I need some advice on the purchase of a power kite. I have used a pk twice before (HQ symphony pro 1.8), loved it, and now wan to get my own.

I am open to alternate suggestions but am currently tossed up between the HQ Symphony Pro 2.5 and the Prism Snapshot 2.5. I am looking at the HQ because I am familiar with their performance. I'm looking at the Prism because, from what I've researched, It pulls hard and is 4-line ready.

Which do you like and why? Should I be looking at something else?

Here are my answers to riffclowns questions:

Where are you? GA - not the coast, though I visit semiannually
Where do you fly? (or want to) Anywhere I can! Beach on vaca, locally on windier days.
What kiting experience do you already have? See above...
What aspect of powerkiting are you interested in? Too much of a newb to know but I love the pull!
What are your local winds like? I'm not great at quantifying wind speed but my area is not typically especially windy, though it has it moments. Certainly not like the coast.
How much do you weigh? 225#
What kind of budget are you looking at? Under $200

Thanks in advance for the input!

I think you should go for a 2m 4 line powerkite. ie: Zebra Z1, Ozone Imp/Flow/Octane, HQ Beamer, PL Hornet, PKD Buster, Flexifoil Sting/Rage. There's probably a few I've missed. I have the Snapshot 1.4 - great little kite but a pia if you crash it upside down. Once I got a 1.5m Ozone Imp, I never really flew the Snapshot again and I still occasionally buggy with the 1.5m Imp when the winds start hitting 25 knots. 4 lines might take you an extra 30 minutes to get the hang of, but then you can launch it from upside down and you have FAR more control than a 2 line. Anything in the 1.5m - 2m will be a blast.

Kitepower (Aus) have listed a DP Power 2.5m for $100 new here: http://www.extremekites.com.au/topic/16104-april-clearout/#c... You couldn't go far wrong there. Keep your eyes in the For Sale section for something s/h too.

First!!! Welcome to PKF!!! I've flown both the Symphony 2.5 and the the Snapshot 2.5. I owned the Prism for a while.. For just sport kiting (static flying) both are good choices. You are correct the Prism Snapshot 2.5 is four line ready but it doesn't include the second set of lines or the handles.So you will likely bust your $200 price point getting it to four lines. . The Symphony can also be easily converted to 4 lines but again the expense of the lines and handles comes into play as well as the conversion itself.. . If you are looking to specifically go to a 4 line adventure then Something like a Skydog Powerkites is a good fun kite that's 4 line, "stuntable", well made and complete RTF. I've flown the 1.8 and if I didn't already have something so close to it, I would have bought it on the spot. The 1.8 is roughly the same size as the Symphony 2.2 if not slightly bigger..

Keep in mind the differences between Powerkites and Sport kites.

1st thing to know is that no single kite will do it all.

From what you describe I have a strong feeling that to you want to feel and use the Power from a power kite? Something that you use to get pulled down wind in the sand and such.

You should consider a kite that will allow you to progress from static flying to using the kite as an engine to pull you. You will likely want to move up to one if you buy the kites you suggest.

I suggest you look for a Quality made kite like John suggests. You can almost do it if you shop used.

The tried and true method of progressing is to start with a good 4 line low lift kite around 3m ( that is at 225lbs. ) .
3m is sort of a sweet size. Small, light and fast enough that you can force it to fly in some pretty low winds. Big enough to serve up some raw power as the wind picks up. At 3m kites act more like big kites and less like bumble bees. Small enough to become your high wind kite as you get to master it. Big enough to make you gulp when you 1st look at it!!!

Shop forums like this one for used gear 1st. Ebay and Craigs list etc. can be iffy. I suggest you run your choice through this forum before committing on those sites. AVOID IMPULSE BUYING !!!!!!!!!!

