Power Kite Forum

hotwire

ssayre - 8-8-2015 at 12:03 PM



I decided to try hotwire for the buggy. Cost less than $20. The webbing is rated at 433 lbs working load and 1300 lbs breaking point. The shackles are rated for 1200 lbs. I tied an over hand knot to form a loop to larkshead to the frame. Should I have used a figure 8? Am I done? Hopefully I get some wind soon.

ssayre - 8-8-2015 at 12:11 PM

theoretically I could buggy jump now :D

Not sure I'm going to try that but I can't have an OBE now

cheezycheese - 8-8-2015 at 12:20 PM

Make sure you are recording when you turtle shell. I love to see people legs flailing from under the buggy... :D
Be careful...

Randy - 8-8-2015 at 12:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ssayre  
theoretically I could buggy jump now :D



Remember - gravity never takes a day off. :D

ssayre - 8-8-2015 at 12:22 PM

Will do. :P

I think this will allow me to hold down more power than with a harness. When it pulls hard, I start getting twisted around towards the direction of pull. This way I can keep all of my weight opposite of the pull.

B-Roc - 8-8-2015 at 01:46 PM

Kitguru uses a hotwire setup and the only time I ever had success in a buggy was with his setup. Is it potentially more dangerous... I suppose so but for me, as a total beginner in the buggy, it was the only way I could hold on to the kite in a powered donwloop and not have an OBE. He use to always size up because the kite is pulling the weight of the kiter and the buggy as opposed to the kiter only who's trying to stay in the buggy.

Course, I did see him take two major spills, and one was upside down into the Atlantic. Don't know if either was avoidable but when he crashed it was always upside down and then your stuck until you can pop the safety and the kite is still flagging or pulling away.

You should consider some kind of quick release shackle for either the kite or yourself or both. Doesn't look like your setup has one.

ssayre - 8-8-2015 at 01:58 PM

When I hit the chicken loop release it will release the kite from the buggy and me from both

skimtwashington - 8-8-2015 at 02:14 PM

An Auto quick release might be better...?

Wondering.... if things suddenly go bad..... the motion to hand release may not happen quick enough or your hand might not get there before you `turtle' and then good luck trying to get at it with you laying on top of it..:puzzled: not sure how likely a scene...

I'd like to hear from more experienced opinion on this.







3shot - 8-8-2015 at 02:22 PM

WELDNGOD has some info every hotwire pilot should review before trying the first time. He can also tell you what the inside of your clavical looks like.... That's with clean beach wind too!

Everything has an inherent risk, but hotwire flirts with disaster. I know thats debatable, but just saying'.
In my humble opinion...

John Holgate - 8-8-2015 at 04:52 PM


Quote:

Not sure I'm going to try that but I can't have an OBE now


That's quite true. You'll stay firmly attached in your buggy while it flips and lands you upside down on your head. And when you're upside down, you can lose track of the kite and primary safety. I did this with my 6.5m Method and I am SO lucky it sat nose first on the ground and did not loop as I couldn't see it or reach my primary safety. (I was belted in, not hotwired).

Gumnuts also ended up on his head the first time he hooked up the hotwire - he's got it on video on XK.

Obewan got a fright when he suddenly found himself on two wheels at Kingston with his first trip with the hotwire system too.

What I'm saying is please use caution and fly in moderate conditions when starting out with the hotwire system - keep in mind you won't be able to feel the power of the kite in quite the same way. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a hell of a good system and last time out on the beach with the NS2's I flew with the hotwire for 4 hours without any strain on the bod - it was brilliant. But it's not too hard to flip a bug...:D

I don't think an auto quick release can work with a hotwire system as you're going to remain in your seat no matter what.

Windstruck - 8-8-2015 at 04:54 PM

"Danger Will Robinson" was already taken so I settled for the next best thing.

Sean, this scene is what I was thinking of when hearing about your hot wiring.

Careful dude!

skimtwashington - 8-8-2015 at 05:04 PM

Man.. if you flip you wanna get free..





..and don't do anything out under thunder and lightning skies!

