So this was a used bar that came with the kite i bought, and I been looking at other bars, and the from the pictures i've seen my set up is a bit
different, is there anything wrong/awkward about it?
Lots wrong I think but I'm not familiar with that bar?
Your centre red line should also go to the trim strap. I don't get how it is attached ?
Below the bar your trim line should have have a chicken loop to hook onto your haness. That white thing is where the CL should be? .
I don't see a safety system? It is like it originaly flagged on the front red line through that ring?
The way it is set up now it looks like you adjust the length of the black front with the trin strap and the red woun't be effected? That is wrong for
sure.big_d - 13-10-2012 at 07:01 PM
I have a chicken loop its just not attached, it attaches throught like a car seat belt buckle I'm not sure why its like that but it does have a safety
and the safety does work,
the part that concerns me and I dont understand is the middle lines they are pretty much even but I dont think its right,
its an EH control bar, what can I do to fix this?Bladerunner - 13-10-2012 at 07:13 PM
K, can you explain how it goes to safety?
I agree, the red front line is wrong. It should probably go through the ring. I would expect that it does that and the stopper ball sets it. ( but the
ball is not set right for that ) Then your leash goes on to flag it. Is that an adjustable stopper that can be moved up ?
I don't get how that line with the stopper is terminated or why ????
The way it is set up now it looks like you adjust the length of the black front with the trim strap and the red woun't be effected? That is wrong for
sure.
P.S. that bar won't work on fixed bridle foils even if set up right.big_d - 13-10-2012 at 07:38 PM
I took a few more pictures maybe it will be better instead of me trying to explain,
theres also another stopped on the grey middle line, but its higher up the lineBladerunner - 13-10-2012 at 07:47 PM
HMMM ,
Different? I'm sure the red line goes through the ring. Still don't understand why or what it does what it does with the pull ball? ( pull pin and the
bar runs up the red line ? ) Still don't see how the red front changes length along with the black one? At least not without a stopper ball?
Maybe Dino is right and I do need skooling on bar set-ups !big_d - 13-10-2012 at 07:53 PM
yep, well I have no idea, im still rookie at this, just every control bar i've seen pictures have the two break lines right beside each other on a
ring of some sortdave brown - 13-10-2012 at 08:13 PM
That bar looks like a death trap to me.. The outside lines are fine but the center lines and that Chicken loop nightmare
need to go. Leave the seatbelt buckles in the car..
Rig up that loop without the buckle to the trimstrap with a simple 2 ring safety for the front linesbig_d - 13-10-2012 at 08:22 PM
well this is deff going to be a learning experience :P entering a new worldbeachrights - 14-10-2012 at 02:54 AM
I believe your bar is a 2003 Honda Civic Type R!! That really is a crazy release and I don't think it would release under pressure. Might want to
check fleabay for a newer bar- don't want you to get hurt.rocfighter - 14-10-2012 at 04:46 AM
That car seat belt buckle is a killer for sure. They are not designed to release under pressure in case they are bumped during an accident. If you got
in trouble you would be in HUGE trouble with this set up. I agree with Beachrights. Find a new bar. Or at least find some one in your area to help you
fix this one before you use it.doneski - 14-10-2012 at 05:34 AM
From what I see your knots, lines and chicken loop need to be replaced. You can keep the bar and may be able to keep the depower straps if you trust
it. How old is it, are the lines frayed or stitching coming undone?
Look at the different bar setups in this guide. http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/mx5alan/arcs/ARCsetup_FAQ.htm
You can get a chicken loop and new lines for under $100.
Look at the clam cleat design if you want to get rid or your depower straps.
Look at how the safety is connected to the ring at the top of your depower strap.
Look at the knots; these are knots that will not come undone. I wouldn't trust the knots on your bar.