Quote: Originally posted by Bladerunner

1st thing to know is that no single kite will do it all. From what you describe I have a strong feeling that to you want to feel and use the Power from a power kite? Something that you use to get pulled down wind in the sand and such. You should consider a kite that will allow you to progress from static flying to using the kite as an engine to pull you. You will likely want to move up to one if you buy the kites you suggest. I suggest you look for a Quality made kite like John suggests. You can almost do it if you shop used. The tried and true method of progressing is to start with a good 4 line low lift kite around 3m ( that is at 225lbs. ) . 3m is sort of a sweet size. Small, light and fast enough that you can force it to fly in some pretty low winds. Big enough to serve up some raw power as the wind picks up. At 3m kites act more like big kites and less like bumble bees. Small enough to become your high wind kite as you get to master it. Big enough to make you gulp when you 1st look at it!!! Shop forums like this one for used gear 1st. Ebay and Craigs list etc. can be iffy. I suggest you run your choice through this forum before committing on those sites. AVOID IMPULSE BUYING !!!!!!!!!!

All fine points made by folks with years in the sport. You'd do well to listen to them. One suggestion would be to place a thread in PKF's WANTED section noting you are looking for a used four line power kite in the 3m-ish range and see if anybody wants to unload anything. These kites can be hard to come by on the used market here on this forum since a good kite (like the one you ought to be looking for) is seldom parted with for reasons already well stated.

Good luck! And welcome to the addiction. I have no idea by what is meant by "no one kite will do". :puzzled:

Skip buying the Prism Snapshot. It's called the 'Snapshot" because the lines `snap'... and then your fun is 'shot'

Symphony is bit better....but still not quality/durability. I'd skip this also.

Ditto on HQ Beamer, PL Hornet, PKD Buster, Flexifoil Sting/Rage. Buy used at you're price point.

No SINGLE kite will do it all!

I am meaning that you should expect to have to buy more than one kite as you progress through the sport. Whatever style of kite each of us use we typically need more than 1 to cover our different wind and styles.

Oh crap, you are joking! Man my Ha Ha meter is off today! :duh:

Quote: Originally posted by Bladerunner

Oh crap, you are joking! Man my Ha Ha meter is off today! :duh:

:moon:

Buy a good 3m/4line any...good name Co of course...whatever colors you like
Better move than the kites your asking about...Welcome!

Oh, man. I was afraid this would happen. I am a member of a knife forum so I can pretty much already see my very expensive Kite future starting to unfold...

Thanks to everyone for their thoughful and welcoming responses. Let's say that I go straight to four line kites... it would dig into my knife budget but I could probably make it happen. My initial thought was that four line kits would be a bit less convenient to set up and take down. I have three small kids and I hate tangles, I thought two liners might be a bit convenient to fly, no?

I fully understand now that there is no one kite that will give you what you want in all conditions. But with that said, I am having a hard time imagining the tangible (in wind) differences between a 2 and 3m kite. I notice some use a 3m for buggying. Does this mean in higher winds it would be unmanageble to fly static. And same for the 2m; would it be fun in highish winds but leave me wanting when it wasn't really blowing?

Honestly, i don't see myself going any further than static flying due to location and time, but I am sure those were the famous last words of many here. That being said, I'd like to have moderate pull on lightish wind days and I'd like to get dragged a good bit when things cranked up.

Since yesterday, I have gotten fairly intriqued by the PL hornet but there is a significant jump in $ between the 2m and 3m... and I'm the impatient type so a used kite may or may not be in the cards.

Further input is much apprecaited. Sorry for being so newbish about this.

Quote: Originally posted by cjmeik

My initial thought was that four line kits would be a bit less convenient to set up and take down. I have three small kids and I hate tangles, I thought two liners might be a bit convenient to fly, no? But with that said, I am having a hard time imagining the tangible (in wind) differences between a 2 and 3m kite. I notice some use a 3m for buggying. Does this mean in higher winds it would be unmanageble to fly static. And same for the 2m; would it be fun in highish winds but leave me wanting when it wasn't really blowing? Further input is much apprecaited. Sorry for being so newbish about this.

