I do not have a video but I think I am pretty good at written communication [a reprise of a comment I posted a few months ago on a similar thread]

For visualization let us say that you are in the buggy with the kite over your right shoulder/ side flying forward. The left/ port tip of the kite is towards the ground and the starboard tip is the highpoint of the kite. Raise the kite in the window so that you have at least 1 -1.5 kite widths between the bottom tip and the ground.
An upturn would be a kite rotation around the top/ starboard tip. I use this type turn for a steady or decelleration turn as the kite will slow down as it rotates up.
A downturn is the kite rotating around the bottom [in this case port] tip which is why you need the ground clearance. This turn accelerates the kite and therefor the buggy.
Hope that helps
cheers
John [an advance beginer/ retarded intermediate buggyer]

Quote:

Originally posted by soliver Down turn = looping the kite downward and turning downwind and back the other direction in the bug

That's exactly it. Start with the kite high enough to turn down under itself.

this post is to get me on the second page

well that didnt work, it wont let me on the second page, oh well enjoy (edit) this one got me here...weird

When the forum does that, just go in and change your "posts per page" in user settings. It makes it go away for a while. I usually float between 50 and 60 as I need to change it to get to the last post on a thread.

MDK, same here with that 2nd page, I wonder why it's doing that....yet I will try what Bob offered
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Just came back from the beach, wind was not strong enough, but enough for me to try that 'down under' turn. Honestly, I think the upper side worked better for me. Maybe it was the low wind, but I've found that down under doesn't give me enough pull to 'sling' me out from the turn, as much as the high kite turn.

Avin when conditions are good you will pull a turn and come out of it sideways

and you will be stocked.

Just keep doing them

:bigok:

Thanks nocando, I will :smug:

BTW, as a general question, when riding the buggy, is it better to use handles or control bar ?
Most of the clips I saw so far, especially the one with some 'air time' & other tricks, uses the handles.
So I was just wondering if you'll get a better control with them Vs a bar

Quote:

BTW, as a general question, when riding the buggy, is it better to use handles or control bar ?

Handles are smaller, lighter, less likely to bash into things and offer full control of both power and brake lines.

Bars - really depends on the type of bar....brakes to the center, brakes to the outside, crossover, turbo or depower bar. And more importantly, matching the right kite to the right bar. Stick a small Century or Reactor on a turbo bar and it will stall nearly every time you go to turn it. But with the right kite on the turbo bar you can pull both brakes with one hand and you can pull the big red safety 'knob' to dump the kite onto the brakes. Personally, I'm more comfy with a bar in the buggy and there's never anything I need to do with the kite that I can't do with a Turbo Bar. But they are relatively expensive and a bit clunky.

Depower kites come with bars and it's pretty well the only way to fly them. Handles for everything else. Unless, like me, you're more comfy in the buggy with a bar - particularly one handed so I can film with the other. Horses for courses!

You've read my mind John, the 'one hand' grip (well, and lets be unest, less work) is what makes the bar (I think) more appealing.
When I started with that sport, I've practice with handles only. Only when I went on the water, I've discovered the greatness of the bar and how much less work it takes from you.
I know that you'll get more controll with the handles, since it's like steering with 4 wheels, but woooww to the sore muscles after the session....

Sorry to make such a big stink with the "down turn" bit,... Just wanted to share my good experience with it.

AviN, lets just both keep doing whatever works and eventually we'll be cool enough to not be newbies anymore....

so at what point am I allowed to not be considered a newby?

just askin'.

Good one soliver .....

I think we're always be newby, just cause there is so much to learn, and on top of that, the pro riders just come up everyday with something new....just making it too hard to follow.

You know what they say : "if it burns it's working" (so we're not shaving, but it still hurt when we fall :frog::saint: )

I've been at this for 5 years and I'm still asking questions, so while not a newby, still consider myself learning. Every time out. You guys are just on a steeper learning curve right now. Keep the passion and put the time in and the stuff you are stressing about now, you won't be thinking about a year from now.

Bob, it feels a bit weird to ask so many questions at times, but in this sport, the best part is to go out there and test your skills with everything you learn from the fine ppl here.