Consider an Ozone Megatron chicken loop. Others work but unless you know what to look for stick with a major brand and buy new.big_d - 14-10-2012 at 06:31 AM
safety works I made sure of that, but yeah I am def going to find someone to help with it before I try and put it up again, #@%$#! now I am kind of
upset I bought this, oh well its only money there is always money to be made :P
thanks guys I do appreciate the help, and to the year I have no idea I bought it with a Ocean Rodeo Bronco 6m I saw on Kijjiji for 250 so I assume its
the year as the Bronco im guessing 2006 maybe, I bought before I really knew anything about this stuff oh well learning experience rightzero gee - 14-10-2012 at 09:11 AM
Here's another observation... that chickenloop /seatbelt "safety" setup is also longer than it should be. This puts the bar farther away from you and
causes you to hold the bar closer to the assembly reducing the amount of depower throw you can use. Holding the bar close to the chickenloop all the
time will powerup and can then stall the kite unless you have longer arms than the average joe or use poor stance. The only other way then to
compensate is to shorten the trimstrap to trim the kite. This can leave you with little to no depower left when the wind does kick in.Bladerunner - 14-10-2012 at 09:44 AM
If it is 2006 then you have a modified " Punch out " bar without the punch out ? That is what they used .
You say the safety works but don't explain how? I don't see it?
Search the internet for the Punch out bar and you will see what it was before abortion.
Is it too late to return this item ? Contact the seller? Ask him what he was thinking? He is no friend to the kiting community .zero gee - 14-10-2012 at 10:05 AM
There appears to be a pin type safety on the chickenloop and then tied to the seatbelt. I think the seatbelt is just some kind of quick disconnect???
and not a safety??
It's not an Ocean Rodeo bar. It's an EH Cabarete bar. But I think it's not entirely EH either. :dunno: It's a Frankenbar!zero gee - 14-10-2012 at 10:21 AM
The Bronco is OR's first ever kite. It could even be a 2002. It is a C kite and they have very little depower range to begin with and can easily kick
your ass even if setup correctly. You paid way too much for this kite.big_d - 14-10-2012 at 11:25 AM
well the guy said something he added the seat belt because his arms were too short,
for the safety basically I pull the red strap and that pin moves back and releases the seat belt (not the actual buckle but just detaches from the
loop)
well the way I look at it, the kite it self is in pretty good condition, and I couldnt find a kite and bar with lines anywhere for 250, so i dunno
maybe i did pay too much but oh well its too late now,
im going to cut the seat belt buckle off soon thats for sureBladerunner - 15-10-2012 at 06:33 AM
K, I think I kind of get it.
I still say you run the red front through the ring and need a stopper so it and the black will trim in and out equal. Then if you pop the release the
bar should run up the red line and flag the kite ????
Don't feel like you have made a huge mistake. You still have a kite and bar. Think of this as paying for your education.indigo_wolf - 15-10-2012 at 07:11 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by beachrights
I believe your bar is a 2003 Honda Civic Type R!! That really is a crazy release and I don't think it would release under pressure. Might want to
check fleabay for a newer bar- don't want you to get hurt.
A Honda seatbelt latch WILL NOT release with a load on it.
One of those things you learn when the car is resting on the passenger side and you are hanging suspended from your seat belt.
The only thing you can do is brace against the dead pedal to unweight.... and then release the seat belt.
As stated, the bar looks like it was cobbled together with the best intentions, but maybe not the best though put into it. If they skimped on the
release, heaven only knows where what else is amiss.
Strip and rebuild with parts and materials you know you can trust.
ATB,
Samvan - 15-10-2012 at 08:19 AM
That bar has parts from a 5th line system. I have a couple older bar that looks like that. The red power line needs to be taken off that fat white
line (normally bungee type) and put through the ring and then attached to another ring. The power line cannot be attached to the line below the trim
strap because when you trim, it will only trim one power line. Power lines should always go above your trim strap in PAIRS. If that fat white line
is a bungee type line like it should be, it will not work as a power line anyways. When you pull on the red ball, the whole trim strap section should
release and shoot up the 5th line ( which originally should go through that metal ring).
You can salvage parts of the bar if you want. Get rid of the 5th line portion if you don't need it. If you are gonna use it on a C-kite , then its
best to use the 5th line for safety reasons. I've modded two bars to bring them back to life. You have all the safety parts intact, just need to
remove the seatbelt piece since the chicken loop already has a release. If you don't use it as a 5th line system, then remove the release on top
also. Then replace the depower line with something longer.
U2U me if you need help. Your main problem, is the kite , if it's a C kite. Btw .. C kite with a bar is worth about $50 USD ($50 for the bar/lines
and $0 for kite).big_d - 15-10-2012 at 10:54 AM
thanks guy I appreciate the help, So I removed the seat belt buckle, I believe the Ocean Rodeo Bronco is a C-kite so I do have a 5th line and plan on
keeping it, I took it off tho, now that white line that the red front line is attached I don't think its a bungee type (I'm assuming bungee types are
stretchy/springy?)
I'm going to attempt to make some changes soon so illl see how it goesbeachrights - 15-10-2012 at 03:11 PM
I wish this issue had come up 2 days earlier- i just sold my Liquid Force Havoc 5th line bar on Fleabay! That and my Pansh would have set you up
cheap- and safe!Bladerunner - 15-10-2012 at 04:58 PM
YES, if the kite has a fifth line attachment then you definately want to rebuild that thing to work as a 5 line.
Here is a link to OR's 5line kit manual. It should give you the basics of how to build your own. http://oceanrodeo.com/images/uploads/kiting/pdf/5th_Line_Man...big_d - 15-10-2012 at 05:02 PM
oh sweet! thanks for that!
damn you guys are goodbeachrights - 15-10-2012 at 06:33 PM
Big-d and I have had several u2u conversations about kites and bars- we need to get him steered in the right direction [no pun intended!] Seems to be
a good guy who just needs some good advice - The amount of info in the above posts from members is outstanding in my opinion [hell, even Sam had some
interesting facts about seatbelt release and deadweight! ]
One thing we have not looked into is there anyone who lives near him that could help in person?van - 15-10-2012 at 07:09 PM
If it's not bungee, the fifth line itself should have a portion that is bungee before it attaches to that line below the trim strap. Both power line
needs to go on top of the trim strap.
Here's a pic I found on the web of a similar setup. You add another ring after the trim strap or farther up the line on a single front line and then
attach both your power line. The fifth line then goes through the metal ring on top of your trim strap.
The manual Bladerunner posted is of the newer design for 5th line where the 5th line goes through your bar. Your will need to make sure your bar has
a hole that is wide enough for the extra line. The newer design actually has issues of the 5th line wrapping around the depower line and not working.
The older design actually works better.
The pic below is pretty much of what your bar is suppose to be setup before it was butchered.
hiaguy - 15-10-2012 at 07:24 PM
big_d is in my neck of the woods. i've sent him a u2u and can meet up as schedules and wind permit.
(just don't think that i'll use the frakenharness :o )van - 15-10-2012 at 07:30 PM
Here's another pic I found on kiteforum.com
big_d - 19-10-2012 at 02:50 PM
okay so I think I am learning and getting somewhere, I tried to copy this set up I found on google images
I don't think I am able to follow the diagram earlier in this thread by van, because all 4 of my lines are 23 meters, and I assume at the end of the
lines (the parts that attach to the kite) when pulled in a straight line, they should be equal, is that correct?big_d - 19-10-2012 at 02:52 PM
page 2 not showing :Sbig_d - 19-10-2012 at 03:02 PM
still cant see my previous post :SBladerunner - 19-10-2012 at 04:39 PM
I can't tell what happens when you pull your safety still?
You need to have the Black line that now runs through the ring attach to a leash or the CL and it should stay secured to your harness when the pin is
pulled. It doesn't appear to do that??? When you pull the pin does the black line remain secured to your harness and the other 3 are free to run up
toward the kite? ( flag on one front line )
That bar looks like 4 line? You REALLY want to set it up as a 5 line to take davantage of the safety + relaunch built into the kite!
Typically all 4 lines equal with the trim wide open and CL at bar is correct. Back lines can be a little longer but both front and both back at least
should match.big_d - 19-10-2012 at 04:58 PM
kk thanks!, yeah I plan to add the 5th line next, I am just not sure which part to attach it to on control bar, as to pulling the pin I have no idea
yet, I havent really tested it yet, want to attach 5th line, then I will tie it to something/test it and make the necessary adjustmentsBladerunner - 19-10-2012 at 05:00 PM
You never show your CL. Notice how the safety pin on the bar in the picture is there. Pull it and it releases the CL so the bar can run up the safety
line as well as the other front line. The safety goes to a leash that goes to your harness.
THAT is what you need to accomplish. Then adding a fifth line is as easy as following Van or OR examples.
( I do see in an early picture your CL has a safety pin ! )
You need to buy a leash and some line for a fifth line ( + stoppers and rings ). I Suggest you buy Q line. Then at a certian point you will at least
have 30m of good Qline . I kite and Frankin'bar you never use but 30m of Qline and a leash to steal from it!
That seller sure was no friend to the kite community!big_d - 19-10-2012 at 05:14 PM
0o0o0o0o0o0o0o0o0 I understand what your saying now! my chicken loop is not attached yet because of that stupid seat belt buckle thing, I removed it
and have not attached it yet, but I will and I will test that safety out 2morrow and see what happens! everything is starting to make sense now,
so I could attached the safety/5th line to the pin on the CL, so when I pull it all 4 lines will go slack, does that make sense?Bladerunner - 19-10-2012 at 05:24 PM
NOPE !
Your Pin on your safety threads through the loop your seat belt is tied to. That is your link. It looks like you can attach the fifth line to a ring
on the right side of the CL? I suppose that might work and save buying a leash but that is starting to get real Mickey Mouse ! Better to make it
proper , with a leash ! Even at that the safety on that CL looks sketchy?
You do seem to be grasping how the kite flags or runs up to fifth line now?big_d - 19-10-2012 at 05:32 PM
yep I understand the flagging now, and yeah there is a ring on right the side of the CL, I might be a bit of a pain but this is the first bar I have
ever looked at or got my hands on, so I really do appreciate the help,Bladerunner - 19-10-2012 at 05:41 PM
It's tough when you don't have someone around. This isn't a perfect way to go but you are learning and that's what you need to do to get that
investment working for you!
That and fly your new RUSH !!!!!!
:wee:
PS note in the OR manual how setting the bar stopper at the right length is important for the fifth line.big_d - 19-10-2012 at 05:45 PM
yeah, and your right its not a perfect way but at least this way I am actually learning how the set up and lines work, rather then buying something
that works right off the start!
but yes will be flying the rush every chance I get :Pvan - 19-10-2012 at 10:37 PM
The drawing is correct for your bar. You just didn't understand it. The drawing is for 27 meter lines on all for. It is setup with a Y style
center line. You can ignore that part and pretend its two separate line going down to the left attachment piece. Your 5th line goes through that
ring. Your first safety is the one above your bar. This safety releases BOTH front lines while your bar stays attached. The trim strap and your two
front line shoots forward. Your kite is now attached by your 5th line and your outside brake lines. Your second safety is your chicken loop. You
only pull the one on the chicken loop to totally release the kite.
The newer design does not have the release above the bar. The first release is on your chicken loop. When pulled, the bar and everything above it
shoots forward. You are attach to only the 5th line. The 5th line usually goes through the bar and attach to something like a leash. The second
release would be the leash. If you want the newer design, then you need to get rid of the above the bar release. You then need to make sure the hole
through the bar is wide enough for the 5th line.
Get with Markite , he's in your area. He can look over your bar and perhaps help you set it up correctly.apextech - 20-10-2012 at 08:58 AM
My .02, The way I see it the main line to the CL broke at one time and someone replaced the QR with that buckle setup, the line used is not kite
quality, probably bought it at the hardware store, either the two center lines attach together on one of the knots at the trim strap or the way you
currently have it and the ring is for a flag line safety. The whole QR needs to be replaced obviously and I wouldn't put any power to it in its
current state. It would probably be advisable to either graft another CL/QR setup on that bar or simply chuck the whole setup and buy a good used
depower bar of some sort that makes sense for safety sake.Bladerunner - 20-10-2012 at 09:08 AM
Dang, I forgot about Markite being so close.
There is your answer ! Get together with Him and you will know in 2 minutes if you have a recoverable system + he will have all the bits needed to
sort you out. Great Guy worth meeting !
:bigok:big_d - 20-10-2012 at 10:44 AM
okay cool thanks guys I appreciate the help, I'm pretty sure I understand how it works now and should be able to handle, I don't have any long term
plans with this, was just suppose to get me startedBladerunner - 20-10-2012 at 11:20 AM
Good because I was thinking what Apex' is about your link point for your safety pin being botched ?
Markite will be a joy to meet . He has been busy in the Ontario kite world for a long time.
