I just wanted to tell the world that I am in love with this kite :wee:

Booya!!! Me too! I got about 8 hours on it between yesterday and sunday and i can't believe how fun it is. The turning, the speed, the jumps, the redirects. I LOVE IT ALL. This is officially my fav kite and the kite i most look forward to taking out of the bag. Coming from the Pu2, the kite was intimidating at first with how much faster and more responsive it is. but I couldn't be happier with the transition.

BTW.. I'm payin for those flight hours today, I've got some serious aches. good thing I can sit it off at my desk!

me too me too

I just did not have the chance to test it often having too many kites to test.

what I like about the 15m is it gives me enough low end in winter anytime and at same time having better depower so I feel safer.

it has great suspension when jumping and the turning speed makes it easy to redirect, like a balloon

I am sure this will be my new all-around on the water 90% of the time this summer

And Flysurfer surges back into the lead...

Quote:

Originally posted by dylanj423 And Flysurfer surges back into the lead...

Hahaha, that's EXACTLY what I was thinking

Yup, there's still plenty of skeptics, (regarding relaunch, OF COURSE) but I always let people fly my stuff at the park and the typical response is OMG the depower, I could get used to this.

Urrr~ I want my P4 15M SA back

Thought you liked your Speed 2 15M SA? I didnt realize you had a P4 one as well at one point... Why would you ever sell that?

I liked them all. It's just a money problem (as always)

Flysurfer is not hype. They are just that good, and they are going back to where they should be, at the top of the list

All models (I have at least one of them in the trunk now) are just the best in their respective field for depower foils

Speed2 lightwind
P4 freestyle depower turning speed
P2 all around water
Outlaw all around snowkite

OK twin skins eats gusts better, but the P4 does pretty much good and above any other flat foil. Easy compare to a LEI for many aspects.


I can ride on snow with my P4 15m when everybody else are with foils below 10m, or 12m LEI

Quote:

Originally posted by leebrianh Urrr~ I want my P4 15M SA back

It's about 10 minutes drive from my home :singing::singing:

I'll give it a go for u soon. Kites can be shared, aren't they?

not to brag about how smart I am or anything but I really feel like I have an almost ideal setup.

high aspect Arcs for the higher junkie winds: 12m and 15m phantoms

P4 15m for the lighter days

Mountain bike and Boat for the days that are too light for the P4



Now if I could just find a way to have more free time but still make the same amount of money.....hmmm

FSer hyped???..........relaunch??? simple simon........ the pulse almost relaunches itself/P3 easy as well..............You FSer boyz feelin a little heat?:duh::duh:

All models (I have at least one of them in the trunk now) are just the best in their respective field for depower foils

Speed2 lightwind
P4 freestyle depower turning speed
P2 all around water
Outlaw all around snowkite

hate to burst your blow out valves but Ill give you the low end on the SA 2 but thats about it. Ive seen the 15 Syn in low winds with a 12m P2..................no contest there, Syn takes that one. I was almost embarrassed for the Pulse 2. The P3 did well in gusts........................ Im sure the P4 is as good as the P3 but again another no contest. So that leaves you the possibility of turning speed and snow both of which would more than likely go to the Synergy as well......................care to re evaluate?:duh::duh:

Quote:

hate to burst your blow out valves but Ill give you the low end on the SA 2 but thats about it. Ive seen the 15 Syn in low winds with a 12m P2..................no contest there, Syn takes that one. I was almost embarrassed for the Pulse 2. The P3 did well in gusts........................ Im sure the P4 is as good as the P3 but again another no contest. So that leaves you the possibility of turning speed and snow both of which would more than likely go to the Synergy as well......................care to re evaluate?:duh::duh:

interesting.
you can call me a dirty old kite wh0re. i'd like to try/own one of everything (popular brand) and i don't have a PL twin skin (yet).
i don't want to slag anyone but i'm confused. my 12m Pu2 was pulling me (180-ish) on skis when no one could get wolfee's 16m Scorp up. there were a couple experienced PL arc user's trying. i've spent a lot of time with the PL Arc wind range calculator but there is no Synergy input so i'm not up to speed on the Synergy. from the sounds of it , they have more low end grunt per/m2 than all other modern PL twin skins?
i know what the PL's high and low AR(land/water) models are from the S-arc up to Scorp.
Paul

wind ranges for the Synergy are on the PL website...........well I hate to slag anyone myself but he left himself wide open on this one and has little or no arc experience. I have owned both.......FS and PL.........both are great kites. One very complex design one very simple but both very effective..............the Syns have improved low end, and turning speed............the Scorp has a higher AR and would require more wind to launch.............I had no problem with the 16m Scorp on sand in 9/10 mph winds...........................

I like them both and carry both in my quiver.

I wasn't a huge fan of the 10m synergy i tried though. it had more bar pressure then I care for.


still I'll probably pick up a few synergy's when they drop below the $500 mark.


one aspect everybody always seems to forget is that flysurfer has the ultimate setup time out of any kite on the market.

to the point where it can make the difference between getting that perfect sunset session right after work vs just missing it because you had to connect your lines and either pump or fully preinflate your kite :Ange09:

Quote:

Originally posted by tridude wind ranges for the Synergy are on the PL website...........well I hate to slag anyone myself but he left himself wide open on this one and has little or no arc experience. I have owned both.......FS and PL.........both are great kites. One very complex design one very simple but both very effective..............the Syns have improved low end, and turning speed............the Scorp has a higher AR and would require more wind to launch.............I had no problem with the 16m Scorp on sand in 9/10 mph winds...........................

i know wolfee has 'limited' arc experience but the other two guys try'n had no luck as well and they have plenty of arc(s) and hours on them. no biggie i like to own a FS SA and a Synergy one day soon.
Paul

I'm with you on the Silver Arrow and could care less about the performance - they're just such beautiful kites!

Saturday I was out with the V19 and saw first hand the difference in setup between the FS and the PL. A guy came out with his Pulse 14 (I think) and was unpacked and off in true foil fashion. I preinflated the best I could with mother nature (I don't want to carry some DC fan around with me - seems to take away from it for me). Not knocking any assisted inflators out there - I was just told early in my life with the Arcs "if it'll fill, it'll fly" so I figure why force the issue only to have a filled kite that otherwise wouldn't have and most likely will not fly?

Anyway, the preflight time, the tricky light wind launches - I'm cool with that, I know that setup and launch is a different game on the PLs. I gave up prematurely on Wolfees Scorp that day although I really do believe the wind was just too light at the time despite the fact that the foils were flying (FS, the Naish, the Ozones and the HQ). I really do think the low low end of any foil can't be matched by a PL and I attribute it to the extra weight of the kites - not just the spars but the fact that the arc shape means that only 70-80 percent of the kite is involved in lifting the ripstop skyward, I can't see how the hanging wigtips can do anything in the way of providing lift to the kite's mass. A foil is most all involved in the lifting to the sky. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm not professing any real long term experience with PLs here, there are a good many who are far more versed in them but I really believe these things, regardless of size, need a minimum 12-15km/h (7-9mph) just to get them in the air - and that wind has to be CLEAN. Any lulls in that wind and you'd better be working the kite good to keep it airborne. The autozenith only works if a baseline windspeed is maintained. It was a bit of a pucker moment watching the V19 open it's arms wide up at the zenith and start drifting backwards to the powerzone - even in those light winds Saturday (12-15km/h) any gust much over 18km/h woulda/coulda sent me on a trip ; )

Again, no expert, just my experience (wrong or not). I'm with you on the "one of every color" plan. That's the only way to know and I won't truly know what's in a kite regardless of make model or manufacturer until I'm flying at my kite's limits. Perhaps the Synergys overcome some of this light wind analysis of mine.

