Im looking at making somewhat of a dream quiver aka starting over. For those who don't know me, I ride hard and go big. Mostly on the mountainboard, but sometimes in the water. Currently, I'm thinking 21m speed 3 and 15, 12, and 10 chargers. Thoughts?

Can only speak for the 15 charger2 and I love that kite- it has replaced my old 13m venom II as my go to kite. It is a fast turner and has a lot of grunt with decent boost factor (:D inside joke) only flew a speed 3 21m once and nothing beats it for low wind or float. that I have tried. Fellow member of the 1920 club
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Also, looking for gaps, I'm assuming a 10m arc would get me up to as much wind as I'd want to fly in. Would the 21speed to the 15 arc be a good initial step?

21m speed, PA about 17m. Charger 15m PA about 9-10m.

Kind of a stretch. Hard to say not knowing your conditions.

I'm sorry, I've been out of things for a while: PA? I can't seem to find the forum dictionary currently. There was a thread long ago

I believe that would be Projected Area.

speeds 4 has more lift than the charger. but the charger might be more stable. have you ever tried the smaller speeds 12 and 15m thyre awesome kites.

ikemiester, how much do you weigh?
At my 200 lbs. Flysurfer discouraged me from getting the 21m size. It's supposed to be big guy's kite.

I'm here for the hang time:evil: and want to be going whenever possible. Can anyone else speak to the 21m debate? As far as the smaller speeds go, I just love arcs too much to go in that direction. Feyd, would you say to get another arc in between?

And conditions back home normally sit in the 10-12 mph range. A 19m Syn that I once had got me going in nearly everything, but I'm thinking the speed would handle the lower range then once the winds pick up I could switch to a faster turning 15 charger (I've heard there's not much difference between the 2 in power with a slight edge to the Syn)... thoughts?

the chargers will go in high wind without complaint , my 15 CH would go 25-30mph and be ridiculuos boosting on the water. my 15m FS seems endless float in lighter air. 15m would be ample choice for FS esp. if 10- 20mph stuff, a 19m charger 2 would go in more wind comfortably than FS

a 21m FS! dude no way put the $ into something else thats a NO vote

unless you're really light ,like <125 in 35mph+ 10m arc will not see much use. mine never come out of the bag. thats a NO vote

the conditions? you see most what help esp. the big days ...and your weight?

I'm just under 200lbs. So, I'm thinking 19m FS, 15 and 12 arc then? I'm not looking for a one kite quiver out of the FS, although what SKD does with his is rather impressive.

Conditions at sunset are often right around 10, but will go up to 25 often enough, especially at certain times of year. I'd like to be prepared for 30-35.

Also, does everyone think a 21 is not for me?

Well. My take on quiver is - having one lightwind kite (riding in 6 knots or so), having a regular size kite (above lightwind and up to some decent whitecaps) and having a small high-wind kite (20-35 knots). I ride efficiently and use door board and long lines for lightwind and use them with my regular size often. I admire ARCs design/features and have had them for years, more like collectibles though but take them out occasionally if a launch spot is decent.

I'm with Phree and Grigorib on the 21m. Builds apparent wind in near nothing but lacks the nimbleness to be really effective. I raced a 21m with Molly's 19m Psycho 4DLX and smoked the 21m with a rider 40lbs light than me. As soon as he had to turn the thing lost apparent and fell out of the sky.

He sold his 21m 3 days later. And now rides a Speed 4 lotus 15m in pretty much the same conditions and loves it.

He's also one of the best riders I know. Good at getting everything he can out of a kite. The 21m is just a bit of a pig.

I personally have ridden on Sunset beach with about 3-4 mph wind with a 19m S2 deluxe. That was just cruising though, but I was one of the very few able to ride. Bladerunner bought a 19m after that day. I don't know that you need to get a 21m. I would think your style would be more suited to a 19m or 15m as I think they are more nimble. I will be in seaside next month if you are interested.

I personally have a 19m Speed 3 Deluxe and a 12m Charger 2. I can honestly say that I am very close to a two kite quiver. The wind range on the 19m is completely bonkers for such a large kite. I still find a little overlap between the two kites as I don't have to put the Speed down until the wind is getting up and over 20mph. The 12m Charger 2 is rideable in anything over 10-12 mph and jumping becomes fun with the CH2 in anything between 15-30 mph. The other guys have more experience with landboarding than me, but I would consider myself intermediate/advance buggier and my only complaint about my quiver is that I don't have a kite to fly in the crazy 30mph+ days I get so often in Chicago. The only thing I feel I could add to my quiver is a 4-6m Ozone Access for those high wind/high gust factor days. I got to fly a 2015 13m Access the other day in some punchy 10-20+mph inland stuff and I have to say it was a complete champ. I want one of the little guys even more now.

sounds very to my situation here weight and conditions.

15m FS just dethroned my 12m FS but could easily use either for mostly for land and some water rides. FS are just more sensitive than Chargers in light.

i've had a mountain of time on both FS/ARCs/tubes . the arcs have the range and quickness even ok for light air sessions on land, a 15m being choice. FS have the early firing and really boom effortlessly in 10-12ish. 10-15mph is most of my land board riding and do so with 15m FS at an addictive pace...and up to 20 if thats the case, but old bones tell me to get on the water at that time.

12m tube is truly the central kite for me on the water(15-25mph). 9m tube for howler sessions. 8m for gut check sessions

12m ch2 for the water (at #200), you will want ALL of 30+ conditions! i rarely used it , and just few sessions on land. very quick just took a gale to super boost on it. i would pass on it.


having multiple kites for land, really isn't the case from my experience (atb). one (kite) that delivers earlier enough to have fun, boost in light <15mph and can be handled in 20 ...and,AND feels totally part of you in the sweet spot. anything else usually = frustration or injury.

after a mountain of kites and mountain range of time kiting, heres some basic thoughts that i KNOW and have experienced... one kite for land!thats it! love it and know it COMPLETELY! and basically 2 kites for water. thats as simple and safe as it can be made for similar conditions and weight for ATB , TT combined. all are used for both water and land and this delivers 1500+hrs /year of kiting , overlap and differences just make you sharper and more skilled. selecting which kite, arc/FS, really a matter of style and taste. BOTH kites are deeply skill enhancing and makes tubes effortless to ride. which i think you already know all this... just adding lurker content.

an element thats hard to convey is skill needed to get ALL of a FS/ARC...just takes time even for an advanced kiter----> one kite quiver is in the kiter NOT the kite.

you have skill/knowledge to know the difference, you just need TIME to make that choice EVERYTHING you need.

Wow! These have been such great responses! I think I'm gonna be looking for a 19m Speed with my tax return:D. From when I had the 19m Syn, and what I've heard of 12m ARCs, I think a 15m ARC is right for me. Perhaps I'll add on a 12m later on. The one kite for land is very true though with respect to the kiter. I flew the crap out of my 12m frenzy when I had it, and then my 19m Syn. Never really put anything else up aside from a handful of days on my 10.5 Flexi Ion2(<-absolutely killer land and water kite... SO much pop).

I weigh between 200 and 215 and the 19m Speed 3 Deluxe has a huge wind range in spite of its size. The best part is you can find those for sale frequently lately for around a grand, which is a great deal for so much kite.

Quote: Originally posted by ikemiester

looking for a 19m Speed with my tax return:D.

It's in, hold your horses