The trick to reduce tangles with any multiple line kite is line storage control. Everyone has their own technique and we have all spent hours working out tangles which could be a thread in and of its own. I like to use a standard winder and figure 8 the lines for both two and four line kites. If the quad lines are thick, not a concern of yours yet, I will use two winders [either port and starboard or drive and brake] and I detach the lines from the kite every time. Some people do a dedicated lineset with each kite which will help to keep track of the line ends where the tangles start. Some people like to figure eight the lines to the handles. Some people, particularly with larger foils, flake the lines into the kitebag on top of the kite. It all comes down to what you like to do. Another hazard is that when unwinding lines you need to unwind in reverse of how you wound which can cause problems if someone else wound up your lines.

If I understand correctly the power of a wing goes up exponentially with size. So for the sake of argument if we say that the 2m has a "power rating" of 4 the 3m would have a "power rating" of 9, not exact math but you can see the idea.
Any kite that can be flown in a buggy can be flown static, it just comes down to how much power you can [or feel like] hold down.
Yes any kite that you get will have winds that it will not fly in at the low end and should not fly in at the high end which is where the quiver concept comes in to enlarge the range of winds that you feel comfortable flying in.

If you are looking for something to fool around on with some pull then get the 2.5 Snapshot. However, from personal experience, you might get bored with a 2 line kite and will be ready for a 4 line after a few flights. Specifically out of your choices, the 2.5m Snapshot would probably be the better pick considering it's convertible to a 4 line. It won't be enough to make you scud in low winds but you'll feel some pull compared to the 1.8 you flew before. When the winds pick up, you might get the odd scud in. You will want more pull after though, so 3-4m range might be the ideal range.

Definitely do not use tangles as a deterrent from getting a 4-line kite. Once you learn how to set-up/pack-up, tangles won't often form, (there are a few videos showing different methods of wrapping lines around your handles, etc).

There is quite a difference between a 2 and 3m. In short, the 2m will have a broader wind range. While the 3m will have a narrower range. I would only get a 2m if you plan on flying it in stronger winds. That's when 2m's are most alive! If you're going 4-line route, look at a 3-4m. Flexifoil rage 3.5m or PKD Buster Soulfly come to mind. The PKD is an affordable/quality kite that will fit your budget. There is no doubt the 3-4m size will pull you around when winds pick up, even in light winds.

My opinion? Get a 3-4m 4-line kite and you won't look back!

Thanks again.

I notice the PL Twister 4m and Cloud Buster Pro 3.3m in the classifieds are either of these good options. Would the twister be too ambitious?

IT's up to you.. I traded my Snapshot 2.5 in for a 4M Crossfire which is also a pretty drastic difference. Here are a True 2M Kite Crossfire and a Symphony 2.2 Sport Kite laid on top of a 4M Crossfire.. That difference is much bigger than just what you see.. I also first stated I'd be doing just static.. After a few year of that, Stunt flying and a bit of buggying I've gotten a lot of kites. The one's you see in this picture (my first 3 after trading the Snapshot) still get the most airtime of my powerkites..


Bottom line is you have to do what's best for you.. Also in the classifieds is
Fb kites for sale
2m lynn hornet 2014 version. -new, sealed, complete $200

knifes cant fly...jusayin
you weight 225#...buy yourself a 3m kite you deserve it

^^^What he said. :D

I'm 190 lbs. and live on the N. shore of Long Island where the wind can (and does) vary from "zero" to "hero" in the blink of an eye. If you're not attentive, it can catch you off guard, as Brandon will attest. That being said, you outweigh me by >35lbs, and my 3 meter Beamer has never (to date, anyway) given me any indication it would lift me into the air. Pull me off my feet? Yes. Lift me in the air? Nope.