:bouncy: :bouncy:

soliver - 8-8-2015 at 05:15 PM

There is a big contingency of guys over on XK and a very extensive thread about Hotwiring, if I'm right Sean, I imagine that is where this is coming from. I personally have no interest primarily because of what John was saying above, I like the direct feeling the kite directs to the harness. I have the advantage of having the Stinger "race buggy" style rails that really give you a lot of security holding you in, and have had the buggy off the ground a bit in the past (very awesome sensation).... not to mention that I frequently find myself in light wind situations that require me to frequently get OUT of the buggy to reset the kite.

All's I can say Sean is do what you do, but be careful of course!.

Windstruck - 8-8-2015 at 06:35 PM

Sean, here's a good example of a guy hotwired to his rig. Can you play guitar? We know John can! :lol:





ssayre - 9-8-2015 at 02:49 AM

Quote: Originally posted by soliver  
There is a big contingency of guys over on XK and a very extensive thread about Hotwiring, if I'm right Sean, I imagine that is where this is coming from. I personally have no interest primarily because of what John was saying above, I like the direct feeling the kite directs to the harness. I have the advantage of having the Stinger "race buggy" style rails that really give you a lot of security holding you in, and have had the buggy off the ground a bit in the past (very awesome sensation).... not to mention that I frequently find myself in light wind situations that require me to frequently get OUT of the buggy to reset the kite.

All's I can say Sean is do what you do, but be careful of course!.


I hadn't noticed that thread Spencer. :saint::saint:

Thanks for the input, the videos were extremely helpful :lol:

They were entertaining though.

The main problem I foresee with my set up is the lack of wind this weekend to test it :evil:

Seriously though, just like when getting a new kite, I plan on choosing conditions wisely. I might not even like it, but it seemed easy enough to put together that I wanted to give it a whirl.

I still need to drill and bolt my side rails to the rear axle where they slip over in the event something doesn't go according to plan.

dangerdan - 9-8-2015 at 05:57 AM

Has anyone considered using a roll bar on their buggy like they use on tractors. I can see the benefit if an OBE happens but since I have never used a buggy I don't know if this is practical.

abkayak - 9-8-2015 at 06:31 AM

Imo...I think most would prefer to have as little hard stuff around them as possible...except a helmet..and be away from the bug when things go bad...but my obe's land me in the sand

Windstruck - 9-8-2015 at 06:58 AM

Dangerdan - I would think the trade off would be net negative. This would add a lot of bulk to the buggy and would be in a third dimension if you will, greatly increasing transportation hassles, not to mention weight which is already an issue. For a roll bar to be effective in a hard turtle crash it would have to be very stout and firmly attached to the main frame. Short of some elaborate quick release system I'd think this would make it a permanent feature so transport issues become a real hassle.

I'm with abkayak, I want as little metal around me as possible when things go South. Good thought though. A better idea might be to talk Sean out of this latest lark. Hey, Wind Gods, please start blowing in Indy so he can stop fantasizing so much. :P

ssayre - 9-8-2015 at 07:18 AM

Lol Steve. That's a good one. I wouldn't have added the Hotwire had the wind been blowing so your right about the fantasizing.

WELDNGOD - 9-8-2015 at 07:27 AM


Sean captive systems are nice ... But when the fecal matter hits the rotary device.... You won't have time.:no:

https://vimeo.com/16678110 I broke my shoulder in this video. Got a surgery and 5 mos. out of work....

WELDNGOD - 9-8-2015 at 07:29 AM

I still ride hot from time to time. So ,I can't tell anyone NOT to do it. Just want all to know "you're in it until the dust settles".

ssayre - 9-8-2015 at 09:20 AM

Thanks for the cautionary words Donnie. great video too except for getting hurt.

A couple differences are you definitely like to go faster than I and not sure what the kite was but mine I'm sure are forgiving in comparison. That's not to say there's no risk but just a calculated risk. I think it would be nice for my bumpy surface because it feels like I'm trying to be pulled out on the big bumps. I think there could be some safety advantages. I will proceed with caution but I'm going to try it out. I'm also going to do some test safety releases with the peaks and ns2's to eliminate surprises.