So I'm apologizing to all the ones think I'm annoying sometimes, asking all those questions, but please don't forget one VERY important thing : everybody was a newbie at one point, and we're all in it to learn and most of all - Have FUN :bouncy:

Quote:

Originally posted by BeamerBob I've been at this for 5 years and I'm still asking questions, so while not a newby, still consider myself learning. Every time out. You guys are just on a steeper learning curve right now. Keep the passion and put the time in and the stuff you are stressing about now, you won't be thinking about a year from now.

Thanks Bob, much appreciated

Ok, I'm supposed to be working now, so back to the salt mine!!!

I had people that nursed me along at the same stage and I've thanked them for it. There is nothing like having someone try to explain something to you that you don't understand and then hearing it again when you put it into practice and go "OH" that's what they meant. That never stops.

Quote:

I know that you'll get more controll with the handles, since it's like steering with 4 wheels, but woooww to the sore muscles after the session....

Don't forget, you can add a strop/pulley and quick release and use handles with a harness too which should alleviate the sore muscles. And I've seen plenty of folk happily able to steer one handed in that situation. Although I find I tend to sit more side-on when using handles and front on when using the bar. Spend a bit of time with both and see which you prefer...

This is me flying a 3.5 Reactor II stropped directly into my harness if you haven't seen the vid. Upturn at 44 seconds just for grins.

So Bob, if that was upturn, downturn will be almost the same, only with the kite closer to the ground ? or a bit higher then the ground, just enough to turn the kite face down with the direction of ride (kinda loop forward - clockwise) to go back ?
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And thanks again for the patient

A little off topic (okay - WAY off topic). Was digging through kite porn looking for a downturn and saw this nice 360, 720, 1080...what's next.....Click to 1:40.



I'm shocked I haven't been able to find one good example.....

Avin, my kite turn was clockwise and turned upward, thus an upturn. A downturn would've been a counterclockwise turn of the kite which would've pointed the kite down towards the ground, then in my new direction of travel. Downturn provides much more power and thus allows you to complete the turn faster and come out with more speed. Although it does put a twist in the lines and I wanted to come out of the turn ready to chase Donnie down. This was last fall before I was really comfortable with suicide gibes which is just a faster and bigger downwind turn.

"..suicide gibes which is just a faster and bigger downwind turn" <----- that is exactly what I ment !

So reading your respond make me realized I did it right, the line twist, a bigger boost & pull....yet like you said, it's all about feeling comfurtble doing it :smug:

Thank Bob

Found one:
At 6:25 of the long version of Popeyes video he does a nice one ending off his port side. The kite starts the shot off screen but quickly comes into frame and you can see the rotation and the kite turn and then the buggy turn complete

I thought OBE was odd but effective..........................:duh::duh:

I will answer the original question the best I can. To scrub high speed with a quad line (static line) kite I actually place the kite up high and sort of behind me while applying some break and keeping the kite at about 12oclock to 11 as I am moving which will slow you down a bit. You can also short blast power slide down or up wind with your buggy, not a turn, but just a short slide, short controlled power slides will scrub speed quickly. I can and have flown depowered kites, I kite surfed and even taught for a while, used PL's and others but I am personally not a fan. Too expensive, too big and for me, not as much control as you find with a simple med aspect ratio quad. and for me anyway, not as easy to scrub speed and at WWB there were a few times on Saturday that I was going much faster than I wanted to, with the pier and many objects coming up quickly! Not like the desert where you can just put the kite over head and slightly turn wheel up wind and gradually scrub speed. At wildwood and the park, you just dont have that kind of room. So again, place the kite over head and a bit behind you and you will start to slow down to a comfortable speed to start your slides....I hope that helps. I will be posting some video of turns and basic buggying eventually...

AviN, I posted a video on the forum last night of my session at Tybee Island, all the turns are "downturns" like I was talking about.

The kite loops down instead of up. I know my technique is still developing and leaves something to be desired cuz I am new, but this type of turn is what I was telling you about. I really like it and find it really pulls you through the turn.

Thanx Dodd for the braking advice too!