Sorry for the ramble, just thought I'd chime in. I guess I'm really taking this thread off topic - sorry. Go Psycho4! Woo hoo! (I'd own one if I could afford it - I swear!)

oh yeah if my budget and flight time allowed it Id have a SA2 19. Again there is no hype surrounding FSer, well maybe in the tube community (if they even know what FSer is). Amazing how little they know about kites but thats another story.....................

I do know my P3 13 was good on sand in the 8/9 mph range. The Synergy 9/10. Water about 11/12 kts on the P3, about the same on the Syn but I have improved. So we're talking apples oranges here on low end. However, once the winds are up and get a bit flakey......................

Top end or depower if you will are pretty much the same remembering the bigger arcs projected area is smaller (15 Syn comparable to a 13 P3). Anyway enough of the political correctness bull #@%$#!........................big market out there folks and plenty of room for PL, FSer and lets not forget the Neo. I have and will continue to give props to all 3. I was gonna kick back and let this one go, laughed actually but blind statements like that will always be challenged.........................
:duh::duh:

NW,

good point on out of the bag and flying time............FSer and the HQ Neo have this one locked...........................all though leaving your lines connected and stix in would save a few mins on the arcs as well..................:duh::duh:

Quote:

Originally posted by tridude NW, good point on out of the bag and flying time............FSer and the HQ Neo have this one locked...........................all though leaving your lines connected and stix in would save a few mins on the arcs as well..................:duh::duh:

yeah I do that on my 12m phanny currenlty.

I still usually have to disconnect something and screw around with it for a bit to get everything layed out right and the kite fully inflated.

i'm an arc noob so I expect the setup time to get shorter as I get more familiar with them :tumble:


on a separate subject I've been curious about the NEO. I wish someone around here had one that I could try out. I don't suppose you see any pass the NEO programs in the near future? hint hint ;-)

I only know of 2 people that own Neos............1 in SC, 1 in Ga and doubt they wwould pass the Neo.....,,,dakitez has a quiver............he may be willing to do something for ya...................:duh::duh:

If yer up in the DC area, there is a gentlemen who has been nice enough to let some people fly his Neo...

Quote:

Originally posted by nwsurfwakeskate one aspect everybody always seems to forget is that flysurfer has the ultimate setup time out of any kite on the market. to the point where it can make the difference between getting that perfect sunset session right after work vs just missing it because you had to connect your lines and either pump or fully preinflate your kite :Ange09:

I haven't ever flown a flysurfer so I'm not sure how well they do with setup time but I watched Jan Hendrik from HQ launch a NEO with virtually no preinflation. It inflated while flying in 20-30 seconds in light winds with him working it getting gulps of air. The rest of its setup is just like an open cell foil. unroll lines, stake, unfold kite, fly. If the flysurfer has an advantage over this, then pass it along to those of us that haven't flown one. Flysurfer must be one fantastic kite to have the following they have and to be able to command the prices they charge. I'm also not yet at a skill level to be able to get more than 2 times more fun out of a flysurfer than an ARC or HQ depower product.

I have seen been out with LeeBrianH, and watched him setup and launch his kite and take off as soon as the kite was in the air. The few time I've seen a Neo go up, the person on it has always had to "work it" to get it fully filled in. The FlySurfer kites launch powered up and the rider normally just takes off.

Now, granted, I have the Outlaws, which are open cell, but I'll roll, stake, sit in the buggy, launch and roll out. No inflation time. When the kite comes off the ground, the buggy starts to roll. Turn the kite into the wind, and I'm off and flying. I've seen LeeBrian do similiar with his Psycho4s.

The wind the day I'm talking about was sub minimal. Jan was forcing the kite to fly in not enough wind. Normally, it would just fill itself on the stake, while you were getting your gloves and helmet on. The point being, that the NEO doesn't require any special consideration in normal winds and yet you are still able to fly it even if there isn't enough wind to preinflate it. I still want one of all of them myself, ARCs, NEOS, and some flysurfers.