well, i am going to have a apex 3 7.5m on the way shortly, and my school was kind enough to put a bunch of money into my account so im looking into ATBs

im a newbie to this so i really dont know what to look for in a board, some suggestions and help would be much appreciated

is buying used a good idea?

Buying used isn't bad but I would be careful. Anyone on the good traders list shouldn't steer you wrong. I really like my Core 95 and my Core 90 is a pretty good board too. I would be pretty careful about boards on ebay. Most of the older ones are heavy but probably still ride good. Someone might show up with a good sale for you.

what about this one?

http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=18491

price is a little high for me but if i had to i could swing it, depends on what i should or shouldnt be looking for

nobody has any advise?

looks like a good board. I have no experience with them though. The trucks look better than the skate trucks on my Core 90. I wish I had riden one to tell for sure but if Phreerider has recommended it I would take that. Good Luck!

actually im staying away from that one, i was told the company is nolonger in business so parts are hard to come by

so, im back at square 1

The only parts that are hard to come by are the components for the trucks. And you will put in a lot of time on them before you have to worry about upgrading or replacing. Pretty much everything else is cross compatible with parts from other company.

Perfectly understandable if the concern still lingers and this is your first board.

There's another GI board up for grabs from Windzup if the budget is tight.

If neither of those suit, break out the local Craigslist listings and see if any MBS Comp or Pro models come up at a reasonable price.

ATB,
Sam

a word of advice... buy that conflict from windzup... do it quickly, and ride it hard... you wont find a better deal on a board. period.

i love my conflict, and iGI makes the best boards ive ridden... i havent ridden them all, but also dont feel i need to, gi has been great

even if its the older model, its still very solid

... enjoy

This is the board I learned on:
http://tinyurl.com/4xgkugh
$175 is a bit much for that one, I'd offer lower and see what he says. I found mine on Craigslist for less than $100

Just pull the brakes and the leash off it, and you'll be fine. I pulled the bindings off it when I first started out, then as I got comfy riding around, I put them back on. I was able to boost on it and the trucks/deck held up fine. I rode this board for about 2 years and I upgraded later because I wanted something lighter. It's got skate trucks which use the standard bushings you can find at any skate shop. Rims/tires/bears are readily available so you can replace/upgrade as needed.

Or if you want a new/more recent version, I think this one is comparable:
http://www.dakitez.com/servlet/the-562/MBS-Atom-90/Detail
and I think this one is the same, it just has a brake on it: http://www.dakitez.com/servlet/the-511/MBS-Atom-95x/Detail


edit: Oh yeah, That conflict for $200 is a sick deal. That's used to be a $400-$500 board. Only prob will be getting torsion cubes if you need to stiffen/loosen the trucks.

so lets say i pick up one of these GI boards, first of all which one would you go for and why? and secondly, if i get one and the trucks just fall apart on me, how much is it going to be to replace them?

im typically not a fan of buying things that i can not get parts for but if these are like a super fantastic deal im not going to just ignore them either

It might depend on how much you weigh and or how carve-able you want your board to be. I like my boards to turn quick, and for that reason I had to sell my Conflict; even the softest torsion cubes were still too stiff for my liking. I prefer skate trucks because they're are easily adjustable (just crank down on the kingpin), and easily found if I want to change their stiffness or replace them.

Looks like that Patrol has the white torsion cubes which are the stiffest torsion cube available. If you want a less-stiff truck, you'll have to find the softer torsion cubes. You should ask to see what torsion cubes the Conflict has.

Easy answer: I'd go for the Conflict because it's $100 cheaper & the deck has gobs of pop and is bombproof.

As far as the trucks falling apart, I'd say that'd highly unlikely given how burly their construction is.

If you ever need torsion cubes/parts, you could post a thread asking. Only GI parts-related thread I've seen recently is this thread: http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=18494

regarding breaking the trucks... i really dont think that under normal wear and tear that would happen, esp not if its an old model,.... i tried to dissassemble some older trucks once, and it withstood hammers and tire irons for about an hour...

... i never did get that thing off :/ ... really thats why i bought my conflict (trying to upgrade to the bionics), and i dont regret it a second

... seriously, that conflict sold for more than twice the amount hes asking... as burrito mentioned, they are a bit stiff, but thats why you dont hit speed wobble until youre well over 30 mph

what are anti-friction plates?

and idk, the more i read into these boards they sound good but i dont want to end up like that guy in the post begging for parts because they are nolonger produced

so who else produces boards that i should look into?

also, whats the difference between a stiff board and a loose board? like how do they effect the ride?

thanks for all the help guys

Quote:

Originally posted by burritobandit Looks like that Patrol has the white torsion cubes which are the stiffest torsion cube available. If you want a less-stiff truck, you'll have to find the softer torsion cubes. You should ask to see what torsion cubes the Conflict has.

