I have just seen this. i figured i would get it out there first, before someone else. Just to clarify this is not me.

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Originally posted by Pansh ebay shop I am sorry to report the Official Pansh eBay shop is now closed, you can find the reason for this in the open letter below. Please contact Pansh Customer Support at info@panshkite.com if you have any questions for Pansh ============== start of open letter ====================== Open letter of resignation - send to Pansh 1st March 2009 Please accept this open letter as my resignation from the position of official Pansh UK eBay agent with immediate effect. To explain why I am resigning, I will remind you of our agreement when we originally started our partnership. That we would have a open, honest and trusting relationship. I regret to say that in my 18 months of dealing with you, I have found you conduct your business in the exact opposite way, in a secret, underhand and mis-trustful way. I had hoped that I could encourage you to change, but you have ignored all attempts to draw issues to your attention. Hence I now have no option but to terminate our relationship. I will list below in priority order some of the issues. I am not looking for a reply to any of these, the time for that reply and remedial action is long gone. However I hope you will reflect on some of them, and hence my resignation may as yet do some good. 1/ Disrespect of Dealers - I was appalled by the way you treat the people you did business with. Refusing to answer their questions and making it impossible for them to make a profit. Your attitude that "if all they are interested in is money, then we are not interested in them", quite frankly stinks. 2/ Unsafe Products - All versions of your handles are unsafe. As you know they can fail with catastrophic results. You have seen the pictures of the injuries caused to people because of your faulty products, yet you still sell them. This is criminal negligence. 3/ Illegal import - Your business model relies on illegally declaring goods as low value gifts. If the customs catch you, then you have decided it is cheaper to refund the few % that get caught, rather than pay the duties due. This is illegal. 4/ Misrepresenting Products - By your own confession the specified aspect ratio and weights of your kites are estimates. You also know the wingspans are inaccurate (e.g, the 4m Ace is actually smaller than the published size of the Ace 3.5m). It is illegal to misrepresent your products like this. 5/ Lack of Instructions and safety features - On beginners kites it is essential that new flyers are safely introduced, with proper safety equipment and instructions. Your point blank refusal to address this area is irresponsible. 6/ Copied kite descriptions - From the Flexifoil Rage amongst others. Simply unforgivable. 7/ Fake sales prices - You seem to think it is acceptable to put up prices by 20%, then immediately announce a "10% sale". Or publish fake RRP prices that kites have never sold for. This practice is illegal in Europe. Goods have to be on sale at the higher price for a specified period of time before a sale can be declared. As I said I do not expect a reply, I am just so disappointed it came to this. You choose to ignore all these issues as they were brought to your attention, rather than address them in an open, honest and trusting way. For all the reasons above, and many more, I now wish to have nothing further to do with Pansh. =================== end of open letter ==================== This information also posted here: http://stores.ebay.co.uk/PANSH-Powerkite-UK-Power-Kites I REALLY hope some good can come of my resignation, hence PLEASE feel free to copy this information to where ever you see approprite. Thank you! Lastly my personal thanks to you to the "Pansh Community" for your support, it is really appreciated.

Wow... can you say OWNED?! That is one very respectful, yet stern letter. It's sad to hear that about such a company. I am sad that they screw their Dealers into not making any profit, as well as making specials happen without their knowing. That handles thing kinda scares me... o.O Makes me question the validity of my own handles, I don't want these babies to fail while i'm jumpin' with 'em. That's a bummer though It's also good to see someone took action that needed to be taken. Hopefully we see change in the business practice coming from Pansh.

Is this a general consensus among dealers and/or fliers or is this really the reflection of one dealer. I know there's been back and fourth banter on the forum wrt "cheapness" but I've also heard that I a lot of folks really enjoy their pansh kites. I'd be interested to hear opinions from those who either have pansh kites or have tried to deal with pansh, the company.

From what i've seen Pansh screws the dealers, but treats the end users really well. If you report a malfunction in their product they don't blink an eye, and ship you another one. However, the dealer relationship quite sucks from what I hear, I'll let dakitez speak up for that one

PS. Yes, i LOVE my Ace.

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Originally posted by arkay Is this a general consensus among dealers and/or fliers or is this really the reflection of one dealer.