WELDNGOD - 9-8-2015 at 09:54 AM

kite is a 4.2m PKD Combat.:D

ssayre - 9-8-2015 at 02:54 PM

With careful planning and getting church and chores done and knowing I had a possibility of a little wind briefly this afternoon, I was able to sneak out for about 45 minutes. Wind was 8-12 but more 8 than 12 so was very underpowered using the 7m ns2. Need more wind for a good test but was able to try it out. It felt unusual not having the power come through the harness but didn't feel as strange as I thought it would. You still interpret the wind but with a slightly different set of clues. It was more comfortable. That was enough to keep me intrigued and look forward to a more aggressive session. It didn't at all feel less safe but I was in very light wind so I guess that's no surprise. I do think it's going to leave my but planted more firmly in the seat on bumpy ground and I can tell I will feel like holding down more power than normal.

John Holgate - 9-8-2015 at 03:25 PM


Quote:

Has anyone considered using a roll bar on their buggy like they use on tractors. I can see the benefit if an OBE happens but since I have never used a buggy I don't know if this is practical.


If I was going to do a big inland trip somewhere with gusty conditions (like the Mongolia trip) I would definitely hotwire to take the strain off the bod and I would definitely rig up a roll bar on the back axle. Something like the alloy racks you see in the back of utes/pickups. The hard part is finding something to brace it to so it doesn't just fold over (quite possibly on your head!). I haven't been able to work a good bracing system for the Vmax out yet.

Come to think of it, I was going to do a big trip, I'd get a whole axle/luggage rack/roll bar unit made up. Something along the lines of the Libre Expedition buggy but with a wider luggage space so you could have a triangular brace to the roll bar.

On the Mad Way South trip, one of the riders had a really nasty crash - I think the whole buggy got lofted and thrown into some rocks and the rider was either belted in or hotwired. So I think the roll bar idea has merit. But yes, it may be heavy and hard to transport.

Skye's Spider Crab Buggy has a roll bar on the back too.

indigo_wolf - 9-8-2015 at 04:15 PM

Quote: Originally posted by John Holgate  

Come to think of it, I was going to do a big trip, I'd get a whole axle/luggage rack/roll bar unit made up. Something along the lines of the Libre Expedition buggy but with a wider luggage space so you could have a triangular brace to the roll bar.


Perhaps a buggy version of the "Tiger Cage."

Note: Bolt in assembly allows for easier transport.



ATB,
Sam

John Holgate - 9-8-2015 at 09:29 PM

That's almost what I was thinking Sam. Axle directly below the roll bar and luggage rack between axle and the rear braces as shown above. May not need the forward bracing bars if the axle is pretty solidly bolted to the side rails. Added bonus of more gopro mounting spots. And you could trail a single line kite/kap rig behind you off the top of the roll bar. And if the luggage rack is solid enough, you can pick up hitchhikers.

While we're at it, let's hook up a second axle at the rear with a electric hub drive motor. :D Geez, now you've got the cogs churning....unless that's the caffeine kicking in....

greasehopper - 10-8-2015 at 06:44 AM

One of the greatest virtues of this sport is the fact that it's only as extreme as you let it become. To generate power, a kite must have an anchor. Let go of the kite at the right time and the danger factor dissipates rapidly. Hang on to the kite a fraction of a second too long and the result can be deadly.

All this to say, whatever you choose to do, make damn good and sure that you have rehearsed your exit strategy until you can't get it wrong. The mere act of exercising your "safety devise" will show up the flaws soon enough. Do this BEFORE you need it or pay the price.

I know this sounds all hard-ass and sterile but, I've already played stupid games and won stupid prizes. Do as you please.

ssayre - 10-8-2015 at 06:49 AM

Thank you greasehopper. I fully plan on testing the safety. I'm also going to replace my shackles with larger welded rings and to prevent any snags. Typically I usually choose to work the kite some instead of riding full tilt. I will work my way up the wind ladder slowly with safety tests and mods as needed. That's all if I end up liking it. If I don't I'll just go back to harness

Demoknight - 10-8-2015 at 09:51 AM

Sean, I feel your pain when it comes to riding the PL Comp over bumpy stuff. That was the main reason I went for a VTT rig. Larger seat with higher side rails so I don't easily bounce out. Now, I can keep both hands on the kite if I want, rather than always dedicate one hand to keeping the buggy under my butt. Sometimes I still feel like trying out a hotwire system myself because my buggy isn't crazy heavy, and I actually do want to give jumping a try. I love love love static jumping, especially with my 19m Speed now. I want to start having the ability to jump in the buggy as well.

ssayre - 10-8-2015 at 10:00 AM

here is a buggy jumping video for you errol: https://vimeo.com/82937453

I definitely won't be doing that.

Like you said, it would be nice when going over ruts and bumps to remain seated :) That's the driving force behind it for me.

3shot - 10-8-2015 at 02:17 PM

Hey Errol, You could float your buggy over all those rivlets and tidal pool runoffs at JIBE! :Ange09:

ssayre - 10-8-2015 at 02:25 PM

Errol, watching the video of you jumping with the reactor, I can only imagine what your doing with the speed.

My blade is an incredible jumping machine. I can't believe how easily it can lift my large frame in 10 mph wind. I don't have the guts or will in my area to try it in any higher winds so my jumps are micro sized but I've still had some unplanned higher ones. There is an extremely fine line between toying around and a lofting with that one but it always sets me down gently.

Proletariat - 11-8-2015 at 08:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by WELDNGOD  


https://vimeo.com/16678110 I broke my shoulder in this video. Got a surgery and 5 mos. out of work....


Primus sucks :)

Demoknight - 17-8-2015 at 12:49 PM

Haha, Jason that is one of the ideas I had that would make a great few clips of footage. Small features like that to jump over would be a blast.

Sean, the Speed is meant for catching air. It is a really gentle park and ride engine, but the most fun I have had with it so far was during a 17-18mph wind day at Myrtle Beach. I didn't have my buggy with me, as I flew down to be with family. It was all static flying. My small jumps were getting my feet 6-8' off the ground, and the perfect timing jumps during puffs were putting me eye level with the second story balconies on the beach houses. My guess is feet 16-20' above ground. I was able to see the street over the sand dunes and wave at my family down below me before setting down like a feather 30 feet down wind. I have never felt so safe under a kite before. My Charger will still drop me if I make a mistake. The Speed rewards good timing and redirecting with a soft landing on your toes, and if you just ignore redirecting and keep the kite at 12 o'clock and the bar in, you get set down about as hard as hopping off a step stool.

The first time I caught legit good air on the Speed, I was scared going up because I just didn't stop going up. I kept going up and up and up, higher than I ever did on the Charger. I was so ready for it to just drop me. Once I started coming down, the descent was so gentle I instantly gained a ton of confidence. I think the 19m is the only kite I have that I would feel comfortable jumping my buggy under. It is just so much kite. It is just shy of Paraglider size, and you can really tell. Even though it has so much power, it is so smooth and predictable.

My 8.6m Reactor is currently my favorite FB I have jumped with, but I haven't flown a 8.5m Blade yet. I would love to try a VIP if I had the chance.

ssayre - 23-8-2015 at 04:44 PM

Spent 3 hours today in the hotwire which was my first powered trial of it. I was on the peak in winds from 10-20. The first hour I spent getting to know it. After some time on it I felt like an invincible kite buggier. I could chuck the kite around as I pleased and it would kind of auto correct the direction of the buggy. It was the most power from a kite I've never felt. It really worked well and I'm definitely hooked. I stayed in the seat over extremely bumpy ground and could maintain 2 hands on the bar without trying to hold myself to the buggy. It was amazing sending the kite where and how I wanted and it would just rip the buggy around to the kite instead of trying to pull me out. I fired the safety under load and worked fine. I'll probably fine tune the set up a little, but it was a great day and test of a new and different way of harnessing the wind.

ssayre - 23-8-2015 at 04:51 PM

It was the most comfortable I have been. I could have ridden all day. It really seems like the lazy man's way to buggy.

Cheddarhead - 23-8-2015 at 06:02 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ssayre  
It was the most comfortable I have been. I could have ridden all day. It really seems like the lazy man's way to buggy.


Buggying in general makes me lazy and soft compared to the kite skiing I do in winter. After all the seat time I've had this summer I'll have to get back in shape before I click on the skis.

