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although would like to know if anyone has any experience with this brand/model, if so are there any reasons why i should or shouldnt buy it, this is what i am looking at in the 5m

I have the 3m Hornet - which I quite like both for static flying and in the buggy. Quality wise they're top notch. I also had the 5m Hornet as a demo for a couple of weeks and didn't really like it that much - a bit too slow and 'lumbering' for my liking and once the wind gets to 15mph or so, it's gonna be a lot of effort to static fly it. Personally, I'd go a 4m. When it was time to get a 5m or bigger, I'd look at a higher aspect ratio kite - viper/reactor/core. don't discount the Flexifoil Rage or Ozone Flow either.

this may be another stupid question, but can anyone say which is the correct measurment for the P.L hornet 2, as i have read on numerous site both 5m and 5 m2, obviously if it is the 5m then the span of the kite is 5m, but if it is 5 m2 what is the actual size/dimensions

as asked previously, if i was to be buying a harness and potentially a buggy, what type of harness would you recommend if i was buying the harness with the kite rather than the buggy

would something like this suffice http://www.powerkiteshop.com/peter_lynn_base_buggy_harness.h... or would i need something stronger?

The measurements for the 5m and 5m2 are the same. It is 5 square meters the actual span is like 2 meters maybe 2 and a half meters. To get the meters you multiply width and height. Math formula looks like this A=LxW.

Here is a link to the actual specs of the hornet 2.http://www.awindofchange.com/product/plhornetII.html

i understand mathematical formulae, just when you dont have something to work with you cant answer the question, i have now found another potential purchase, being the flexifoil blurr, in the 5m, although some sites offer the kite on its own or with a line and handle set up, would anyone recommend a to go for, and handle wise do the have to be the ones listed on the manufacturers website, or can any be used, afterall they arent going ot want to lose out on any money, however small the amount theoretically is

5m Blurr should be pretty good. Flexifoil stuff is excellent quality. Any handles and lines will do from Peter Lynn, Ozone or HQ. PKD do nice handles too I believe. Not sure that you'd save any money by buying the kite by itself then buying lines - I would have thought it would actually cost more that way. You best check out handle & line prices before you decide.

I have an Ozone Base harness with spreader bar and a Dakine Speed Seat - both work well for both static flying and buggying. Think I prefer the Speed Seat - a tad more comfy. The PL Base harness looks a little thin on the padding side..... as it (and the others) are designed for the job, there's no reason you'd need anything stronger.

hi again, i now have two potential kites although i will only be purchasing one of them, the HQ beamer 5 or the flexifoil blurr, both of which will be 5m, are these kites of similar spec and quality as there is roughly £70 extra for the flexifoil, i can get the beamer with stronger lines also, is it worth saving the money and buying some better handles and harness etc or am i better of with the flexifoil?

The Flexifoil Blurr will make the better buggy engine. It will be faster and have better upwind ability. I ended up selling my 2m & 4m Beamers and replaced them with a set of Ozone Methods - which are quite similar to the Blurr. Although I believe the Blurr is a little better again than the Method.

+1 for Blurr over Beamer.

Flexifoil is a top notch company. HQ is trying hard to fit in the top notch as well. As mentioned the Blurr is designed as an engine. It will go faster + better upwind. If you plan to get in motion this is the clear winner. The Beamer has traditionally been an intro , ultra stable , low lift kite but I understand they are changing it up and newest one aren't the intro kite anymore ???

You tend to get what you pay for in this sport. I feel a Blurr is definately worth more than a Beamer.

How did you come to the conclusion that a 5m is a good size to start with ? I can tell you story after story about people who started out on 5m kites and say it was a mistake. MANY of those folks are injured. If going about this safely is your goal you should really be looking at something around 3m to learn CONTROL . You will spend all of your time defending yourself from a 5m and not much time learning CONTROL !

( sorry, I forgot you have some experience , my mind was a blurr. Pun intended!)

i like that "defending yourself from a 5m"...that is so true. 3m kites make you push and grow... 5m kites are so limited till you really know what your doing

I have a 5M Flexifoil Blurr. From my signature you will see that I also have several other Flexifoil kites. The Blurr is much more of a high performance kite than the Beamer. Am I a fan of and slightly biased toward Flexifoil, yes. The Flexifoil quality and performance speaks for itself. Do I also like Peter Lynn? Yes, the value and performance speaks for itself. Flexifoil kites can be on the expensive side so if you can scrounge up some good lines and handles for a song then go for the Blurr. I don't think the Beamers have the AoA feature that lets you adjust the bridle for high, low, or normal wind settings. This feature in and of itself should be one it's main selling points for you as it will make for a much more versatile and higher performing kite. Any of the major brand name handles and linesets will work but as John Holgate already said, I'd double check that you come out paying less still having to find decent handles and lines. Be informed from my personal experience, the Blurr pulls like a truck, but will surprise you with some liftiness too.

AnnieO, since you say you also like P.L., would you recomend the blurr over the P.L. hornet 2, once again in the 5m form

am i correct in thinking that the aspect ratio is like the power to weight ratio with cars, the higher the aspect ratio, the more power/pull the kite will produce

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Originally posted by oldham82 am i correct in thinking that the aspect ratio is like the power to weight ratio with cars, the higher the aspect ratio, the more power/pull the kite will produce

Not exactly.

A higher A/R (aspect ratio) allows air to move over the kite faster (this is due to the fact that turbulence is greatest at the tips, and a higher A/R kite has more kite for the size of the tips). This allows the kite to move faster, which means the kite can develop more power through apparent wind (wind speed from the perspective of the kite).