Been following this on another forum. This isn't a dealer, it was the Pansh Agent. i.e someone who used to act for Pansh, paid by Pansh.

It is an insiders view out ... warts and all ...

The handle issue is news to me. I have had only one problem where the handle was cutting into the leader. I have been hearing from other dealers since this letter was out coming that they have also had some issues. All the issues related to the handles cutting into the leaders, if I'm not mistaken. I do not recall an incident where the handle its self broke. Most of the cut leaders were happening within minutes (or a few times seconds) of initial flight.

Due to this news I will be offering discount packages on all pansh kites I sell for upgraded handles.

As far as I'm concerned everyone should be flying with the Flexifoil prolink handles, but I'm sure the price is hard to swallow for some people, especially when they are only paying $100 for the kite to start with.

As far as how they take care of their dealers goes. Every dealer I have been in contact with all says the same thing. ITS NOT GOOD!

Could this be the beginning of the end of Pansh???? If you have distribution issues it usually is not long before the whole bottom falls out.

I doubt that this is the end. Their model is rock bottom prices and I suspect that they still do a lot of sales directly from their website.

Honestly I don't place this company much higher than the Nova kite company. We're talking about a company that treats its dealers bad, lies about its products (item 4) and rips off other companies (item #6). That sounds like Nova to me. Pansh is just better at it.

my thoughts...

its a chinese factory producing kites ... what do you expect. im chinese and have been to many factories from clothing to kites, they are all the same. some are better than others because they are controlled by the actually manufacture, for example Ozone / U-Turn / Advance-Thun etc.

when you pay $100 for a kite you're getting your $100, the nice thing is that your local dealers make your $100 kite worth more because of the CUSTOMER SERVICE they offer. do they screw over their dealers, sure they do ... because they offer kites direct, and also offer deals that dealers cant even offer. they may or may not be limited time offers, but they are still selling direct. i could be wrong, but sell direct only in your country not in someone elses country, where you have appointed dealers and distributors.

as for kite information, thats important stuff to know. however not everyone cares about the technical details of a kite. I've seen many kite brands trying to make their AR sound so great by listing only the Flat AR, and not the Projected AR. when buying a kite do you look at the Flat Surface or the Projected Surface???

either way, dealers and consumers have the upper hand, if you like Pansh buy it, support them because they must put some $$$ back into R&D.

now, get out and kite whatever brand you have!!! support all your local dealers. see you at nabx.

Kind of curious to his comment on the Rage knock off.

I noticed a year and a half ago the similarities between the pass the pansh Ace and Angus's 4.9 Blade staked out right beside it. It might not be a direct copy but the shape was certainly close enough to make you take a second look. Anyone else ever had one staked out beside a blade? I know, that's a strange combination to be flying together. Only happened one other time when I tried a 4m Ace after the wind got too high for the 6.5 Blade. Ironically, I sold both my Pansh kites after that weekend, and put the money towards the Blade.

I have four pansh kites 2 aces and 2 legends havent had any issues other than learning the brake slack to launch and fly them

I fly all but one (2M legend) on different handles now but never had any issues using the stock handles before I switch them over.

I flew my 2M legend in some crazy wind(70-100 kilometers per hour gusts) never had any issues other than snapping a set of HQ KS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-S

Started out me bugging with pansh kites but after time was able through this forum get some higher quality kites but still have the panshs and haven't had any problem with them.:bigok:

but I fly within me capabilties and know that these kites arent top quaility so I dont push there limits.

just my 2 cents worth

as far as handles go, the sets that came with wolfee's and my Reactors are NOT good. as i unpacked kite, i was surprised to see the low quality handles (and I think i mentioned so in my review) especially when compared to everything else. sounds like the same problem as Pansh handles.
PL handles have a hard plastic grommet that is suppose to protect leader line from the sharp edge of drill holes in metal handle. the plastic grommets fall out very easily (thus sliding down leader) and worse, are super hard to get/fit back in to proper position. go figure:wow: this leaves the leader to rub against the unfinished metal edge.
i agree with opinion to upgrade handles and would have done so with PL if I would have known.
if the biggest complaint, in general, is low quality handles, i think Pansh has no worries.
Paul