Windstruck - 23-8-2015 at 06:48 PM

Happy for you Sean! That set up looks great. I have to hand it to you, you had some stones to try this. Sounds like you had a great time. :D

ssayre - 24-8-2015 at 03:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Windstruck  
Happy for you Sean! That set up looks great. I have to hand it to you, you had some stones to try this. Sounds like you had a great time. :D


Thanks Steve, I'll have to admit that it did take a little courage to hook to it on a windy day. Then it took a little faith to test the safety under load, but once I had done that and had confidence, it felt safer than ever! Seriously, with it being slightly front biased, it would auto correct buggy direction. It was awesome.

ssayre - 24-8-2015 at 03:35 AM

Plus I'm in a light buggy where the consequence of turtle shell would be less. I think it would work even better with a heavy buggy but the consequences of flipping would be worse

ssayre - 24-8-2015 at 07:37 AM

The hotwire is not what takes nearly as much courage as my asphalt addiction. Learning to ride asphalt versus grass takes some learning. I'm just now confidently riding asphalt hooked in or hotwired.

WELDNGOD - 24-8-2015 at 07:42 AM

Now you need to ditch the BAR and really be in tune with the kite on HANDLES.

ssayre - 24-8-2015 at 07:46 AM

I've said this before and I'll say it again. I regard fb flying as the highest level of skill and risk. I will make a return to them when I get bored of my lazy mans quiver.

Demoknight - 24-8-2015 at 09:28 AM

Fixed bridles are great fun in coastal winds, but I won't do much flying of any FB kite I own outside of a beach.

3shot - 24-8-2015 at 09:38 AM

Yeah. I rocked handles all week at JIBE except for one day of Nasa Stars. Just sooooo much control. Glad you are digging the lock in Sean.

ssayre - 8-9-2015 at 06:17 PM

Very good wind today but I was banished to a public park as I can't use my school spot during the day. The park has an area that is sandwiched between a sledding hill and a tree line so very turbulent. I'm using the Hotwire in almost all situations now but today tested my resolve. I was a little hesitant but it handled it great. I really love the blast off from launching from the buggy in high wind. the gusty wind caused a slight accidental jump that went well. I'm impressed by feeling safe. I'm certain that would have resulted in an obe in a harness. This spot is so sketchy but I couldn't waste good wind. Session ended with successful deployment of the safety when I let the kite get behind me at a bad time. Hopefully it's the end of the wind drought.

Windstruck - 8-9-2015 at 08:00 PM

Sean - sounds like you are well on your way towards mastering your new craft. May the wind always blow strongly in your direction.

ssayre - 12-9-2015 at 07:28 AM

I beefed up the hotwire and used retired fall arrest harnesses from my work. I know they are plenty strong but wanted to hear opinions on 2 straps versus 3. I'm thinking I will like the 2 strap method better so there isn't pull on the front end, but not sure what would happen if lifted



WELDNGOD - 12-9-2015 at 09:00 AM

That's a bit o'kill. I use two dyneema cords with a loop at each end then choke it around the siderails. At the other ends are stainless rings. I would stick with two attachment points, and try to get the balance just right. You are correct in that you don't want to be pulling on your front end. And if you ever start picking up one wheel,go down in size of kite or go home. I had two warnings before I broke my shoulder and I didn't listen.

ssayre - 12-9-2015 at 09:15 AM

Thanks man, I'm listening. I don't push too hard. Yes it is overkill. My siderail will brake before the Hotwire. I mainly wanted something larger diameter for the cl to pass through. My ns2 has a metal piece that hast to slip through everything and I didn't want it to snag. My peak wasn't an issue with that.

oldben - 27-3-2017 at 05:30 PM

So decided to bump this back into discussion to see what Sean has to say about his experiences.

When he sent me pics of the bug the hotwire was on it. I see he wisely "forgot" to pack it to keep an old noob safe.

Whats the conclusion? Is the main issue bailing in time?
Seems we are choosing between two evils here being dumped on the head or an OBE. The head landing definitely sounds worse but OBEs dont sound like a bunch of fun either. Making the bug carry the load makes the most sense(to me) if it could be refined and made safe.
I spent a good part of the afternoon reading about towing paragliders and the dreaded lock out, and all the finer points and safeties they employ. They have a weak link in the system, breaks when all else fails. Doesnt do much for a lock out though. Maybe any Pgliders could chime in here.

Any progress been made on hotwiring?

ssayre - 28-3-2017 at 08:22 AM

Hey ben, it depends who you ask. most of the NZ and Australian riders use hotwire. I liked using a hotwire on my bumpy fields because I stayed seated going over bumpy ground that the pull of the kite wanted to pull me out in a harness. My wind dictated if I would use it. In decently steady wind, I preferred the hotwire. In gust lull wind where I thought I might have to relaunch the kite semi frequently then I would use harness. One of the pitfalls of hotwire is having to launch while seated and hooked in. It's ok in decent wind but a pain in light wind. One of the great things about hotwire is it takes all the load off of your body. As far as safety is concerned, I felt safe using it. I had mine set up so that when I hit the safety, the kite released from the buggy and I was free of both. A freak gust won't give you time to react but that's no different than when using the harness. Also, a standard buggy is light enough that it won't injure as badly as a heavy buggy when turtled. However, a heavy wider buggy is less likely to turtle. That's the pickle.

Either way, you will want to get completely comfortable flying your kites in a harness and knowing how your kites behave before moving to hotwire. You don't want to be crashing or relaunching while trying to use a hotwire.

abkayak - 28-3-2017 at 09:05 AM

to each their own...i wouldn't ever consider this

ssayre - 28-3-2017 at 12:27 PM

Quote: Originally posted by abkayak  
to each their own...i wouldn't ever consider this


Don't know why this would bother you. You don't strike me as a conservative rider :D

Demoknight - 28-3-2017 at 12:37 PM

I flew my buggy hotwired once. The whole thing actually sketched me out a bit. It is eery not being able to feel my kite. I prefer to fly a bit overpowered most of the time. While I was trying it the first time on my slightly bumpy beach, I was bouncing along and had my upwind rear wheel lift off the ground due to the side pull of the kite and a moment of really great traction. It spooked me pretty good because I could tell that if I hadn't been so quick to let the bar out I would have flipped it within the first 5 minutes. I may consider trying it out on Jekyll again since the beach is so smooth and hard packed, but I don't think I will be using it on an uneven surface again.

abkayak - 28-3-2017 at 01:23 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ssayre  
Quote: Originally posted by abkayak  
to each their own...i wouldn't ever consider this


Don't know why this would bother you. You don't strike me as a conservative rider :D


my politics are conservative my riding not so much
I obe most times out when its blowing good..i only ride the beach and I've been falling all my life doing all sorts of stuff...it may be why i like it so much...Mom says i wasn't her smartest kid
but i don't want to be in the bug thats just me

oldben - 28-3-2017 at 02:12 PM

So many great opinions/thoughts.

There has got to be something that could be done to make hotwiring or something similar work to take or share the load.

I obviously know nothing about buggying at this point but that doesnt keep my wheels from turning(hehe)

I tend to agree with Sean that at least with the little PL buggy thats not much to have on your back, not that I really
want to, any more that I want to go exiting the bug in an OBE.

Seems the main thing here is not making the choice on which way you want to get brown trousers, but figuring out a way
that is generally accepted by most to extend the duration and relative comfort of buggying, while not increasing the current risks by any great degree.

I get the numbing of feel for the kite. Maybe the addition of a pulley on an extended rope from the chicken loop to the bar with the loop still hooked to the harness. You could easily/quickly latch the pulley to the bug when getting in, sit straight in the bug and fly the kite as usual with the bar and have feel at the harness. EXCEPT is should be reduced by half and the bug is sharing the other half. With a common chicken loop release added to the rope it would travel right thru the pulley as you wave it all good by.

Am I nuts here?


Brant - 28-3-2017 at 05:38 PM

Quote: Originally posted by oldben  


Am I nuts here?



Yes. Welcome to the nuthouse, where we fly kites that have the ability to kill us for fun!

In regards to the Hotwire, I don't buggy, so beats me. Good luck though!

oldben - 28-3-2017 at 06:25 PM

Thanks for the reply!

I thought so.

John Holgate - 28-3-2017 at 08:35 PM


Quote:

Am I nuts here?


yep. Definitely over thinking things! Best thing you can do is take the Nasa's and spend many hours in the bug........THEN you'll start to get a feel for the whole hotwire/lapbelt/harness argument.

I hotwire occasionally - when I'm going to be spending many hours in the buggy and doing long runs in one direction and I'm completely confident in the wind and my kite. Most of the time I just use my harness and I can only remember one time when I was lifted slightly by a nasa star - they are one of the least likely kites to lift you vertically.

