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Originally posted by SCREWYFITS So... I took the Firewall out for a test run at the local field, semi crapy wind... over all the kite feels solid and stable (thats ah +), the turning is slow and needs break input for a higher reaction to the turn request (ah +/- ?)... I guessed that it was going to be good for jumping, I was wrong (ah -)... not much lift at all (could be ah +), so I've come to the conclusion that it is going to take to the buggy well (like a horse to a carriage) based on it has a fair amount of pull... far from a race kite though, more of a cruz'n bug engine...The U-Turn handles did not wow me but seemed to do the job... the lines seemed well used so hard to say weather they are good, they do seem like they are of the stiff nature like most top manufactures... the waxy feeling is gone if it ever had it... But I'm under the impression that these don't normally come with this kite... So this is a partial review and kind of one dimensional based on just static flying in semi crap winds... I'll give a go on the bug and review again to complete this one...

yes, you're right its doesnt have much lift.

The climax line that i sent are old i mean old ... 3+ years and counting, been to NABX twice, and seen about 3 months of salt water abuse as well (never washed). i should also mention that they have also been in a thorn bush a few times too. it did have wax coating, but its gone now. I'll send a new set of lines with the Electra. =)

my next question is anything mr.kitesurf could improve on?

Alright boys and girls...

After a good solid three hours of overall flight, I've come to a conclusion... :sniff:
I tried this kite in low wind, high wind, smooth and gusty wind... and I could not find anything that made it fly up to my standards...
Overall the kite is very well constructed, great materials... I just believe the design or bridals need some tweaking...

On the buggy... The kite is very slow turning, the breaks are a must to get it to turn... it seems to fly to far forward in the window then doesn't have very much power when its there... I tried to work it back in the window (jibing the thing) I tried applying the breaks to slow it back in the window and the power is just not there on this kite... I noticed the tips like to fold in also, this makes me believe the bridal could help... while in the air (inflated) the kite has a crease in the tail end apx 5-6" up as if the breaks are applied, this is while no breaks are applied (slack)... this makes me believe the tweaking of the canopy design might help some...

I'd love to see this company do some tweaking and come back with a hot hot kite... I've heard the logo sucks and all that but I'm not sure changing that or removing it will make any flight characteristics change...:tumble:

I think, back to the drawing board with this one...

I rooting for Mr.Kitesurf to knock one out the park... we need more kite competition, I'm not real impressed with the top manufactures business practices lately, some more than others...

I'M STARTING U-TURN BUTANE TREAD IN THE REVIEW SECTION KEEP AN EYE OPEN :o OR TWO...

Its on to way to Texas to visit Dylanj423...
Hope you find some better qualities, I'd really like to see the manufacture stick around and be a big part of our sport...
Thanx Again, Screwy...

I think clint and I will put it on one of my flexi linesets. They seem to be the $#@% on other kites that have marginal linesets. hey is the manufacturer gonna want feedback from us?Individually or collectively?

I'm guessing individually... but I'll let Rip answer that...
The lines where fine, just aged... the Flexi's should do just fine also, you got the new Flexi handles :o they are soooo sweet...

indivdually would be great. just keep it under one post.

just got it in the mail, havent even opened it up, yet. The bag is nice & simple, and I am a fan of the color scheme of the bag, but thats all I can say for now. Thanks for getting it to me, I just need some wind, now...

Will keep you posted.

I will ship it out first thing next week to Barnes... maybe this weekend will bring some useable wind... Hopefully anyway. I have only had it out in 3-8 mph wind, gusty and inland. It held up really well given the conditions. Didnt fall out of the sky one time. I couldnt really get it to the edge of the window to see how it flew there, but hopefully I will get the chance this week sometime. Gustav should get some wind our way.

In looking over the kite, it seems pretty well built. The bridles are bright yellow, and didnt seem either skimpy or excessive. There arent any reinforcements where the bridal meets the canopy, however, so seems that it wouldnt be well suited to pushing the limits of the kite. Pretty high A/R, and pulled pretty well, though what I got was unusable in a boarding sense.

The internal ribs seem pretty heavily reinforced, I dont think I have seen another kite with so much ripstop inside.

If I am able to get this thing out in some better winds, I will post more info. Unfortunately this is all I am able to provide. For a 6m kite under $400, I think it flies pretty well, really well actually... but the logo and the name would probably keep me from actually forking over some cash for it. Petty??? Maybe, but its true.

Thanks for the opportunity to get the kite in my hands. As I said, unless you think I should just go ahead and get it to Barnes, I would like to wait until next week to ship it on.

give it one more week =)

okay with you barnes?

I got my hands on the 8m Firewall at SOBB. I could almost cut and paste Screwy's post on the smaller version.

Build Quality is good ! 1st off, I found the knots on the bidles large and grabby ?

Static flying it impressed me. Not too slow for an 8m. Once I started moving it started to disappoint. The smooth power flying staic didn't seem to translate into raw power when moving. Tip tuck and the 1st bow tie I have created in a long while. I think the grabby knots are partly to blame and could be overcome. Of the 3 newcomers Rip' sent down with me I think this one was the least impressive!