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Originally posted by revpaul as far as handles go, the sets that came with wolfee's and my Reactors are NOT good. as i unpacked kite, i was surprised to see the low quality handles (and I think i mentioned so in my review) especially when compared to everything else. sounds like the same problem as Pansh handles. PL handles have a hard plastic grommet that is suppose to protect leader line from the sharp edge of drill holes in metal handle. the plastic grommets fall out very easily (thus sliding down leader) and worse, are super hard to get/fit back in to proper position. go figure:wow: this leaves the leader to rub against the unfinished metal edge. i agree with opinion to upgrade handles and would have done so with PL if I would have known. if the biggest complaint, in general, is low quality handles, i think Pansh has no worries. Paul

[interrupt Pansh bashing]
For what it's worth, the PL handles are completely re-designed and are top-notch all the way. Handles color-coded and padded full length. Leaders are well faired out of the handles and like the lines and bridles, are numbered 1-2-3-4 for the newbie. All other accessories up-dated too.
[resume Pansh bashing]

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[interrupt Pansh bashing] For what it's worth, the PL handles are completely re-designed and are top-notch all the way. Handles color-coded and padded full length. Leaders are well faired out of the handles and like the lines and bridles, are numbered 1-2-3-4 for the newbie. All other accessories up-dated too. [resume Pansh bashing]

angus,
i'd like to see a set of the new PL handles.
how do the new PL handles compare to Flexi's really expensive ( i mean good) one's? we have three sets, one set to each Blurr and a set on the .....Pansh Sprint.....
would the new PL handles compare more to the previous gen Flexi handle (which I like just as much).
ahhh, "padded full length". maybe they compare more with Ozone. we have many different sets of Ozone and HQ handles too.
Paul

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Quote: Originally posted by revpaul [interrupt Pansh bashing] For what it's worth, the PL handles are completely re-designed and are top-notch all the way. Handles color-coded and padded full length. Leaders are well faired out of the handles and like the lines and bridles, are numbered 1-2-3-4 for the newbie. All other accessories up-dated too. [resume Pansh bashing] angus, i'd like to see a set of the new PL handles. how do the new PL handles compare to Flexi's really expensive ( i mean good) one's? we have three sets, one set to each Blurr and a set on the .....Pansh Sprint..... would the new PL handles compare more to the previous gen Flexi handle (which I like just as much). ahhh, "padded full length". maybe they compare more with Ozone. we have many different sets of Ozone and HQ handles too. Paul

Moved to this thread...
http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=8637&pa...

(did not want to hamper som good Pansh bashing...)

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Quote: Paul Moved to this thread... http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=8637&pa... (did not want to hamper som good Pansh bashing...)

thnx Angus.
Pansh bashing!? never heard of it:moon:
Paul

The one Pansh kite I flew in the pass the Pansh program made me really not like them..enough said.

I wouldn't ever knowingly buy one.

Scott

I've had 3 pansh kites -- 2 Aces (6m and 12m) and 1 Legend (4.5m).

The 12m Ace was a lot to deal with trying to tame the lift once it got off the ground, and the turning speeds.

The 6m Ace... I really didn't have any problems with. Had it not been for wanting a Blade, I'd probably still have it.

The 4.5m Legend... I still own this kite. I still enjoy to fly it as well, and do whenever winds are good.

With it seeming that every kite from their factory being a little different than the last, I may have just got lucky at the draw. For the handles, I never used the Pansh handles much as they did seem inferior (compared to HQ's or Flexi's). I've run into several other brands I thought the same thing about though -- so I'm not going to judge by looks alone. I've had Pansh kites stand up to some pretty brutal crashes as well, so I'm willing to say that the quality of the sail itself has been good in my experience. They are cheap kites (in price) and good quality considering the price IMO. Again, I may have gotten lucky with all mine, but I have considered adding another Pansh to the quiver.

I have two pansh kites ace2m and ace5m. Picking up an ace 8m today. I love them, so far. Sure not high end kites but the only problem I really have is setting up the handles so that you are not pinching your index finger. Nothing a few knots in the power lead didn't fix. The power is great with steady wind, and plenty of lift if you are into it.I am actually getting ready to upgrade to a new set of the prolinks and that should solve my problem as far as comfort. Sorry to hear about the dealer problems though. Hope it doesn't bruise it too much.

