Ok gang so I have an opportuniti to trade the Blade III 10.5m for the PL Venom 19, should I do it ? Need opinion. I just got the Blade and haven't even flown it yet. This person is from toronto and wants to do it.

ok so I traded the Blade for a 18m Guerilla....any recommendations of what do after I get Guerilla ?

Fly it :D.

I meant to say, anything can be done like mods, this will by my first ARC, so excited

My understanding is that there are a number of mods that can be done to the Venom. What they are and what they achieve, I don't know.

Its changed to the guerrilla now

Oh, right, so it did. My bad. I don't know about mods to the Guerrilla.

What would be the recommended bar & line length for the guerrilla 2?

This will have all your answers and more!

Arc Setup FAQ

i think for an 18m --- it would be best to use 60cm Bar and 30m lines to get a good range of wind use.

Fly it first ... your first arc, you won't know if it needs mods IMO :D when it's just wrong and you know it's not you, then you need to mod

the 18m g is a big slow kite so expect to park and ride!!

would a 55cm Nash bar work ?

I wouldn't say the 18 Guerrila is that slow, it can turn on the power and has great float capabilities. One of my favorite low wind kites, a gentle giant.

I have an oppurtunity for a Naish 55cm Bar with lines, it has the 5th line attached. I think the lines are 25m, but could always add extensions. Asking $85, I need to know if this will work. Thx

Trancein, that bar could either work or be really dangerous. What year is it? Best way would be to send a pic...

If it's older than 2005? then the chicken loop won't have a quick release.

My 9m Guerilla two is setup with a 45 or 50 cm Airrush bar. Per Syuzhak, you need to have a QR on the chicken loop and a leash to flag the kite off one line. Mine is et up top flag the lft rear. Some prefer to use a front line flag.

Even that little arc had me put a depower line with about 15.5" throw. The trim strap has about 8" range, and could use more. With more trim range, I'd have hard time reaching the straps (need long arms!).

Extra knots up about 6" on the front pigtails at the kite help to give you more slack in the rears.

awindof change has tied a short piece of 1/2" dowel into the front tension strap to temp shorten it by 1.5". Equivalent to letting out the trailing edge and flattening the kite a bit for light wind. I've not tried that.

Macboy's link has all the specifics you need.

krumly

The 5th line must be removed since it will not work with an Arc. Also, look at "Control Bars - Non Peter Lynn" in the set up FAQ link posted in an earlier reply.

Trim Adjuster Straps are often too short. You can make do with short adjuster straps but its better to be able to adjust on the go rather than stop and tune lines.

I have 2 non PL bars and added trim length 2 differenet ways:

1) I added a clam cleat with a whole new depower line.

2) I cheaped out and modified a Best strap: If you're depower has ends where they fold back on each other, pick them apart. Mine were doubled over about 5 inches to make them easier to grab. Picking apart the doubled over webbing allowed me to add about 4 inches to the adjuster strap. Its now about as long as the depower strap on a PL bar. I didn't even have to sew; just melted the end of the webbing with a flame so it will not unravel, folded over about 2 inches, melted a few holes near the edge with a hot coat hanger and laced up with spare line.

Webbing is really strong and the melted holes are at the end of the webbing where they have no impact upon the strength of the depower system. The goal is to make the webbing thick enough to prevent the ends from slipping through the plastic buckel and thick enough so you can grab it easily.

Also be Really careful with that Guerilla.

That thing needs 8 knots of steady wind to fly and gets overpowered on land at like 15 knots. Don't even bother in lighter winds.

My only lofting occurred on that kite. I quickly sold it after. I hope you got a good deal on the trade...

Make sure that the depower rope on the bar for it is at least 12 inches. The more the better the depower.

Ok instead of Naish, im going for the North 55cm with 27m lines. I haven't purchased it yet, with 4 lines

http://www.nwkite.com/forums/post-111879.html#111879

Here is the link, let me know if this will work.