And YES, the Logo sucks !

Tried shooting Barnes a U2U, dont know if he got it... if you see this, shot me a U2U back. Tryin' to get this demo to you.

I'm sorry about my absence! I've been way to busy recently...but I'd love to snag the kite and have an excuse to go out and fly! Hopefully I'll have it in time for the Wildwood Buggy Bash and I can show it off to a lot more eyes.

i think Mr.? is catching on ... JN Kites just came out with Mr.Fanastic in their kite lineup.

I assume barnes got the kite?

I had the kite out this weekend at the Wildwood Buggy Bash. I didn't get to much time under it due to the lack of wind (And the Neo demo!) but when I did get it out, I had fun. Here are my thoughts:

Kite is super stable in the air, didn't need as much input as I expected out of a 'racekite'. I was able to park and ride pretty well, in the extremely short buggy ride I did get in. The low end if pretty solid, as Dom can attest to! This morning we get out to the beach with next to no wind, but as it picked up to ~5mph, I decided to give it a shot. It seemed to find some wind, and was giving me a bit of a workout and some skuds in next to no wind. I noticed a few bad things: True, it is slow for a race kite. Reverse launching kind of folded the kite half, and wasn't to responsive, but I blame wind on that part. Jumping was not the kites most favorite things. No lift, and the kite luffed every time I'd land my little pathetic jump. (Again, probably safe to blame the wind speed.)

Other then that, I think its a great kite, but I'd pull it out of the 'racekite' category and move it into a good beginner and buggy kite. No lift, slower turning, and stable.

But, good fun! I agree, I'd love to see Mr. Kitesurf step up and become a reliable brand name, as there are far to few at the top right now. Good friendly competition would be good for the sport!

I'm not sure that this was presented as a " racekite " ?
If so, I agree completely that it doesn't fit that catagory.
I think you are confusing THIS kite with the Cooper kite that's going around. The Cooper is a very nice , well behaved race type kite.
The Firewall is clearly an introduction to power sport type kite. Stable and responsive but not too lifty . Better for a buggy or beginer.

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Originally posted by barnes Other then that, I think its a great kite, but I'd pull it out of the 'racekite' category and move it into a good beginner and buggy kite. No lift, slower turning, and stable. But, good fun! I agree, I'd love to see Mr. Kitesurf step up and become a reliable brand name, as there are far to few at the top right now. Good friendly competition would be good for the sport!

i know they have signed up a Racer to use it in the curcuit but havent heard much about it. i personally wouldnt put it passed the advanced level, however i like the fact that they made it a higher AR and reduced any lift which is good for beginners.

however they are trying to market this as a "race kite" ... maybe we should bring them down to earth. :bisou:

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Originally posted by Bladerunner I'm not sure that this was presented as a " racekite " ? If so, I agree completely that it doesn't fit that catagory. I think you are confusing THIS kite with the Cooper kite that's going around. The Cooper is a very nice , well behaved race type kite. The Firewall is clearly an introduction to power sport type kite. Stable and responsive but not too lifty . Better for a buggy or beginer. Quote: Originally posted by barnes Other then that, I think its a great kite, but I'd pull it out of the 'racekite' category and move it into a good beginner and buggy kite. No lift, slower turning, and stable. But, good fun! I agree, I'd love to see Mr. Kitesurf step up and become a reliable brand name, as there are far to few at the top right now. Good friendly competition would be good for the sport!

Yeah, you would think I was confused about it being a race kite, but they are calling it a racing buggy kite! http://www.mrkitesurf.com/products_2.htm

Yes, if I were in Mr. Kitesurfs shoes, I'd drop the race kite title...you'll only get more sales if you consider it an intro kite rather then marketing it to only racers!

I'd love to see how the racer does in the circuit...

and I love the logo! Its much different from all the logos you see these days!

Thanks for letting me have a go this weekend barnes, the wind was crappy which was probably causing most of the luffing but the kite felt pretty nice apart from that! It made me miss handles... speaking of handles, they were pretty nice on it, i've always liked flexi's handles the best but these were good and hand a nice feel, how much are these kites? :D

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Originally posted by domdino Thanks for letting me have a go this weekend barnes, the wind was crappy which was probably causing most of the luffing but the kite felt pretty nice apart from that! It made me miss handles... speaking of handles, they were pretty nice on it, i've always liked flexi's handles the best but these were good and hand a nice feel, how much are these kites? :D

Well the Handles were U-Turns...They were nice too. Pansh only blisters my hands.

Not to sure on the prices of these guys...I didn't even look around for prices.

I'm sorry on the delay! I'm going to get the kite out to KiteDeamon this week!

Barnes have you sent it out yet?

Shipped it out last week. The leash I shipped to Montreal along with it made it no problem...should be there soon.

I find it difficult to write about the Mr.Kitesurf Firewall. It has been marketed as a race kite, I predictably flew it back to back with a race kite of known pedigree, a Jojo RM 3m. I was going to compare them together however the JOJO totally out classed the firewall so I have given up that avenue. I want to state that for the record this is based on my experiences with the firewall and is biased by the location I fly on and a cross shore gusty, lumpy day of wind. I often find myself in very odd turbulent wind I like the term rambunctious. I would not say the Firewall is a race kite as I did not find it particularly fast. I did find it however very temperamental and much more twitchy than the race kites I have had experience with. The Firewall seems to be a well made kite in materials and workmanship, the stuff bag is very simple but roomy enough to easily hold the kite.

First flight, I pulled the kite from the bag and set it up, I left the last used break settings figuring that would be a good starting point. I did not like the look of the logo and colours I was ready to forgive that assuming the kite flew well. I was disappointed. I fount this kite to be slow to turn and sluggish in its responses. I also found it to be quite prone to tip folding and with the very long bridles the tips snagged fairly often and were oddly resistant to shaking out. The power it produced was aggressive and unpredictable. Thinking perhaps the breaks are too tight, I proceeded to make a bunch of adjustments I lost some of the unpredictable nature but the power went as well. I also to my dismay managed a large number of bow ties. One on a hot launch about 2m from the ground the kite wasn't even fully inflated.

The firewall feels very much like the Pansh Ace with lower lift, perhaps better made and with a bridle system for friendly to tinkers. It is also more expensive that the Aces run as well. I own a Ace and dislike it a lot. I would likely dislike the firewall more as It has a larger price tag. If you like the Ace (mine is a first generation one and I think it is a bit off) perhaps you will like the firewall too. I don't. I would likely recommend the Ace, over the Firewall on the price tag alone. I would also go so far as to say if you were shopping in the price range of the Firewall that saving a bit more money and buying a Cooper would serve to be a better choice. Or save some cash and go for an Ace, and invest in better handles and lines. This is just my observations I am not knocking the pansh kites and really don't want to open that particular can of worms. I know that many people love the ace, and take a great deal of pleasure from it. There are also many that don't like them. I think that the Ace is suited to a particular style and not everybody fits it, nothing wrong with that. I feel the firewall tries to be too much, an all rounder, but just isn't. To my mind it just falls short.

Alex

Great review Kitedemon,

This pass program is great! It is working as it should ! I don't think Rip wants to hear less than the truth about the kites He has found a couple of winners and then this brand. I have a feeling He will keep working with Cooper and Wolfensturmer ( sp ) ??? I doubt He will want Mr.Kitesurfer ?
While I'm sure we all hoped for more from Mr.Kitesurfer it is starting to look like He is just a pretty face :singing: I think we all agree we don't even like the pretty face.

Blade,
I agree the pass the ___ is a wonderful thing!!! My hat is defiantly off to Rip and any other dealer that is will to put their products to the test. I actually asked him if he would rather I wrote nothing than a bad review. He responded "submit HONESTLY is the key ... if it sux ... WRITE IT." I am glad that you liked the review.

I'm not surprised Rip' encouraged an honest review.
While He is helping us out our honest opinions help Him!
I'm not sure of His plan from here but I expect He will continue to carry the Cooper and Wofensturmer ( sp ) but probably won't feel He can stand by Mr.Kitesurfer.

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Originally posted by kitedemon Blade, I agree the pass the ___ is a wonderful thing!!! My hat is defiantly off to Rip and any other dealer that is will to put their products to the test. I actually asked him if he would rather I wrote nothing than a bad review. He responded "submit HONESTLY is the key ... if it sux ... WRITE IT." I am glad that you liked the review.

Well this thing if coming my way next, I want to see how it handles.

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Originally posted by Bladerunner I'm not surprised Rip' encouraged an honest review. While He is helping us out our honest opinions help Him! I'm not sure of His plan from here but I expect He will continue to carry the Cooper and Wofensturmer ( sp ) but probably won't feel He can stand by Mr.Kitesurfer. Quote: Originally posted by kitedemon Blade, I agree the pass the ___ is a wonderful thing!!! My hat is defiantly off to Rip and any other dealer that is will to put their products to the test. I actually asked him if he would rather I wrote nothing than a bad review. He responded "submit HONESTLY is the key ... if it sux ... WRITE IT." I am glad that you liked the review.

more kites coming to be passed .... lots of new gear for 2009 season. cant say much right now, but i'll get more different companies to cough up demo gear. hehehe

yes, i'm carrying the Cooper Kite series, and also helping to design the graphics on the 2009 kite. :wee:

thank you to those that have tried / reviewed the Firewall, sorry if it was a bust.

I don't think you need to be TOO sorry Rip'.

If every kite you managed to find + Pass came back with glowing reviews it would be unbelievable. The fact that we can all agree that one is not going to make the cut while others do proves that the concept works !
I know I was glad to get my hands on all the great kites you found. I'm not sorry I got the chance to try the firewall. Even if it didn't impress me much.
Everyone wins with this thing !
Thanks!