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Originally posted by shehatesmyhobbies I have two pansh kites ace2m and ace5m. Picking up an ace 8m today. I love them, so far. Sure not high end kites but the only problem I really have is setting up the handles so that you are not pinching your index finger. Nothing a few knots in the power lead didn't fix. The power is great with steady wind, and plenty of lift if you are into it.I am actually getting ready to upgrade to a new set of the prolinks and that should solve my problem as far as comfort. Sorry to hear about the dealer problems though. Hope it doesn't bruise it too much.

Do you or have you ever flown a kite that isn't a Pansh ?

Pansh SEEMS O.K. until you try a real kite ! Same thing with the handles.

Yes I have also flown a flexifoil blade 8.5. Love that one too! I am only in the sport about a year now. I look forward to upgrading as I go. But I still love my pansh. I would love to sink my teeth into a pl twin skin. scratching change together now!

I liked my 6m Ace and 5m Blaze till I flew a 6.5 Blade. Sold both and had my own Blade in about 6 weeks. Never flew a pansh again.

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Originally posted by shehatesmyhobbies Yes I have also flown a flexifoil blade 8.5. Love that one too! I am only in the sport about a year now. I look forward to upgrading as I go. But I still love my pansh. I would love to sink my teeth into a pl twin skin. scratching change together now!

Great. I was hoping you had something of quality to compare to. Start by comparing the handles, then look at the lines side by side, up at the bridle things will start to look much different, Material, stitching and then the inlets, they will all look just enough different to be worth the extra $$$ . If you have it ! Your life may depend on it !

Pansh pulls off a pretty good job of immitating the competition. Enough that people who have only had Pansh have a tough time getting their head around how another brands kite of the same size can be worth more.
KNOWING and seeing that you can trust ABC company has designed and tested it's equipment so it is over designed and not break down becomes priority. Welllll that and economics ;-)

I bought my 5m ace because it was 1st out for $99 delivered and complete. It was sort of satisfying a curiosity. It was $100 well spent. I got to see 1st hand that Pansh puts out a flyable product at a bargain basement price. A far better choice than much of the junk I have seen people come to the park with from Ebay etc..
Because I knew better I tossed the lines and handles. If I didn't know better I would have put my life on the line. The kite is capable of some extreme stuff but pairing it with the lines and handle I got was an obvious safety hazard IMHO.
Selling a kite without a safety manual has always been a sore spot with me.

Please note Pansh improved the handles and line after that point to ??? status

pansh kites are ok for the price.....but having flown a blade,i can see and feel the huge difference in quality.the verdict?? both kites worth the cost,but MY next kite is going to be a blade 6.5:singing:

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Originally posted by geojones pansh kites are ok for the price.....but having flown a blade,i can see and feel the huge difference in quality.the verdict?? both kites worth the cost,but MY next kite is going to be a blade 6.5:singing:

That is about the best I've heard anyone say it. Pansh is worth what they charge mostly. The more expensive kites are worth what they cost as well. You must be able to appreciate the difference to make it worth the extra money to YOU.

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Originally posted by geojones pansh kites are ok for the price.....but having flown a blade,i can see and feel the huge difference in quality.the verdict?? both kites worth the cost,but MY next kite is going to be a blade 6.5:singing:

That is exactly what I was trying to suggest.

The other important thing to keep in mind is the the safety of the gear is on par with the price. If safety is more important than money to you then maybe Pansh isn't the best place to start ?

If you are young and it is all you can afford it will do the job !

Well being that I was new to the sport, it was a financial thing. Spend a little to see if you like it. I do have a few of the pansh now but I am eventually going to add to my quiver and get some nicer kites. I can definitely see the difference in the bridal system between the pansh and the flexifoil. BIG difference. I am hooked on kiting for good and can't wait to experience nicer kites and more aspects of the sport mainly buggies and boards. Going to stay on land for a while though!!!!

geez.. I wish I would have read this before I bought my Ace, but all in all I am happy about the kite and having loads of fun, I am going to get a new set of handles!