I also say go for the 3M. Your stated "typical" wind conditions and weight will keep you grounded - if that's a concern and a deciding factor.

Frank

Agreed with the 3m-4m. I'm 175lbs and my HQ Rush IV Pro 350 has yet to lift me higher then I wanted. Yes, I have been yanked off my feet. Yes I have had tiny jumps out of it (do not attempt jumping on small kites). But never was lifted with out assisting the kite by jumping.

You'll be fine, practice in light winds and slowly work your way up.

Try this for landing, launching and packing up a 3m Hornet... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FFVFffvXrQ

Abkayak knows what time it is and what I'm going to post. :D

You do deserve a real 3m. here is my 2.5 snapshot next to my 3 meter beamer.

There are many good reasons to go 4 line.

If and when you crash a 2 line kite odds are you won't be able to re-launch it. Even your kids will learn how to use the back / brake lines to reverse launch in very little time. Without brake lines you will be stuck having to walk to the kite and reset it each time. It will save you a ton of time and agro' while learning and crashing a lot.

Flying 2 line gets boring real fast! 3 line kites are just 2 line kites with reverse launch capability. Adding handles and 4 lines gives you independent brake control on each side. This adds another dimension to the sail and allows you to do all sorts of fun stuff.

I personally find that at about 3m most FB kites start to turn and respond just a bit slower . Delivering power through a longer power stroke and at the edge much more like grown up power kites. As they get smaller they zip through the wind window and spin about like a bumble bee. The smaller they get the less power they give and for shorter little spurts.

Even if you don't move on to riding I am pretty certain you will enjoy a 3m 4 line for a lot longer than any 2 or 3 line kite.

I expect that there are a lot of parallels between knife and kite collecting. You will understand when we are saying to shop used and quality product. Kites drop in value as soon as they leave the shop. The used value doesn't drop too fast if you keep your gear in good shape.

4m may be just a bit big? Especially for your kids! It is sort of an in between size and harder to sell. Twister is high lift and high performance. 4m will dramatically reduce your chances to fly in high winds. Having only a 4m will tempt you to do so and that's worth avoiding.

The Buster 3.3 Pro is a good choice ACCEPT. It is Pro because it is a light weight material. You pay more for it and it's potentially less durable. Good qualities for an experienced pilot but not so much for a beginner. You should contact BigKid on this forum. He may be able to get you a Buster Soulfly in standard material at a decent price?

Ok, ok. I'm in. Four lines, 3-4m... but now which one?

@riffclown: Thanks for that perspective. Very helpful.

@abkayak: Truth. Nothing but truth.

@ John Holgate: Thanks for the link. I thought I had watched every kiting video on youtube in the past 48hrs but I missed that one

@ssayre: What's going on with that red chair? J/k. That Prism makes a 3m kite look HUUUGE!

@Bladerunner: Thanks so much for the thorough, thoughtful response and really addressing each of my questions, specifically product related. One thing you said that stuck out to me was that a 4m kite was "sort of an in between size." Can you expand on what you mean by this?

I am leaning towards 4m as I don't get to high wind areas very frequently and the very moderate winds here in inland GA might keep me excited with a slightly larger kite. Of course, the downside is potentially getting overwhelmed or at least more of a workout that I might want when I do happen to go to a high wind area [enter 2nd smaller kite :D]

Kinda liking me some Twister right now. Is this misguided? What are everyone's recommendations for a 3-4m 4-line for an ambitious, low-wind newb?

I think a Beamer or PKD Buster Soulfly would be a great first kite for you. Like the others said, don't even both with the two line mess. A four line kite isn't any harder to pack up or set up. You leave the lines attached to your kite and you won't ever have tangles. Watch one of the many fixed bridle packing videos online to get an idea of what we mean. Welcome!

Most folks start out at 2.5 - 3.3m or so. PERFECT size for learning, feeling power and staying somewhat safe.

When they develop skills it becomes their high wind kite and they buy another. Usually around 5m .