The downside is that in a gust a high A/R kite will move very quickly, and can develop a lot of power, then in the lull afterwards will overrun the wind and luff. High A/R kites are therefore difficult to fly in gusty wind and are best in smooth coastal winds. A lower A/R kite is better in gusty conditions and is easier to learn to fly.

There is however another factor which determines both how much a kite pulls, and its speed, which is the angle of attack (AOA). AOA is the angle of the kite relative to the direction that it moves through the air. Note that depower kites allow the pilot to vary the AOA to control power. Fixed bridle kites usually do not, but some can be adjusted on the ground.

A high AOA will result in a kite that pulls a lot, to the point that it is so high the kite stalls. High AOA kites are more "lifty" (they will lift you off the ground if the kite is overpowered while directly over your head), these types of kite are good for landboarding or static jumping.

A lower angle of attack will result in a kite that does not pull as much when it is not moving, but will move much faster, and hence can generate substantial power by working the kite (moving it around the wind window). A low AOA kite will not be as lifty, but is good for use in a buggy.

My advice is to get a 2.5 or 3m2 kite with a low A/R (any beginner kite from a reputable manufacturer, e.g. Flow, Beamer, Hornet, Rage). A kite like this will still have plenty of pull, but will allow you to learn kite control. You will learn how to get the kite to pull when YOU want it to, not when the kite does. This kite will then get you going on a landboard or in a buggy, then you can get a larger kite when you need it.

A kite larger than 3m will not be any more use until you are moving, and then the 3m will probably still see plenty of use + you can use it to teach others without scaring them away.

Larger kites do not necessarily fly in less wind, they just develop usable power in less wind, however you won't need this power until you want to move. A smaller kite will still fly in light winds, and will be safer in stronger winds. Hence for static flying a small kite has a much larger windrange, so is more suitable for a first power kite.

I'll throw another kite into the mix:

A 3.3 meter Buster Soulfly for £124 new from here:

http://www.powerkiteshop.com/kites/pkdbuster.htm

That's a screaming deal for a low aspect ratio beginner kite with kite killers and everything else included. Quality wise, it will be about the same as the Hornet or Beamer, but maybe not as nice as a Flexifoil.

My personal opinion is that if you have never flown a kite before, by a cheap, 3 meter beginner kite like a used hornet or Beamer, or maybe that Soulfly. I wouldn't spen much more than £130 or so. Then you'll get an idea of wether the sport is right for you or not. You don't need a harness any time soon. Just learn to fly that kite for a while. You'll find that challenging enough for months of fun.

Don't buy a 5 meter kite as you will only be able to fly it safely in very low winds, which will limit the number of days you can fly. You'll be able to fly the most days with a 3 meter kite. Although the Blur is without a doubt the best quality kite out of all the ones you are considering, and will serve you better if you decide to buggy, it is also the most expensive. All the things about it that make it worth it are things that won't matter much to you yet. You may never get a buggy, or decide to take up landboarding instead. If that's the case, the Blur won't be best for you and some of that money will be wasted. You'll have plenty of time to buy more kites later, and then you'll know enough about what you want that you'll want to go for more expensive kites later.

To use a car analogy, if someone who has never driven before asks you if they should buy a Ford Focus or a Mercedes. The Focus will do fine for quite a while, and there's no reasont o spend the extra cash right away. There's always a chance to buy a Mercedes later on, or perhaps a 4 X 4 or a pickup truck.

There is no comparison between the Burr and Hornet II. The Blurr is much more of a higher performance kite. The Blurr is not as newbie friendly as the Hornett II and be quite lifty- especially in gusty conditions. I love my Blurr but would not want it as my first kite to learn to buggy with. I think the Flexfoil Rage would be a better choice for you for now as far as Flexifoils go. For perspective I would say the Rage sits in the middle between the Beamers/Hornets and the Vipers. The Burr is maybe only slightly better performing than the Vipers but maybe not depending on your conditions.
Of the Peter Lynn kites I would say look for a used or remaining stock Viper/S or used Reactor/RII. If it was me I would skip the Beamers and Hornets because there are kites available that offer a bunch more performance that are still pretty newbie friendly.

A Reactor II is not suitable for a beginner.

another question to narrow options down, handles or bar, as in control methods?

There are a few different options with bars - some better than others depending on the kite. If you match the wrong bar to the kite you'll end up disappointed with a poorly performing kite. For a start, stick with handles. Later you can add a strop/pulley & harness and fly hooked in when you're confident. Bars can wait.....

For a fixed bridle kite, learn kite control using handles before considering using a bar.

Research and get real average winds for place(s) you go at the times of year you go. It will help make better determination and recommendations. If it's all over the place... think 'middle' for the moment.

Many sites have such wind history for an area.


If you want to start w/one you can ride with.... sure. But there will be limits. Better to start with a middle wind , middle(or low to middle) aspect kite if you have no better wind speed average info and with limited experience. You won't be able to move at all in some cases or ride safely on other days in other cases. But you may be able to ride a goodly amount of days with a middle-range kite. Few start w/ a full quiver ( because of commitment or cash is not there yet)!)... otherwise this first choice wouldn't be an issue.

If you usually have low winds the 5m may be appropriate.May..
A 3-4 m would be a better, safer size to start with.


Remember not all same meter sized kites have same power.
Low aspect, middle aspect , and high aspect can mean significantly different power in same surface area size(meters). With that knowledge you may even want to size down...or up.

"defending against a 5m"...right on!

You WILL eventually need a quiver. You can't have one do it all anyway.
You will be able to pick the right size for that day and hour, switch, switch again- and not get in trouble.

Good luck.:roll: