Hello everyone!
I've owned my Prism Snapshot 2.5 for awhile now. It's been a good kite but it seems like it takes a good bit of wind to keep it interesting. My brother and I weigh 195lb and 230lb and are fairly athletic so while it's a lot of fun to zip it around, the winds have to be unusually high for it to drag us at all. I'm looking to get something with more power so I can use it for some good scudding and maybe some jumps.

I've been looking at the HQ Toxic, PL Twister, and Prism Tensor. I'm not sure which one would be best suited for my weight(195lb) and the winds we have available (Typically 6-15mph on the beach). I don't have enough experience with the larger kites yet to know whether ~4m or ~5m would be more ideal either.

Any insight or suggestions would be more then welcome. I'd say $400 is my budget cap.

ive got some stuff that fits in that category. give me a lookup.

4line 3m first then go from there....imo

abkayak, I'm not sure how much crossover "understanding" there is, but I'm also a skydiver with a couple hundred jumps and our parachutes are essentially 4-line kites. The exception being that we typically steer with the break lines. Is there a significant difference in pull between the 3 and 4 meters? And if I were to decide to get a 3m which one would you suggest for the most pull/fun?

everyone needs 3m kites...you will have it in the air more often then your next logical size 5...which will also pbly be too small for you guys to jump with (which is a good time off) but it will teach you proper kite control and always have a spot in your quiver....skydiving is great and you couldn't get me to do it..but you arent just going in reverse now...you have to truly get a feel for things to go up and then safely come back down...3-4m is only different that one time when you shouldn't have throw 4m in the air when 3 would have been just fine :D...do this properly and you will be doing it for life. go too quick and injuries or just getting turned off to the sport can happen....i am biased to 3m kites and admit to that
but long range its easy to go 3,5,7 and then see what happens.....just my opinion

Welcome aboard

Here is a link to a picture of my old 2.5 snapshot and a proper 3 meter power kite just so you have a frame of reference. They size stunt foils differently.

Link

thats a pretty good link to keep around...puts things in proper perspective..minus the wind

I think so to. My second kite was a big surprise after the snap shot.

That's really remarkable. Is it that the Snapshot size is based on wingspan, and the Beamer on area?

Bahaha, that picture does put things into perspective. So I suppose the question now is... 3m or 4m. I know a 3m would be a great addition for the long run, I just don't want to end up bored with the milder summer winds. This will be the only kite I'll be buying for quite awhile due to my budget, and I'd like something that'll pull 200lb me around a bit.

Have a look at the for sale section. There are a couple of jojo rm kites for sale 2,4,5 meter. Never flown one but from YouTube they look to be quite nice.

Edit: after a tiny bit of research, the jojo's look to be a high ar kite which means they are fast and not considered a beginners kite. Just a word of caution, someone with more knowledge on them would have to chime in.

The Jojo RM+ kites mentioned for sale here on PKF are not exactly newbie friendly kites...not good for punchy up and down inland winds...


Better learning kites...... more stable kites....are available. Wait it out and ask more questions later.

I shouldn't have to worry to much about inland winds. We'll be doing all of the flying at the beach. I'm currently looking at the 4m Twister but any 3m recommendations are also welcome.

I have a 5 meter Tensor that I am willing to part with for a very fair price. It is the kite that I learned to scud on. You don't want to attempt jumping with a kite for a while, trust me. You will get hurt. I have tweaked my ankles and gotten the wind knocked out of me several times and I am a very experienced pilot. Beach winds are perfect and what you should fly in if you have available for you. Make sure that you only fly in onshore or sideshore winds though, don't bother flying winds that come from the land and flow out to the water. That is dangerous with a power kite.

I spent the evening looking more into jumping and I can see why it's not recommended off the bat, so I'll put that off for the future so I can built some experience. I suppose just some good power for scudding would be more then enough fun in the meantime. Will any of the 3m's do the trick? And Demoknight, what would you consider a fair price? I could always put one away for down the line.

tensor would be great next one, good price sure grab it now...put it up in 10mph or less clean wind and you will be fine
i want to say any 3 will do...some kick ass more then others so their is that...you'll be fine with any quality reputation company...stay w/in your budget and youve done better than any of us

Quote: Originally posted by Randy

That's really remarkable. Is it that the Snapshot size is based on wingspan, and the Beamer on area?