I did use to put a lap belt on to hold myself in the buggy. Until I flipped it and ended up with the whole weight of the buggy on my head, the bar unsighted along with the kite, the safety out of reach and kite fully inflated. Fortunately it was upside down, like me, and stayed there - had it started to spiral I would have been in really serious trouble.

One of the Mad Way South ?? crew (the guys that kited through parts of Africa) was hotwired in, got lofted and smashed into boulders upside down and was lucky to walk away with either a dislocated or broken arm - can't remember which but it does go to show how much power you can be dealing with and sometimes completely unexpectedly - you don't want anything else attached to you in that instance.

spend your time learning the buggy in mild conditions where you shouldn't have to worry about stuff like an OBE. My last OBE was caused by concentrating on trying to do my lap belt up in the buggy - distraction and lost concentration on where the kite was. Oh, and don't launch from the buggy, side-on in soft sand...that can end badly too.

come to think of it, my last two accidents were either caused by messing around with a lap belt, or being held in by a lap belt - had I not been held in, I would have just been lifted out and deposited on the soft sand without the buggy on my head.

If you need back extra back support, just buy one of those canoe seats that strap in - they work pretty well from what I've been told.

Demoknight - 31-3-2017 at 08:04 AM

Here is the way I look at it: OBEs aren't always bad. I have at least one almost every time I fly, and I consider myself a pretty skilled pilot when it comes to the buggy. The cool part about OBEs is that once you have a few, you learn how to handle them better. A lot of the time if I get pulled out of my seat, I have the reactions now to be able to fly the kite and land on my feet. Your chances of breaking bones and throwing out shoulders are way higher when you land on your shoulders/head/neck, no matter how tiny your Peter(Lynn) is.

When you hotwire, you can't OBE. You are along for the ride, and it will probably hurt pretty bad and cost you a collar bone or worse if you flip in any size buggy. If you OBE, if you are good, you can make it look like an effortless dismount.

JimSSI - 31-3-2017 at 05:13 PM

'...look like an effortless dismount'....

"It's not a bug, it's a design feature"

TEDWESLEY - 1-4-2017 at 09:09 AM

Like gymnastics, it's all how you stick the landing
Practice, practice, practice

soliver - 1-4-2017 at 04:30 PM

My worst OBE landed me on my feet... I just broke one of them when I hit the ground.

Justsayin'

Blitzhound - 1-4-2017 at 04:32 PM

I had me an OBE not too long ago. I was flying an 8m HQ Neo, the wind was 15-18mph cross shore. So I was making short runs the width of the beach. But...there was an additional 25 years of beach I could ride but it was soft sand. Like the genius I am I decided what the hell. I went as close to the water as possible, made my turn, down looped the kite, poured on the power and went for it. Got about 3/4 the way up into the soft sand and came to a halt. You could hear the lines creeking under the tension it was a little eerie. Now I'm stuck in the sand with the kite side-on. Had another genius moment and decided to loop the kite fully powered up and just power out of it....oh!... She put the power on alright. Lifted my 300# butt AND the Croozer about 4 ft into the air going sideways. Luckily I was able to slip out of the buggy. It landed upside down and I landed gently on my feet. Yelling at my wife...DID YOU SEE THAT!!!?? THAT WAS AWESOME!! I'm not going to tell you wether I think it's a good idea or not but I can tell you. Had I been strapped in. That situation might have had a different outcome. I will tell you if you're going to strap in...Be smarter and/or safer than me. OBE's are not something to fear. But definitely something to respect.

Demoknight - 6-4-2017 at 08:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by soliver  
My worst OBE landed me on my feet... I just broke one of them when I hit the ground.

Justsayin'


How do you think your spine would take it if you were hotwired into the buggy and had that same loft and drop, even wheels down? My guess is a serious spinal injury.

Hotwiring isn't for everyone, and that is the only point I am trying to make. You can tear a rotator cuff or break a collarbone just by slowly flipping over, without the buggy leaving the ground.

I think it pays to have some practice jumping when it comes to OBEs, so if you have a really nasty one that takes you up, you have the muscle memory to redirect the kite as required for a slow descent.