I've used that bar on some C-kites my friend has. It is a nice older bar and it's easy to put a longer depower rope on it. A lot of C kites only use 8-10" of throw. You could use 15" for sure.

The trim strap probably has 8-9" range. Again, your kite would be happy with a lot more, but it will work, especially if you have that second set of knots on kite pigtails to move the front lines up closer to the kite (for lighter wind).

You can see where 15" depwoer throw + 10-12" on the trim strap would make for one heck of a reach to grab those straps. Longer than I can manage.


krumly

ok then I will get it

I wouldn't go for that north bar.

The depower line is way too short for PL Arcs and bow kites. Changing the depower rope is harder than it sounds. You'll have to buy a longer depower rope somewhere, and then adjust the main lines to compensate for the longer depower rope.

The safety leashes above the bar. This results in more ropes flopping around and having to unspin the leash each time you loop the kite.

If you want to stay on the same site...
http://nwkite.com/forums/t-15442.html

The new naish bars pretty much have all the features needed and are much more tidy.

The chicken loop is one of the best designs
Long depower line
Through the bar safety

If you decide to progress to the water, this would be the only bar you would need.

yeah how long is that bar though....that guys comments were

"I think all 08 and 09 naish bars were adjustable 19-21in bars. "

I think i need a long bar at lease 55cm to 60cm for it to turn better.

60cm =23" so i believe that bar puts you in the 55cm range, if my math is right...:duh: i was lookin at that bar also, but i think i'm gonna bite the bullet and just get a new PL bar.:Ange09: Good Luck, my first arc too...
you got a harness already...?

YEah we use a rock climbing harness for now, it works perfectly, but i am in the market for a used Ozone XC or another hybrid harness....

Syuzhak aptly pointed out the shortcomings of the older North bar I overlooked. But consider this:

1) Any time you swap out a depower rope that isn't stock, you will need to have some splicing skills or be able to use a lockstitch awl to get a loop for the qucik release below the bar above the chicken loop - a knot may not work there, but they usuallly use a knot up at the trim strap connection. This is a general statement - check out the bar you are looking to mod first. Learning the skills is a good thing if you are buying old gear and experimenting.

2) I you're going to mod the depower line, a bar that can use regular amsteel or another single braid instead of something like the funky urethane coated Cabrinha lines will be much easier to deal with ('cuz you can knot, sew, or splice the single braid easily)

3) You will have to adjust front line lengths with a longer depower line as syuzhak mentioned. But not such a big deal - leave all line lengths equal and make your adjustment with some pigtail extensions at the kite. Very easy.

4) Twisting of the safety is a big problem if you can't route it through the bar hole or attach it to a spinning ring above the chicken loop or a spinning hook spreader bar. My GII is on an older airrush bar with rear safety that slides through the bar end and clips to a spinning ring on the Airrush chicken loop or to a welded ring on my spinning Wichard shackle.

That Naish bar looks like a score if it comes with lines, plus it's 1:1 or 2:1 - would work for bows or SLE's. But get the length verified - big GII's I tried turned awfully slow, and I think a 19-21" bar is too short on 1:1 for that kite.

I'd asked this before on another thread, but I wonder if the shorter bar with the 2:1 pulley setup on the rears wouldn't work - you'd get 2x the movement at the kite for the same bar movement, which is what I think you'd like for an arc so you don't reach so far. But you'd also end up with 2x the bar pressure, which isn't good.

krumly

Well they guy already sent out the North bar, ill see what happens when I get it, if it doesn work out, then I will re-sell most likely.

trancein1 -

It'll work. First priority if you can manage it would be to get depower line set up for 15" throw. Then, with bar pulled in tight to chicken loop and the trim strap let fully out, the line connection points on the front and rear leaders should all be in a straight row. Add pigtails to rear bar leaders to make this happen, or add them at the kite to make the equivalent thing happen.

If you twist your lines and can't fly the twists out, you will have to unclip the leash, spin the bar, and re-clip.


krumly

Thx Krumly, how do you like your Guerilla ?