I see people talking about lifty kites or traction kites, whats the difference? Isn't traction when the kite is lower to the ground, say less than 45 degrees, and lift when the kite is overhead, say above 45 degrees. Wouldn't a "powerful" traction kite also be a lifty kite? It seems to me that power and lift are the same thing. A kite that generates a lot of lift over head would also create a lot of pull if you fly it lower to the ground.

Now what about kites with good low end pull. Is that to say the kite creates more lift or power at low speeds? Because of a deeper profile? and a kite with good top end moves fast, has more air going over the foil and makes lift or pull or power from the high volume of air flow? So would a kite with good low end would have incredible or even overwhelming high end? Lastly would a kite with good top end not have very much lift or pull or power unless it is moving fast or in high winds?

What do you think?

traction kites are used in traction sports and can be lifty or not lifty... your ace is lfty, your buster is not

a kite can be not lifty and still very powerful

low end refers to useability in lower winds... some kites are more efficient than others... my 6m century delivers more power than my 6m rage ever did... low end refers to wind speeds

high end refers to the other side of the spectrum... arcs have a great high end, meaning you can push their limits... it can be very dangerous to do this... even fatal... top end refers to wind speeds

traction is a by product of lifty when it all goes wrong........................:duh::duh:

all lifty kites are traction kites

not all kites are lifty by design

different profiles produce different rates of effect

fixed bridle foils are specific and some AoA can be changed for desired effect <> lift

depower kites represent "on the fly change" with a floating bar , some design is fixed but it is with in the canopy design .

kite range(low/high end) is more a feature of canopy design

some kites need alot of air to really work well

some light wind kites would uncontrollable in heavy air

when i had my 5m ace, jeez the lift was out of this world, very very very explosive lift when ever i landboarder with it it was tough to stay up wind because of the lift even at 45 degrees. traction is i guess more of a speed influenced measurement. how fast the kite can cut through the wind. i like this topic its a real thinker. makes me want go take some aeronautics classes or somthing.

I used the wrong words, When I said low end I meant grunt or torque.

grunt is how the power is delivered.... grunty = punchy (not smooth)

A kite that produces a lot of lift (blades, aces, or AOA adjustable FB's that are set for a power setting not a speed setting) will want to pull you sideways out of your buggy when flown low in the window. A low lift, fast kite wants to keep moving foreward and will go fast without so much of the lateral pull.

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Earl I used the wrong words, When I said low end I meant grunt or torque.

power (not torque) all about surface area and wind speed l

it is the pull(energy)l felt when the kite accelerates . large slow kites, say in 10mph, may produce a great amount of power. surface area of the kite and the air speed over the foil surface are the elements that results in power in the tethered equation(the kite is fixed to you ). a good low end performing kite would be a PL reactor or kitesurfer xl both FB kites , very powerful low wind kites that have great "low end" range of usability. the "top end" range for these kites would be hard to control may even damage the kite and you.

Just to clarify what I think Phreerider means by "low end" here is wind range, not kite. Nothing "low end" about a Reactor ;-)

Back to the original question, the Profile can have something or a lot to do with it. Compare a Blade and a Reactor, both high A/R, efficient kites. The Blade has a deeper profile, probably closer to a classic Clark Y. The Reactor, especially the II version, has a very thin profile and thinner (and reduced) bridles, all for reduced drag and high L/D. (lift/ drag ratio)

The reactor is not lifty or grunty but fast and efficient and will get closer to the edge of the window than the Blade. This is important when you are in motion and speaks to the side pull that Heliboy pointed out.

Remember that as you accelerate in your vehicle of choice, the wind window moves from besides you, down-wind, to more behind you. This is because the window follows the apparent wind which is swinging forward to more in your face the faster you go (and putting the window behind you). As such, the edge of the window- where the kite is- moves from somewhere out in front of you where it can pull you forward, to immediately to your side, where it wants to pull you sideways. The higher the L/D of the kite, the farther to the edge of the window it goes before it hits the wall and will only pull you sideways. The Blade, with its thicker, liftier profile, will sit farther back in the window and start pulling sideways only a lot sooner than the Reactor. a full blown race kite like a Yakuza or the new Vapor will go even closer to the edge of the window.

Best control float for jumping is a kite with good low end and
power. Torque... Like a truck pulling a good load...

Good low end is a kite that has very good power at low flying
speeds without backstall.

That makes it easier to learn how to Jump. Float... Smooth up
Smooth down.

Without having to go fast... or moved the kite fast. Depower Kites can make it easier as well. Pulling in the bar powers up the kite.

and less effort in maneuvering the kite on bigger sizes.
The FLysurfer Speed 3 15m 19m float like crazy.