed . It
would be nice if others would also stop attacking peoples honest opinion of a kite on the forum. Originally when I posted my review of the kite I was
quoted as spreading misinformation and that's not right in my opinion. I have been flying kites for more years than most people on this forum and know
a good kite when I fly one. I enjoy reading peoples opinion on a kite and don't think that people should attack others honest experience. And to
ssayre I dint buy the kite expecting apples or oranges or whatever . I bought the kite as a high wind kite after reading a review right here on this
forum and also from flysurfer about its features only later to realize that the negatives of the kite far outweigh the positives. Ok end of my rant.
aha the footage has mysteriously disappeared. we need to get a good private eye on this case. or may be I will look up some of my own footage of the 4m's bad behavior to post when I have time. In all fairness I flew the 6m and it
flew ok.
The problem is brutally simple. You bought an apple hoping it would taste like an orange. Flysurfer advertised this kite as an easy introduction to
power kiting for beginners and that's it's a touring kite that will pack small and handle back country gusts. It does all that and does it well.
It's not the apple's fault it doesn't taste like an orange, but you can do all sorts of stuff with it like cider, apple sauce etc...
So why do I care? Well this style of kite possesses qualities that I prefer for my conditions. I'm guessing here, but I think you bought it hoping
it would possess many of the same qualities of your "normal" kites but for few dollars less (costs less than 6m access I think). When it didn't taste
like an orange you didn't like it.
If your going to experiment with kite types, you have to be prepared for the possibility your not going to like it.
If we all preferred the same kite, it would be a pretty boring place around here.
ps. the peak is the most super fantastic kite the world has ever known :moon:
Windrider - I'm really sorry you didn't end up liking the 4m P2. I know I've had some copy in various threads supportive of this and the other P2s
(which has been my experience). I would take contest with you about the suitability of this kite as a high wind kite. I've got two videos of this
kite in high wind conditions, one with clean wind and one with really janky wind. Neither are highly edited. I am certainly not saying this is the
best possible high wind kite. In fact, based off of a recently published head to head of the Ozone Access and the Flysurfer Peak-2 under high wind
conditions ( http://www.hardwaterkiter.com/kite-and-gear-reviews/ozone-ac... ) I actually bought a 6m Access from Chris. I hope to use both this 6m Access and
the 4m P2 snowkiting this winter when it is blowing hard. For me, the whole single skin thing is really about low wind performance and small and
light packing. It could well be that single skin kites like the P2 are not the best high speed tools of choice, but I too would take contest that it
is not a good kite in its own right.
I should be able to officially join the group in another week or so with a 6m P2 inbound. Over the last 18 months or so, it is the kite that I would
like to try most. Looking forward to giving this strange beastie a run. It's probably all you guys fault too, yammering on about how good the P2 is!
(ok, well mostly) I tried holding out, really I did.....
Just put in my first session with the big cheesburger wrapper....er, I mean the Peak 2 - finished in the dark after a couple hours in the paddock.
With a big smile on my face....which is probably THE most important thing. There are some really nice features - particularly the bar which is top
notch. It has a nice wide double opening - with the power lines running smoothly through it regardless of how much you turn it. There is a fair bit
of bar pressure once the kite starts to pull - but the little stopper ball that you can slide down the line to take the pressure off the bar is
genius. Every kite should have one of those. Kite launched and landed easily and didn't misbehave in the two hours of going around in the paddock.
Started off in probably 12 knots and the 6m makes a shirt load of power pulling me uphill and into the wind with ease. Even when the wind died to
around 6 - 8 knots I was surprised by the ease of which the kite can still park and ride producing lots of power from the apparent wind. Excellent
depower. It still gets all 'flappy' when you let the bar out and when turning, one of the corners of the kite flaps around a bit but pull the bar in
and everything goes taught. Once or twice I had too much bar out and the edges of the kite folded in towards the center and it took a little while to
properly re-inflate the kite but that didn't seem to happen later in the session as I got used to handling it.
Seems to have quite good upwind ability too. I was originally thinking the 6m should be good from 12 - 20 knots but after seeing how light the wind
got today, I would say the low end would be more like 6 knots or thereabouts.
All in all, a very satisfying two hour session in the paddock (which is only 150m or so on it's longest edge so by the time you start doing 30kph, the
fence is coming up fast). In fact, one of my most satisfying sessions at home.
![[*]](images/perspective/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
or may be I will look up some of my own footage of the 4m's bad behavior to post when I have time. In all fairness I flew the 6m and it
flew ok. 
cool