I would confirm with Space Monkey. If you are using the the pics in the thread as a reference, I think what you are seeing is the resin cage for the cube. My understanding what that unless you opted for something different at the time of purchase Spring Bionics came with green eggs and Torsion Bionics came with HD3 or HD4 cubes (depending on year, they ranged from HD1 (Softest) to HD6/7 (Stiffest)).

With the Gen I cast Torsion Bionics, it was easier to see what the cube color was when it was installed.



With the Gen II resin hangers, the cube was more shrouded by the resin cage and you can't tell what color cube is installed unless you look at it from a 45° angle.



@Trbo323
It's close to impossible to describe how stout/over-engineered the Bionic Trucks are. The only way to truly appreciate it is to hold an unmounted one in your hand. There's definitely a "holy crap" moment involved. I am sure you could break them given the right circumstances/alignment of stars, but that would almost surely be accompanied by some really bad external mojo.

ATB,
Sam

From SpaceMonkey's thread:

Quote:

Ground Industries Patrol Mountainboard $300 Shipped anywhere in the continental US. This board is in nearly new condition. My friend bought it and rode it maybe 4 times. The trucks are GI Bionics with white torsion cubes.

ok, im not worried about the trucks then but what about other parts? tortion cubes and anti-friction plates?

so im seeing the patrol and the conflict up for grabs on here, which is better? conflict is $100 cheaper

I *think* the anti friction plates are that gold-colored component of the truck here: http://www.groundindustries.com/trucks (it's been a while since I've worked with one).

Servicing them: http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=11904


Other manufacturers: MBS, Scrub, Trampa

Stiff turning vs loose turning is your preference.
Loose turning = carve-y feeling + easier to turn, but susceptible to speed wobble at higher speeds
Stiff turning = can withstand higher speeds with no to minimal speed wobble, but is difficult to turn. You'd have to hop-turn to turn quicker.

Do you skateboard? If so, how do you like your trucks set?

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 what are anti-friction plates?

Anti-friction plates make them sound way more technical than they are. They are really thin adhesive (almost) stickers that are applied to two of the inner (front and back) surfaces of the resin cage that the torsion cube sits in. It's basically a consumable part that prevents wear to the resin cage. If push came to shove you could probably fabricate this part.... it's not rocket science.... the terminology just makes it seem that way.

The anti-friction plates are at 6:00 in the picture below:



They are about as thick as a sheet or two of paper.

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 and idk, the more i read into these boards they sound good but i dont want to end up like that guy in the post begging for parts because they are nolonger produced

B-Roc is the person looking for anti-friction plates. The lack of them doesn't make the board unrideable. Just some additional squeaking and (slow) wear on the cube cage. He has been riding his Flight board for a very, very long time.

Phree's take on it was:
"I HAVE RUN WITHOUT PLATES FOR some TIME NOW And really can't notice much. but i do run 6/7 cube # so its stiff with a little shake. king pins are still solid. i tried replacing once ...that was a zero.
just let em go. the cubes eventually tear and crumble inside roughly about 800-1000 hours. seemed tidy when they're good but no way could i keep up with the wear! "

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 so who else produces boards that i should look into?

MBS (Readily available from many sources), Trampa ($$$ for a first board), Scrub (better known in the UK, but still fairly available in the US). There are a handful of others.

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 also, whats the difference between a stiff board and a loose board? like how do they effect the ride?

I am assuming you mean stiff or loose trucks. Boards tends to be stiff or flexible. Stiff trucks mean less wobble at speed. Loose trucks mean a board that is easier to turn/"carve".

Hope that helps with the questions.

Do what you gotta do and spend your money how you see fit. Most of the demo gear from Windzup has thus far been in very good condition, so this could be a good deal for you. If the details/caveats exceeds your comfort zone, hold on to your money until you find something you are good with.

ATB,
Sam

i was looking at the MBS stuff and they just seem a little pricey for what they are, the Trampa stuff seems really nice but also really expensive, nothing against scrub but id rather avoid buying from over seas

the more im thinking about it the more im leaning towards the conflict that is $200, any cons to that besides parts? how hard is it to find torsion blocks for these?