$m doesn't really fly any earlier than 3. It starts to create power earlier. Too much power when the wind picks up. Having nothing else to go to you are tempted to take it into dangerous winds.

I warn against 4m Twister more for your kids than you! Sharing a smaller kite is safer!

Blades words are on record...w/kites you want to err on the side of caution
3m kite isn't just family fun...it will always have a place in your heart and kick your ass

Fellow newb here. I started with this addiction a few months ago, and now I fly 2 or 3 times a week on my lunch hour.

You really need to have an idea of normal wind speeds and type (smooth or gusty) for your area.

90% of the time, wind in my area is 1) smooth and 2) 10-12mph. I weigh 165lbs. I usually fly a 4.7m Rage in those conditions with no problem - but my conditions are almost -never- gusty. If the wind picks up over 15mph, the 4.7 gets packed up and I fly a 3.5m Rage. I wear my skate helmet and I trained myself to not be afraid to let go and let my kite killers do their job if a big gust hits.

You really can't go wrong with a nice 3m for your first kite. If you are worried it won't have enough pull, don't be - winds over 12-15mph can pull you around just fine. Also keep in mind it is usually super easy to sell a quality 3m because they are useful to newbs and experienced folks.

From one newb to another... start with a quality 3m. Teach yourself how to control it with the brakes, and how sending it across different locations within the wind window determines the power. You will be happy (for a while), then you will want a different size to try out and all of a sudden you run out of storage space to hold all of your new toys. Ask me how I know.

Have fun and welcome!

and FWIW, I got my 4M Crossfire even trade from a friend that bought too much kite. I traded him the 2.5 Snapshot for it.. I did take a different approach from many here on the forum and on a path similar to you.. The conventional Wisdom is start with a 3M kite. I started with a 2M and 4M both Crossfires as my first traction kites.

You have to do right for you. When you stated you wanted to choose between 2 and cited budget, I gave my take based on that input. I stand by my statements and offer further that you should definitely try to connect with some fliers in your area if possible so you aren't caught unawares.. If you absolutely don't have any fliers in your area, get in touch with me via U2U. I'll consider letting you borrow something in the 2-3M range to try if you just pay the postage both ways.

You can fall in love with this sport but you can also fall badly. I can't see a 4M kite as a first 4 line for anyone..It's just too steep of a learning curve.

Thanks, everyone, for the continued guidance.

@Bladerunner: Thanks for the clarification. Makes sense.

@riffclown: I appreciate the strong rec against a 4m kite and thank you for the extremely generous offer!

I did some looking into the wind data in my area for the past 3 weeks and my findings are as follows:

Week before last: range: 0-15 avg: 5.9
Last week: range: 4-12 avg: 7.8
This week: range: 7-19 avg: 12.4 (usually windy)

What does this do to everyones rec's?

Right now I'm a little tossed up btw a used PL Core 3m, PL Twister 3m, and HQ Beamer 3m. I understand the Twisters are more lifty but don't know much more about how the three compare. Any thoughts?

Quote: Originally posted by cjmeik

Right now I'm a little tossed up btw a used PL Core 3m, PL Twister 3m, and HQ Beamer 3m. I understand the Twisters are more lifty but don't know much more about how the three compare. Any thoughts?

Easy decision: buy the Core. (Yes, I'm biased :smile grin: )

Quote:

Easy decision: buy the Core. (Yes, I'm biased :smile grin: )

Aside from your bias, what is it you like about the core compared to the other two?

out of those 3 I've only flown the twister and in the 4m size and the beamer in the 3m size. The twister is higher aspect and will be a lot more exciting to fly static. The beamer will be a little more docile when static flying but be a little better behaved as an engine in lumpy wind and have less lift. PL touted the core as an all arounder and by all accounts is a great kite. Personally, I'd pick the core out of the 3 even though that's the one kite I haven't flown out of the 3.