i was lazy so i just tied a knot in the top bridle about 3"

prob a typo...........I used to 6" knot on my 16 and worked fine for me throughout its windrange.............anything beyond that youve got the trim strap..................

Quote:

Originally posted by power How often do the arcs even touch the ground during a flying session? I've heard that you can fly em for months and never have them touch the ground except for on takeoff and landing because of the autozenith... Also, how bad is the scorp for relaunch on water?

I made some snide remark some time back about "how could you crash an ARC?"... then I had my ass justly handed to me shortly thereafter. Two scenarios come to mind...

1) you are flying at the low end of the wind range and then the wind just stops for a moment. Flying at speed, you could get through this with momentum and apparent wind, but one day I was putting the kite down so it was slow. The wind died and the kite inverted and started t o fall. Then a puff came up. I pulled the safety to slack the lines and just dump it. the line tension was not enough to free the Velcro on the landing handle (and I did not reach fast enough to free it) but the tension was strong enough to power the kite into the ground inverted and inside out. the sticks cut through the plastic tips and the front of the pockets. Lesson: In light winds dumping the kite, free the Velcro on the landing handles by hand first.

2) Sometimes it is easy to get mixed up, maybe in a turn gone bad or evasive action, get the bar spun around and then grab the wrong end of the bar, sending it into the ground instead of the other way before you notice and recover. I've done this and always been able to recover in time, but I can see it happening and ending badly if it's already close to the ground.

But these aside, they are rock stable and predictable.

Can they be reverse launched?

Quote:

Originally posted by power Can they be reverse launched?

No.....aj

How do you relaunch if they land leading edge down?

Quote:

Originally posted by power How do you relaunch if they land leading edge down?

the "taco" thing much earlier in this thread....

O ya that's right. Basically it seems like the synergy is an overall better kite than the scorp, but I guess it comes down to money really.

the synergy was the most recent arc 'til the charger came on the scene.

the scorpion is a bit older than the synergy, which was a big jump up from the Venom II.

scorp is land-based, fwiw, so it sits outside the progression of PL's water kites a bit.

i beleive the charger is meant to bring the land-based lines and the water-based lines back together again in a single range of arcs??? idk tho... phantom AR with charger profile would be interesting....

Quote:

Originally posted by power How do you relaunch if they land leading edge down?

if it is that way because it inverted / turned inside out, you can walk towards it and hope it flips right side out.

good call AC that one works........................:duh::duh:

Where do you attach the pigtail extensions? Where can I get the rope for them?

They attach to the rear leaders on the kite.

Rear Bridle Attachments- where the rear lines attach.
I go to the marine store and get some running line, preferably Dyneema or Spectra, about 1/8".
Double it over and tie figure eight knots at intervals. that leaves a loop at one end to larkshead to the bridle.

If you are looking for 1/8" Amsteel, you can pick it up from West Marine, Defender, your boating/marine supply store of choice.

If you have problems getting give me a holler.... the West Marine is about 20-30 minutes from me unless traffic is hosed and I still have a fair supply of it.

ATB,
Sam

So its basically an extension from the flying lines to the kite? Can you send me some of the line?

Is this the stuff in 1/8"?
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte...
I might get some if no one can ship it out.

And this is cheaper...
http://tinyurl.com/y8nz8pv

How much of this do I need to make the pigtail extensions for the 16m scorpion? How much of a difference do the pigtails make in performance of flight?

It can make all the differance in the world. The kite will stall earlier than it normally would with properly trimmed lines. If your lines are not tuned to the proper length then you have to compensate for it with your trim strap. Doing this will reduce the amount of depower available with the trim. Once you run out of trimstrap you run out of the available depower there.

Power....

Good to talk to you. Here are the West Marines in your neck of the woods.

http://snipurl.com/tordt

Let me know how things go on your end.

ATB,
Sam

None of the stores have the stuff Angus suggested. But the store in alexandria has 1/8" amsteel, and I can probably go pick that up tomorow. Will that work just as well?

Size your pieces long enough to be doubled over but allow more extra length for the knots than you would think. At that diameter, an overhand knot will eat up a couple of inches and a figure-eight knot a lot more, so if you are going to have knots every 2 inches or so to experiment with, you will need twice the length of the pigtail (times 2 doubled up.)
Make one out of scrap cheap line first and see how much it takes before you cut the good stuff.

So how much should I buy for both pigtails?

Quote:

Originally posted by power None of the stores have the stuff Angus suggested. But the store in alexandria has 1/8" amsteel, and I can probably go pick that up tomorow. Will that work just as well?

It'll work. Angus was just pointing you to the dyneema line because it's about $0.30 cheaper a foot. and still has a breaking strength sufficient to hold back a small herd of antelopes. Of course, depending on where you fly, antelopes might not be a concern.

ATB,
Sam

Great. I like amsteel in general more than dyneema anyway. But how much should I buy?

OK, back from the garage with some scrap. 3 1/2' doubled over will yield one 9" tail with knots at 2,4,6,8" spots, plus a little extra to trim off neat. plenty of room to play with.
Make the first knot farther than 2" from the loop end to allow the room the larkshead takes up. So about 7' should do ya. My test cord was thicker than 1/8" so my measurements will be generous in your favor since my thicker cord ate up more length in the knots.

Ok correct me if I'm wrong, 7 feet total cord (3.5 feet for each pigtail), knots at 2,4,6 and 8" + a little extra from the larks head knot so the first knot will really be at around 3" and the 8" inch knot will be at 9" from the end of the loop, the loop end connects to the trailing edge bridles and the other end connects to the flying lines? I think that's right. What knot do you think I should attach the flying lines to? What kind of knot would be the best stopper knot for this purpose? This last thing may sound dumb, but what is the best way to tie the knots so that both pigtails have knots at the exact same spots?

Figure eight knot is a good stopper knot. I can help you with that one, since I'll be there with the kite.

A figure 8 knot will be very bulky on that line doubled over and will eat up another 2-3" per knot. An overhead knot reduces breaking strength more, but at 2100+ lbs, you have room even if it cuts strength by 1/2 which I doubt when doubled

here are both knots...
http://www.coastalwindsports.com/FigureOfEightKnotTutorial.h...