I've flown crossfires some and every time ive flown one, its not the greatest experience. Are crossfires normally hard to get off the ground? Do they usually move slower than other kites (the bigger ones)? I know they give you a good verticle jump with a slow let down but every time ive flown one, it flew like a junk. Are there different techniques to jumping with a crossfire than other kites?

ExLax

Hey ExLax,

Crossfire are not hard to get off the ground. Which knot do you use for your brake lines on the bridle?

They are definitely fast kites (way faster and more powerful than our Beamer).

If yours does not fly well, I would seek help from fellow flyers or contact the store you bought it from.

You can also contact me with questions:
t.baxmeyer@hq-kites-usa.com

Cheers
Tim

HQ-Powerkites USA

I've heard that they are great in the buggy. I'm thinking of trying one out...

Exlax,

I've got a Crossfire 6.3m and I'm not quite sure why you're experiencing those problems. Mine flies perfectly fine on handles. On a bar it turns a bit slower, but that's to be expected as any kite will do that. It still flies really well and has the same amount of lift regardless of what I use to control it though. In 4mph winds the kite gives me enough pull, at a whopping 180lbs., to board and buggy..anything more I can get a few jumps in as well. In less then 4mph and if the wind is at all dirty, the kite tends to luff and occassionally overfly as well..which can happen with other kites as well. Some tend to be a bit more forgiving in that feature.

If you friends tampered with the bridal lines then you may be experiencing a similar experience to mine stated below. Otherwise, I'd try what Tim stated about placing changing the attachment of the brake lines and the power lines. Maybe try tightening the line to the power bridal and loosening the brake line up a bit more. Don't do drastic changes as the Crossfire does tend to like more brake input then some other kites, but possibly less then what you've been flying. I've read other reviews on other forums and could see how someone could easily think to keep the brake lines tense due to the numerous comments about how the Crossfire reacts better with more brake input. Some of that input isn't just by the inital line setup though...some of what they're talking about is while flying applying brake in the actual turn. For instance, when you turn the kite, you pull typically in the direction of the turn. In applying brake you tend to pivot the kite in the air, rather then turn the kite. So one handle would be in the normal position, while the other handle is in a brake position, causing the kite to pivot somewhat. Hope that explains it a bit better. Of course this is only performed with handles and not a bar.
When you fly the Crossfire with a normal 4 line bar (not depower bar), you have brake line adjustments that can be made on the actual bar to apply some brake in turns. If you're flying this way, you need to check out the details on your bar setup based on the manufacturer of the bar. Most work the same, however, some are setup slightly differently.

The only time I've had trouble getting mine off the ground is when I attempted the wing warp mod which didn't quite work..the error isn't in the system, but I apparently didn't know what I was doing.. in that case the kite pretty much parked itself on the ground and wouldn't take off. The reason for this was that the same amount of line length was on the brakes as there was on the power lines..causing it to pretty much park itself in neutral on the ground. It still filled up with air like it was going to take off..just didn't. This would've happened with any kite too...not just the Crossfire.

Overall it sounds like it could be multiple things you're experiencing with the kites you're flying. I'm guessing you haven't bought one..so it may be the setup that your friend, or whomever owns the kites you are flying did with the kite. I'd definitely check the bridal, how the brake lines are connected, on what knot the lines are fixed to the bridal for the powerlines and the same for the brake lines, check the bar settings if it's on a bar, etc.

For more info on my experiences with the kite..check out my review in this section of the forum. Overall I love the kite..yeah, I had a few frustrations initially, but I've found that flying a different kite is a new experience with each individual kite. They all have different characteristics, but once you figure'm out you're having fun. Hope you have better experiences in the future with them..as they really are excellent kites.

~Joe

hey exlax i have a 7.7 and i think theres something wrong also so i got measurements from hq on bridal checked them out and seem to be fine i bought an 6.3 to see how that is it seems to do same thing almost like a crease in middle of kite 6.3 same thing and hard to get inflated and off ground not like the beemers i own i heard its a great kite if u find out what your doing wrong please let me know at least im not only one i thought i was doin something wrong

steve

Steve,
I've had a similar instance to what you're talking about where the kite doesn't seem to fill completely. The settings on the kite are fine..you may want to re-adjust your line connection points, however, I found that a lot of the problem was due to location and types of wind. Crossfires tend to be rather picky about being in clean winds. If there are any obstructions, like trees or buildings nearby then the kite tends to find that relatively quickly and act kinda goofy by doing similar things to what you described. Even had a few times where the kite folded in half like a bow tie then came down. A lot of this is due to wind conditions.

Your best bet is to find an area with steady clean winds nearby (free of any obstructions that may mess with the winds) and see if you get the same result or readjust your line settings as mentioned earlier if this should happen. I know I spent a good half hour when I bought mine just playing with the line settings to get things right. Then when I switched over to using a bar, I had to do that all over again. Once you figure it out, switching between controls isn't nearly as time consuming. Just takes time figuring out the line settings.

If you still have problems with the kite after trying the above, I would recommend contacting Tim at HQ (who posted eariler in this thread) about the problem. If these are relatively new kites, they may ask you to send them back to see if they can remedy the problem for you. They have an excellent customer service in that respect and attempt to resolve any problems people have with their kites, accessories, etc. to keep their customers happy and coming back for more kites.

~Joe

hi ya mate.. ive recently brought the 4mtr xfire and find it a great kite it flies in bearly no wind at all still with pull ascode was saying if the winds a lil off or if ur close to buildings it will find it out quite quickly.
mine bow ties sumtimes but in the right wind its a great kite my mate flies a 3.6 beamer and he tried mine and was shocked by the pull.. hope u sort the problem out mate..
stay safe

Hey Guys-
I would have to agree with code .
I fly Xfire 3.2 and 5.0. I accually have more "trouble" with the 3.2,( if you want to call it trouble)...It is normally due to bad wind, and may over-fly,or luff in this situation.

All in all, these are really good kites, and FAST!!!!

But Tim is a GREAT guy, and will help you in any way possible...

hey everyone

tried all advice on both the 6.3and7.7 still no luck tim sent measurements seem to be okay something is wrong i dont know what it is bought kite at cobra kites they said send it back so they can check it out i hate to do that it could just be my skills fairly new to foils not to quad flyin or kites in general man i wish i could get them to fly right i here so many good things about them and both cost me 1000 dollars im gonna try once more this sat ill let u know how it goes if any body else has advice let me know wind is pretty clean here on beach in florida beach is 600 feet deep and miles long wint breese commin off water

Newbie here, haven't even purchased my foil yet, just doing my research. From what I had read, I was leaning towards a Beemer, but my local shop suggested a Crossfire 4.0 as a better option. Is it to much to learn on? Is it forgiving enough for my first 4 line kite? I plan to fly it on my feet and occasionally from a buggy. Will it provide to much pull, or not enough pull for a guy weighing 240lbs? Thoughts and suggestions please.

Hmmm, odd recommendation, I think. As you can see above, the crossfires can be twitchy. Mine is fine on the beach in smooth winds but inland in lumpy winds can snap shut like mousetrap and fall like laundry. Some of it maybe a matter of practice for me with the kite but most agree it is a little picker about winds. It would be a shame for a beginner to get frustrated with such a kite and wrongly think it was him/ her.

Beamer is a great choice. If they recommended the Crossfire because you want something witha little more oomph than a Beamer, consider the Peter Lynn Reactor. Great Buggy engine, faster, low lift high pull kite that is smooth and steady and good in a variety of winds. Priced well for the performance, too. 3.8 meter would be a good choice.

I flew my Reactor 4.9 against a Beamer 5.0 the other day, each of us in buggies, me way heavier. As the wind started to die, I drove back to the starting point, the guy withe the Beamer walked. No harder to fly, either.

Drew... I would not recommend the crossfire to some that has never flown a 4line kite before. First of all you're going to find it overly frustrating due to how it's not as forgiving as the beamer series. Similar to was Angus was saying. Secondly, I would never recommend a lifty kite to someone just starting out. It's frustrating enough worrying about how the lines go, how to brake, how to turn, how to fly, how to use kite killers, how to ride a buggy with a kite, etc. and then you're going to add how to not get lifted when you don't want to be lifted and how to be lifted when you do want to be lifted into the scenerio.

Start off with a Beamer III 4.0 or 5.0 and learn how to fly with less frustration, less to worry about, forgiving kite and loads of power for scuddling, buggying and other traction sports. You can even get lifted on them as well, but it takes a bit more wind and a bit more working the kite to do..which is nice if you don't want to hurt yourself too bad while learning.

~Joe

Angus and Joe, (Pablo, too)
Thanks so much for your advice, very helpful. The kiting community is great, everyone willing to help and share, thanks.
OK, so it's a Beamer III or a PL Reactor. What should I expect to pay? I have read the lines are sub-par on the Beamer. True? Should I have them changed? Does the 5.0 pull harder than the 4.0? What line length should I use?
Angus, is it the design of the Reactor that allowed you to drive back as your buddy walked with the Beamer? The Reactor is easier to tack in a buggy? You recommend the 3.8, would that end up as a high wind kite as my skills improve?
Thanks again for your help.

New Beamer III lines are good quality colored lines with sewn loops. Nice. Stock line length of 25m (85') is pretty average.

Beamer 4.0 about $256, 3.0 about $218
Reactor 3.8 about $321 and 2.9 about $301

Sure the 5.0 will pull more thatn the 4.0 in the same wind.

Reactor is just as easy, not easier to tack (jibe) than the Beamer.
Reactor is slightly higher aspect ratio at 3.8 vs. 3.4 and more elliptical planform, which helps. Reactor has 2 center cells closed and more tip cells closed, which help hold shape in turns, improving handling, I think. To be fair, in my example it was a Beamer II, and the new III's are further refined but I have not put it head to head with another kite the same way.

You are right- any mid-sized kite like 3-4 m will end up as a higher wind kite as you get more experience/ balls. You will not get bored of either in enough wind.

Ditto what Angus said "any mid-sized kite like 3-4 m will end up as a higher wind kite as you get more experience/ balls".

I can't stress that enough when someone new starts kiting. They always think that the smaller the kite, the faster they'll outgrow it and end up selling it. Not true. There are people on here that have been kiting for many years and still have their first small 3-5m kites for the simple fact that if the winds are kicking, they would be completely insane to go out with a larger kite. I've even seen people sell their smaller kites thinking they won't need them, only to end up buying new ones later when they realize they can't go out because everything they've got is too big to fly in the high winds. You're not going to loose money on your first purchase.

Trust me, once you get your kite, and then get comfortable enough to take it out in higher winds you'll come back on here stressing the fact that we're saying to you. Everyone on here I'm sure has been owned by their little kites at some point or another. I got worked hard by my 4.5m little devil (dragged 50' face first through a foot of snow with a snowboard strapped to my feet. the kite stopped and the snowboard had dug clear down to the grass while I was dragged), and got worked even harder by my 5m TSR. When I orginially started kiting I had a 5m Quadrifoil, got my arse worked over hard multiple times..mostly due to the fact that there weren't forums like this for people to ask these kinds of questions of.

Also, like Angus said, a 5m will pull harder then a 4m will in the same wind. I'd like to add though...if you get experienced enough and no how to work the kite, you may end up doing stuff on a smaller kite that people that don't fly as often can't pull off on a larger. It's a lot of learning, practicing and experience that helps you be able to figure out how to use the kite to your advantage.

You'll figure it out and be addicted just like the rest of us.
~Joe

Joe,
I have no doubt I will be addicted. I am afraid to visit a kite shop, I always find something I "need".
I have been into 2 line kites for several years. Currently own:
Beetle
Premier Stingray
Premier Addiction
New Tech Ignitor
Prism Nexus
Prism Mirage
Cheetah
Plus several single line delta kites with all the line laundry, then there is the wind socks and flags, I am an admitted geek about this stuff.
So, I have no doubt that I will add several 4 line kites to the collection in a relatively short period of time. Funny thing is, I dont have that much time to fly, probably 10 times per year is all. Hope that goes up when I get into the 4 line stuff with a buggy.
My plan is to buy one of the following this week, PDK Buster, HQ Beamer, Ozone Samurai or a Peter Lynn Reactor, looking at 3-4m size. I have gotten lots of advice from experienced flyers and am comfortable with any of the above as a good starter 4 line kite. It will come down to looks, quality of lines and price, in that order.
Here comes trouble!!!