Quote:

Originally posted by burritobandit From SpaceMonkey's thread: Quote: Ground Industries Patrol Mountainboard $300 Shipped anywhere in the continental US. This board is in nearly new condition. My friend bought it and rode it maybe 4 times. The trucks are GI Bionics with white torsion cubes.

Thanks for clarifying.... missed that. Guess I wasn't expecting someone to "spec" the cubes and then turn around the board so quickly. When you assume.... :embarrased:

ATB,
Sam

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 i was looking at the MBS stuff and they just seem a little pricey for what they are, the Trampa stuff seems really nice but also really expensive, nothing against scrub but id rather avoid buying from over seas

Scrub doesn't necessarily mean overseas shipping. They have a distribution channel in the US too.
There are a fair number of Scrub deailers in the US. Some PKF dealers that carry Scrub are:
Angus at Coastalwindsports.com
Dino at Dakitez.com
Don at Powerkiteplace.com
Rian at EastCoastKitesports.com

Quote:

Originally posted by Trbo323 the more im thinking about it the more im leaning towards the conflict that is $200, any cons to that besides parts? how hard is it to find torsion blocks for these?

Torsion blocks are getting harder and harder to find through retail channels. They come up every once in awhile on B/S/T sections of various forums.

Brand new, GI boards were as expensive as MBS.

Big question is... do you think you will be able to get $200 worth of giggles and screams before you have to look at replacing/upgrading stuff.

FWIW: Sticker shock was probably the reason people were recommending a used/demo board for your first go around.

ATB,
Sam

well im thinking a $300 cap on a first board would be a decent place to start, if i can find a great used one at $200 then thats fantastic, if its not that great then ill just keep looking. id rather find something that will last and not fall apart under my feet than something just for a few times out that i will grow bored of quickly

Ill go check out those sites but im still feeling like i can get a better board if i go used

how is a wood deck compared to a composite or carbon fiber?

do they hold up alright? do they ride different? im seeing lots of different deck materials and dont really know how they stack up against one another

Some landboards listed at the bottom of the list:

http://kitesurfdallas.com/G_f_S_Frame.htm

anyone have any experience/opinions on the MBS core 95?

The top right corner: http://kitesurfdallas.com/

Yes, as Sam stated, I am the guy who was looking for the anti-friction plates and it took me 2 years to find some (from a fellow forum member here). I have been riding one board since April of 2006 and the plates are still useable but there is more play in them then there once was. The softer your cubes, the quicker you wear them down. The more you ride and carve, the quicker you wear them down. But its relative. I can still ride my 2006 pair no problemo I just wanted to tighten them up.

I have a new pair of bionics that came with one fouled friction plate (adhesive only on the center not on the ends / tips. I fixed it myself with dual-sided adhesive but that is less stiff then the factory backed glue and created some wobble. It is actually that truck that I was most interested in fixing, not the older pair. The older pair I wanted to tighten up. The newer pair I wanted to fix so both trucks had equal play (one was tight, the other had a lot of play). All is good now with the newer plates.

still looking for opinions on these two boards

the patrol and the conflict up for grabs on here, which is better? conflict is $100 cheaper, is a patrol going to be worth a extra $100?

from what iv been told the two big differences are the deck material and the hubs, im assuming the aluminum hubs are better but im not sure which deck is better

I ride GI and I would chose the conflict over the patrol. I am unhappy that the company isn't doing well, but it's not preventing me from recommending the product that's done so great for me for years!

The #1 key in buying a deck (in my opinion) is STANCE WIDTH. Find out how wide your stance is and find a board that will accept that. I love my prodigy90 deck but it's just too small of a stance for my taste, so I ride my AK103 all the time. Do you know your stance width? jump up in the air a bit and land with your feet about shoulder width apart, whatever is comfortable for you. How far apart are your feet? Do this several times, taking measurements each time. Whatever your average distance is, that's a good stance width measurement to work with.

Quote:

Originally posted by erratic winds The #1 key in buying a deck (in my opinion) is STANCE WIDTH. Find out how wide your stance is and find a board that will accept that. I love my prodigy90 deck but it's just too small of a stance for my taste, so I ride my AK103 all the time. Do you know your stance width? jump up in the air a bit and land with your feet about shoulder width apart, whatever is comfortable for you. How far apart are your feet? Do this several times, taking measurements each time. Whatever your average distance is, that's a good stance width measurement to work with.

COOl info/tip there..

If you just want something cheap to start out on or practice with; do a google search for "SDS Mountain Board". Less then $100 new(be sure it's the new version with foot straps).

http://www.sdsskateboards.com/completesmountain.htm

Or if you want the best money can buy; Trampa all day:


http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=19640