Sanphot is based on Sport Kite sizing.. Read Here

FIRST, Forget about jumping with anything smaller than a 5M kite and I'd say an 8M gives enough float to have at least a little margin of safety. I'm not a Kite jumper but It's far different than skydiving. It's the part of our sport that looks like a lot of fun without the danger looking nearly as obvious. You want an intermediate size to really learn the power BEFORE you start activities prone to allow visual inspection of your femur.

That being said, I'm going to go against common wisdom here and recommend a 4M Toxic for you.. I actually traded my 2.5 Snapshot for a 4M Crossfire (Toxic's Predecessor)to a friend that had purchased more kite than he could handle. Keep in mind a 4M is a lot of power you're not used to and you have to respect it. There's no way I'll part with my 4M. Start in very low winds; give it the respect it deserves, and you will be fine..

Here's Chris from HQ Scudding with my Crossfire..



http://youtu.be/feJBAfaDekw

Solid advice from riffclown, but if I had to do it all over again, I would have gotten a 5.5 twister as my second kite instead of a 4 meter twister. The 4 meter twister (or other mid aspect 4 meter) is the perfect size for scudding but just teases you to try and jump with it. It WILL lift you know problem, but it will not bring you down softly if not flown expertly. The 5 meter size is adequate to learn some small jumps when the time is right, but you sacrifice being able to fly it and learn on higher wind days. I suspect the 5 meter tensor would be a good kite if you don't disrespect it. Again, can't go wrong with having a 3 meter in the bag.

Edit, all the above mentioned kites will blow your mind compared to the snapshot

You guys have me torn. I could always trade my snapshot in for a 3m and buy a used 5.5. Or should I get a 4m or 3m. Also why do you suggest the toxic over the twister riffclown?

I suppose the important question is... Do you guys think I'll ever use my Snapshot 2.5 again if I had a 3m?

no, unless you have kids or family you want to introduce to kiting

Quote: Originally posted by Supruku

You guys have me torn. I could always trade my snapshot in for a 3m and buy a used 5.5. Or should I get a 4m or 3m. Also why do you suggest the toxic over the twister riffclown? I suppose the important question is... Do you guys think I'll ever use my Snapshot 2.5 again if I had a 3m?

Because I have flown Toxics and their immediate predecessor in the HQ line the Crossfire II's.. I'm sure the twister is a great kite and I've only heard good about it but I refrain from recommending kites I haven't flown at least a few sizes of..
Also, I'm pretty partial to the HQ Brand.. I like the looks and durability of their foils..

As for flying the Snapshot, There will be days when there's too much wind for larger kites. Keep in mind the Snapshot is more like a 1.8 or 1.9 square meter kite.. Sport sizes throw a lot of people off. A true 3M kite will yank you around in wind that the Snapshot would have you smiling. Please take a few minutes and read my post about "before you ask... It's linked in the post above and in my signature.. You'll see that I didn't make the recommendation for a 4m lightly.. Given your stated experience and skydiving experience, I think you are ready for a 4M.. Again, My personal experience when I first got into the power kiting side of flying was trading the 2.5 snapshot for the 4M Crossfire.

I would actually recommend a Twister over the Toxic. I have owned both and can tell you that the Twister is a much more stable kite. Toxics are good kites, but they have a higher Aspect Ratio (AR of 4.5 I think) and I found the one that I had was very unstable and didn't do to well in my unstable wind and vice versa with the Twister. Conversely the Twister has a mid-range AR (around 3.65??? maybe) and you'll find that kites with mid range AR have a tendency to be much more stable than higher AR kites.

Both are lifty but I think that Twister is more beginner friendly but by NO means is it not an absolutely killer kite... LOTSA love for Twister... a power house for sure!!!

Well I considered everything, and in the end took a leap and decided on the 4m Twister. I ordered it from BigMikesKites and it got here extremely quick. I've flown it twice now and think I made the right purchase. It's definitely got a ton of power compared to the snapshot but at no point did it feel out of control or unmanageable for me or my brother. We're already able to scud around on the beach, reverse launch, and turn the thing on a dime. My girlfriend who has a little 1.5m speed/stunt foil is now planning on ordering a 4-line tonight after watching what this one is capable of, so it looks like we'll have a 2-3m kite in the family soon as well We just have to figure out what size is right for her, haha. I'm thinking a 2m due to her 125lb weight.

Thanks for all the help!